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Would you judge a friend by their political orientation or by how they treat you?

Jeimuzu

The Ire Brigade
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I don't judge at all. If I appreciate their company, I'll stick around with them. If there's an argument, I'll take the side of whoever is the most reasonable, not immediately backing up my friend. My friends accept this, and it means we can have some interesting debates nowadays.
 
You obviously value your friendship with this fellow. I think you need to either engage him in political discussion and argue your point of view or ask him not to discuss politics in your presence because it makes you feel uncomfortable. As to racial and sexual epithets, you need to just cut him off at the pass if it makes you uncomfortable. Just tell him, I'm gay and I'd appreciate it if you wouldn't use that word around me. The same goes with the N word.

If he's a true friend, he's going to take your feelings into consideration and at least not insult you to your face. If he doesn't stop, he's not a true friend and you really don't need him. In either event, I think you need to "strap on a pair" as someone else here says, and make your feelings known.
 
Once, during an interview...

There was a huge picture of Bush right next to the guy's head - it was actually competing with his head for my attention. It was even one of those promotional pictures with Bush looking up to a ray of light in the sky.

I could not think straight, and all I wanted to do was stand up and yell, "fuck you, and fuck George Bush too!"

But, even though, the guy was sort of an asshole and kept asking me personal questions, I still thought that he was probably a nice guy.

So I think that a person should just get something off their chest at the beginning of a relationship - but get it off in a jovial way, and not to seriously.
 
How they treat OTHER people.

I agree with this, too.

It's all about mutual RESPECT. Everyone can have their view on a subject as long as we all respect each other and each other's right to have a different opinion.

It's harder for me to want to be around someone or be their friend if they're harsh, insensitive, and disrespectful of others.

Next time your friend says one of those things that make you cringe, THAT's the time to say how you feel. And as jackoroe said, if he's truly your friend, he'll make the effort to be respectful of the differences in your views.

But definitely don't throw someone away without trying to fix it first. Good luck.
 
You used the word "hatred." That I would have no tollerence for! If he is your friend, yeah, you can disagree about some things, but, hatred? I can handle different political beliefs than my own as long as it doesn't involve hatred, bigotry, or homophobia. At that point, I have no use for that person. I have enough respect for myself, and others, not to surround myself with people who are filled with hate.

I guess part of it depends on what you mean by different political orientation. I can easily get along with someone who has different points of view on say, fiscal issues. I can even handle religious issues as long as they are respectful of mine.

Your friendship seems somewhat based on your silence and allowing him to say what he wants with no opposition. So, speak up, respectfully, and see what happens. If it is a friendship it will survive. If not, it wasn't one to start with, in my opinion.
 
I think you have to make a distinction between someone's political preferences and their prejudices. I'm going to talk about mostly about the former, rather than the latter, because the two are very different.

In my view, prejudice is based on ignorance and blame. Humans love to blame, it's in our nature and it's convenient. So when we select objects for that blame, we often select (or let others select) people or groups that are 'there' but that we don't 'know' resulting in stereotyping. And whether it's political/religious beliefs, or race, or sexual orientation, it's 'safe' to blame them because they're different (and therefore inferior) from you. And because we don't really know what/whom we're blaming (and often why) it's easy to continually reinforce that negative stereotype leading to hatred.

Fighting prejudice is easy and it isn’t. It’s easy because knowledge and truth are very good weapons against the ignorance prejudice is founded on. But it’s also tough because emotion trumps reason and if someone’s prejudices have hardened into hatred, then it doesn’t matter how ‘right’ you are the other’s hatred has blinded them to a tragic extent. But that doesn’t seem to be entirely the case here since you say he’s shown you qualities of loyalty, care, interest, not judging you, etc that are incompatible with true hatred.

So, I make the distinction between political preferences and prejudice because combating prejudice is one thing, but dealing with someone whose political convictions are founded on knowledge and preference is very different. Politics are very important to me, I’ve worked on many campaigns and for many years my boss and mentor was an elected official. But I still have friendships with people whose political opinions are very different from mine. Sometimes we'll fling phrases like 'fascist pig' or 'socialist nutjob' (I'm the 'fascist pig' btw) at one another but it's done in a teasing manner and neither of us takes (or is intended to take) genuine offense at the insults. At other times we'll have serious 'knock-down' arguments over some of the issues of the day to the point where we're glaring at each other and wondering how that smug SOB can be so obviously wrong? ;) At those times you just have to end up agreeing to disagree and know that if you bring up the subject again, there's going to be another heated exchange...

Now those arguments with close friends aren't fun and I'll often feel 'wrung' out afterwards from the emotional release alone. But even the 'worst' of those arguments has ultimately done me good because it forces me to take a look at my beliefs and see if I hold them out of convenience or conviction. And that kind of self-examination/evaluation is good for us in the long run, however uncomfortable or jarring they can be at the time. But while many political issues are important to me, they’re tiny compared the importance of genuine friends who are willing to agree to disagree on them to get by.

Too often, we go through life serenely in our own little ideological 'bubbles', reinforced by our friends who we agree with and unaffected by what others say, because we don't know those others and hence don't place much value on their opinions. It's one thing to hear ‘talking heads’ like Michael Moore/Rush Limbaugh say something you disagree with, but it takes on a whole different dimension when your friend comes out and says the same thing. It makes it much more 'personal'.

But ultimately, only you can find out whether your friend’s expressed views are based on convenience or conviction. And while you’re thinking about that, you should think about your own convictions as well. For example, you throw out the fact that your friend owns 120 guns but what’s interesting is that you provide no other context with that fact other than he’s a ‘right-winger’ who ‘hates gun laws’ (and, in a sense, who can blame him – if I owned 120 of anything that’s government-regulated (cars, dogs), I’d probably hate those regulations too! ;) ). So, if you haven’t already, ask yourself (or him, if you’re unsure) why he owns 120 guns. Is he a survivalist? A collector? A really avid hunter? :) But, most importantly, is he the kind of law-abiding citizen that gun laws are meant to protect? I’m betting the answer to the last is yes or your friendship would never have gotten started in the first place or lasted as long as it has.

So along with the others who’ve posted, I’d encourage you to be a bit more open about your own views when such subjects arise. I get the strong feeling that he’s a very confrontational personality, while your personality is more easy-going/diplomatic. But you don’t have to be confrontational in turn to push back a little. My own experience with those kinds of personalities is that they make outlandish statements in hopes of starting an argument.

But you don’t have to play the game by his rules. Instead, give him a little nudge and see whether it knocks him off his stride a bit. If it doesn’t, let him continue a bit and give him another one and if he keeps going, let him take himself to some weird extreme that you both can laugh at. What do I mean by a nudge? The next time he starts talking about ‘California liberals’ are screwing everything up, tell him you are a ‘California liberal’ and they can’t all be bad if he’s been friends with one for 16 years. See what he says… (and, if it’s not too much to ask, PM me or start a new thread, because I’m dying to find out!) :D

Friendships, once made, should never be lightly cast aside, especially when they’ve endured the years and times that yours have. Sometimes, while we’d rather not, we have to put conditions on friendship just as we do with love to remain healthy. You’ve been putting up with things that obviously upset you and you should take steps (carefully, especially in the beginning) to let him know. But also be careful you know and convey what exactly those things are. Changing boundaries in a relationship is one of the most delicate of operations and make sure that you’re respecting his convictions enough even if you don’t share them.

Finally, because shifting boundaries is so difficult, I wouldn’t agree with those who would indicate if he doesn’t adapt well to the new boundaries you’re trying to set means ‘never been your real friend’ anyway. Accept some responsibility in that you may have helped make this friendship a little too easy/comfortable for him in the past but the times are changing. He’s come through for you before, give him an honest chance to come through for you again. That may mean giving him some time or space to make some adjustments of his own, but (incurable optimist as I am) I think both you and he have real potential to grow as people because, and not in spite of, your differing views…

Regards,

Alan
 
A quick post-script. I too was kicking down Liberal Party lawn signs when I was 12. It's not something I'm terribly proud of now (not that I've changed my opinions on the Liberal Party all that much). But such acts were a part of my budding awareness of politics. So try not to hold it against your friend too much, ;) especially when considering the political apathy in so many younger people today...

Now I strongly object to the 30-something year olds who tear down signs, because they're old enough to know better... :)
 
Never discuss religion or politics. dont they say that anymore?

But in the days when such sayings were used, there was still segregation, women were expected to stay home and gays were so firmly nailed into the closet that the subject of their 'rights' was a non-issue... ;)

I understand where you're coming from, but sometimes not talking about some things not only doesn't help the situation, it makes it worse... And I think the OP's gone far beyond the point where a mutual ban on such subjects (even if it could be enforced) would remedy the situation...
 
A person's political affiliation does reflect on their character and what values are important to them, so I take it into account when making friends. Having said that, one of my closest friends is a Conservative, and I think a lot of his political opinions are dumb. But I know he's a genuinely good guy, so it really isnt much of a problem.

As for your friend, he sounds like a bigot, and that's not acceptable for any of my friends no matter what their politics or how nice they treat me.
 
How they treat me and other people is more important to me than poltical beliefs
 
I would absolutely judge someone by their political orientation. The company that you keep is indicative of your character, and I wouldn't want to be associated with an ignorant, hateful person. I don't care how fun or entertaining you are.
 
Politic and Religion are completly banned topics for my best friends and i. Since we start to argue and fight. And once it ended in not talking for a week and hurt feeling, so since then is banned, and no more problems.

So i never judge a friend by their political orientation.

PS i must say that in my country there's plenty different political parties to choose from.
 
I've got liberal friends. I don't think less of them because I disagree with their politics. What's important is that they know WHY they believe what they believe.
 
Well, as many have said, I don't judge my friends... I just ignore them if I don't like what they say. Unless they say something stupid, and then I argue with them until they either leave or stop saying the stupid shit.

But then, I like arguing (no! really? I'd never have guess that about you!) so if he could stay within the bounds of debate, I don't see that a difference of political or religious ideals would disqualify him from friendship. But if he can't stay within the rules of debate, or if he refuses to discuss things in terms of reason instead of polemics, I'll drop him. Differences of opinion I can handle, but differences of something as basic as being rational I can't live with.

A good friend is precious, but a person who says stupid shit isn't worth the energy it takes to kick him out of the house.
 
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