Will unemployment benefits be extended?

[Benvolio]

So the path for everyone from struggling to well-to-do is simply to be a mass mainstream televised entertainer.

Is that what you're saying? The economy can support 40 or 50 million people doing this, yes?

Of course not. Gates and Zuckerman are not entertainers. Your claim that for someone to be rich, there must be many poor is clearly wrong. Those CEOs whom you are so fond of demonizing are getting a little bit from a lot of people, not unlike the entertainers.
Americans are not as poor as you are so fond of believing. We still have the highest median family income of any major nation. We have poverty because the democrats want more poverty and more and more.

 

[xbuzzerx]

Of course. Today's GOP, especially the Tea Party, are the most ruthless practitioners of relative morality (lifeboat ethics) and social Darwinism seen since there was such a thing as Darwinism. They don't believe that a country is actually a community of any sort, they see it as a system to be run so they can practice the law of the jungle without hindrance.

Well yeah reading this thread it's patently clear that some people have this perverse view of the world where corporations need to exist and need to be pumping out products and if the needs of human beings get in the way of that, they are evil obstructions. I'm still amazed at the perverse worldview that would prompt a notion of employees "squeezing the lifeblood" out of a corporation, with employees painted as some kind of sociopathic vampire and the corporation as the innocent damsel.

 

[xbuzzerx]

Of course not. Gates and Zuckerman are not entertainers. Your claim that for someone to be rich, there must be many poor is clearly wrong. Those CEOs whom you are so fond of demonizing are getting a little bit from a lot of people, not unlike the entertainers.
Americans are not as poor as you are so fond of believing. We still have the highest median family income of any major nation. We have poverty because the democrats want more poverty and more and more.

There is not a "finite pie" as far as the global economy is necessarily concerned. There is a finite pie within the revenues of a given corporation. So yes, for someone to pay himself $25 million dollars in pay, compensation and tax-deferred benefit packages, while other people working for the same corporate entity earn minimum wage, there is most definitely a relationship between how many millionaires (or more simply, decent-paying jobs in general) that you can have while maintaining that certain people need to be compensated that much more than the average employee.

According to Republican logic, if all of those minimum wage workers had gotten the correct level of education and made the right choices, all of them could be joint CEO's of that corporation with each of them making $25 million dollars a year. That would work, right? A corporation made up entirely of CEO's?

 

[chrisrobin]

As I said, globalization. It continues to be irrelevant whatever damage you feel unions did when even minimum wage cannot compete with what you can pay a worker in rural China or Indonesia or the Philippines.

Most traitorous, unpatriotic, greedy Americans will not work for 50 cents an hour.

 

[xbuzzerx]

Most traitorous, unpatriotic, greedy Americans will not work for 50 cents an hour.

I know, they want to "suck the lifeblood" out of the poor corporations. What do they expect, to be able to eat every month? Friggin entitlement mindset.

 

[chrisrobin]

.
New moniker of the RNC for all the lazy, blood-sucking unemployed:

Are there no workhouses? Are there no prisons?

 

[CowboyBob]

Most traitorous, unpatriotic, greedy Americans will not work for 50 cents an hour.

I know, they want to "suck the lifeblood" out of the poor corporations. What do they expect, to be able to eat every month? Friggin entitlement mindset.

And those unpatriotic Americans refuse to allow factories to pollute by regulating them.

It's unreal how they spit in the faces of their creators..... their job creators. Ignore the fact they're sons of millionaires who inherited their money and want even more to squirrel away in overseas banks.

Damn greedy, selfish poor families.

 

[frankfrank]

Add to ChrisRobin's post...I've updated it, in a way.



Comment doesn't relate at all to my link, but I'd be curious whether ANY of the six Republican Senators who voted for the extension are running for re-election in 2014? None, I'll guess.

Maybe an up-for-reelection Republican got really brave and did vote for it, even with the inevitability that the RNC will surely oppose him or her in the primaries with somebody who wants to "primary" that person.

 

[Benvolio]

There is not a "finite pie" as far as the global economy is necessarily concerned. There is a finite pie within the revenues of a given corporation. So yes, for someone to pay himself $25 million dollars in pay, compensation and tax-deferred benefit packages, while other people working for the same corporate entity earn minimum wage, there is most definitely a relationship between how many millionaires (or more simply, decent-paying jobs in general) that you can have while maintaining that certain people need to be compensated that much more than the average employee.
According to Republican logic, if all of those minimum wage workers had gotten the correct level of education and made the right choices, all of them could be joint CEO's of that corporation with each of them making $25 million dollars a year. That would work, right? A corporation made up entirely of CEO's?

Of course. The reason the people at the top make that is because the Boards of Directors think they are worth it to the company. They make decisions, which for good or bad, determine the success or failure if the company including the well being of the workers. Like most talents, it is not something which can be taught. The salary is in part determined by the perceived market value of the person -- what another company might pay to lure him away. Of course, some are overpaid, just as there are people at the bottom who are overpaid.
No one supposes that everyone can make an income in the millions, and certainly not in the socialist paradise of your fantasies.
Workers will always do better in an economy where labor is scarce and employers must compete for good workers. They will always do less well when here is a surplus of workers
In Maryland, 1600 people applied for 35 fast food jobs.http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2014/01/06/Shenandoah-Farms-1600-applicants

 

[xbuzzerx]

Of course. The reason the people at the top make that is because the Board of Directors think the are worth it to the company. They make decisions, which for good or bad, determine the success or failure if the company including the well being of the workers. Like most talents, it is not something which can be taught. The salary is in part determined by the perceived market value of the person -- what another company might pay to lure him away. Of course, some are overpaid, just as there are people at the bottom who are overpaid.
No one supposes that everyone can make an income in the millions, and certainly not in the socialist paradise of your fantasies.
Workers will always do better in an economy where labor is scarce and employers must compete for good workers. They will always do less well when here is a surplus of workers
In Maryland, 1600 people applied for 35 fast food jobs.http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2014/01/06/Shenandoah-Farms-1600-applicants

Benvolio is there any point at which you feel that the "appropriate pay" given to a small number of executives at the very top of a corporate structure cannot be justified under an expectation that hundreds or thousands of people below will wind up dependant on extended family or social services in order to survive after what they are being paid? Is there any point at which you would acknowledge that this is unsustainable, particularly in a worldview where you actively dislike and oppose social services or aid programs?

 

[CowboyBob]

Ben's link (which I only saw because of buzzer's quote) links breitbart.com., one of the worst violaters of the truth.

Benevolio, if you bothered to read your linked article you'd see they applied for jobs at the factory, not at a fast food restaurant.

 

[Benvolio]

As I said, globalization. It continues to be irrelevant whatever damage you feel unions did when even minimum wage cannot compete with what you can pay a worker in rural China or Indonesia or the Phillippines.

We lost most of our heavy industry to Germany and Japan. I don't see many Chinese, Indonesian or Philippine autos driving around.

 

[xbuzzerx]

We lost most of our heavy industry to Germany and Japan. I don't see many Chinese, Indonesian or Philippine autos driving around.

Are you referring to the auto industry? Because I can assure you, workers in Germany and Japan are not low-paid without safety regulations like in some third world country sweatshop. Also they have national healthcare. So are you now conceding that your hellbent opposition of all "socialism" has had a negative impact on American competitiveness?

Oh additionally--- the Japanese auto industries have always been appalled, even since the 80's, at how much American auto industry CEO's make in relation to their workers. Iacoca was a name uttered in sheer disgust by Japanese auto industry executives.

 

[Benvolio]

Ben's link (which I only saw because of buzzer's quote) links breitbart.com., one of the worst violaters of the truth.

Benevolio, if you bothered to read your linked article you'd see they applied for jobs at the factory, not at a fast food restaurant.

As always, you miss the point. We have far too many unemployed perusing too few jobs.

 

[Kulindahr]

Well yeah reading this thread it's patently clear that some people have this perverse view of the world where corporations need to exist and need to be pumping out products and if the needs of human beings get in the way of that, they are evil obstructions. I'm still amazed at the perverse worldview that would prompt a notion of employees "squeezing the lifeblood" out of a corporation, with employees painted as some kind of sociopathic vampire and the corporation as the innocent damsel.

There was a brief period when unions did that, mostly because they shared the arrogance of US corporations who thought they were the most important things in the world, unassailable in their superiority. And to some extent there are unions which still do that, but they bill customers directly, and charge enough that many people can't afford the most basic repairs to their homes.

The GOP alternative to letting employees have the least bit of power over their own destinies is to allow corporations to squeeze the lifeblood out of the Republic -- and indeed they regard assisting them in that as the reason the Republic exists.

 

[Kulindahr]

There is not a "finite pie" as far as the global economy is necessarily concerned. There is a finite pie within the revenues of a given corporation. So yes, for someone to pay himself $25 million dollars in pay, compensation and tax-deferred benefit packages, while other people working for the same corporate entity earn minimum wage, there is most definitely a relationship between how many millionaires (or more simply, decent-paying jobs in general) that you can have while maintaining that certain people need to be compensated that much more than the average employee.

According to Republican logic, if all of those minimum wage workers had gotten the correct level of education and made the right choices, all of them could be joint CEO's of that corporation with each of them making $25 million dollars a year. That would work, right? A corporation made up entirely of CEO's?

Excellent point! The profits of Walmart would easily cover giving their employees a $5/hour raise, with no need to raise prices on anything. But the plutocrats believe it all belongs to them, and the workers should bow down and honor them for whatever pittance the plutocrats condescend to part with.

Most traitorous, unpatriotic, greedy Americans will not work for 50 cents an hour.

No one in the world will work for that any more.

 

[Kulindahr]

Of course. The reason the people at the top make that is because the Boards of Directors think they are worth it to the company. They make decisions, which for good or bad, determine the success or failure if the company including the well being of the workers. Like most talents, it is not something which can be taught. The salary is in part determined by the perceived market value of the person -- what another company might pay to lure him away. Of course, some are overpaid, just as there are people at the bottom who are overpaid.
No one supposes that everyone can make an income in the millions, and certainly not in the socialist paradise of your fantasies.
Workers will always do better in an economy where labor is scarce and employers must compete for good workers. They will always do less well when here is a surplus of workers
In Maryland, 1600 people applied for 35 fast food jobs.http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2014/01/06/Shenandoah-Farms-1600-applicants

And you don't see that the board is doing the very same thing you deride unions for -- fixing income in a non-competitive fashion?

 

[xbuzzerx]

And you don't see that the board is doing the very same thing you deride unions for -- fixing income in a non-competitive fashion?

I'm sure he doesn't. I still can't even get him to acknowledge or respond to the contradiction where he says no pressure should be placed on employers from regulations, minimum wages or unions, yet he says it would be a good thing to force pressure on them to raise wages across the board by depriving them of a labor pool.

 

[chrisrobin]

Excellent point! The profits of Walmart would easily cover giving their employees a $5/hour raise, with no need to raise prices on anything. But the plutocrats believe it all belongs to them, and the workers should bow down and honor them for whatever pittance the plutocrats condescend to part with.



No one in the world will work for that any more.

I was exaggerating. The pay in China is quite low. Same for Korea. During the Seoul Olympics, we got to see the workhouses. Women making hardly anything, and living in the workhouse.

 

[Kulindahr]

As always, you miss the point. We have far too many unemployed perusing too few jobs.

And in your eyes, that makes them less than human. We get it.

- - - Updated - - -

I'm sure he doesn't. I still can't even get him to acknowledge or respond to the contradiction where he says no pressure should be placed on employers from regulations, minimum wages or unions, yet he says it would be a good thing to force pressure on them to raise wages across the board by depriving them of a labor pool.

That way he gets to keep brown people out of the country.