Wow, even when a guy tries to stick around, he still turns her into a single mom

[luckynumbah7]

Missed half a sentence and an amusing audio.

- Considering you're asking them on the internet I'm gonna go out on a limb and say you'd rather not irritate black friends, so why the same treatment online when there's works available that describe and explain systematic shit that you're trying not to do?

Fuck 'feelings', go for something more concrete.

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

Oh yes they do. That's how Cheeto got his constituency, the pitiful numbers that that entails. Well, that and the almighty dollar. I hear it particularly when passing as a straight white guy from guys of any race who feel a sort of kinship about casual misogyny and want to toss it around as part of a 'bonding experience'. While I've heard the same concept from black guys, it hasn't yet harkened back to the voting era (just the sentiment, but oh, have I heard that sentiment waxed poetic). I suspect it doesn't go back to the voting era on your end because you not having a vote either is still a sore point and some people don't like it when y'can point to the same "They're just too stupid cuz -insert ludicrousness here-" reasoning processes for screwing someone over. A low cunning maneuver for not giving someone an opening to argue the point, but many guys cling to the "They're not bright nor sane enough" concept quite firmly without ever bringing up historical specifics.

Unfortunately even people on the right side of history tend to include willful barnacle clingers who voted right for the wrong reasons, not to mention the generally-high leftover problematic imprinting in the everyday person. Which is undoubtably considerably higher than everyone thinks it is, particularly when an individual considers their own attitudes and actions. Which people rarely seem to do because they think disliking an -ism as a concept is fighting against the same -ism where the rubber meets the road. It isn't and it's a useless and harmful fallacy. I find people tend to stop at the easy work and don't go farther unless it becomes a moving personal matter in some form.

There was an interesting article about it the other day, see if I can dig it up. It also included such scintillating info as "echo chambers of 'because....reasons!' do not have checks and balances" but I figure, might as well start with the basics. It does discuss it in a political manner via the last election but it also describes the hazards of fundamentalist thought processes pretty accurately, the only caveat I'd give is to expand it since people can have fundamentalist processes in one genre and not in a genre closer-to-home.

https://www.rawstory.com/2017/06/fu...al-christian-white-america-will-never-change/

that middle paragraph almost gave me an orgasm. why aren't you a published author?

 

[peeonme]

You asked about the difference in how the statistics are created between black and asian and I told you how to find the information without demanding someone else personally teach you 'how they really feel inside'. You know, in your previous threads where you were demanding people do the work for you? So either do the history and cultural intersectional work yourself so's you know how this shit propagates or don't, but don't expect people to spoon feed you the answers on demand. They already did that through literature.

Besides, no one asked that anyone else personally understand all those mushy feelings. People just want others to quit the concepts/actions that treat people badly. And you can't do that unless you know what they are first. Which involves reading, unless you have a personal black friend who feels like baring their life and soul to pointed questions. Considering you're asking them on the internet I'm gonna go out on a limb and say you'd rather not irritate black friends, so why the same treatment online.

It's a rhetorical question when asking why there is a difference in the numbers between black and Asian single mothers.
Obviously, all too obviously, the conception rate is higher, coupled with a higher death rate by murder and a higher incarceration rate
in the black community.

It's not as complicated as some would make it seem with putting 10 pounds of shit in to a five pound box in their posts.
You think that making a rather simple issue complex and then pointing at the "white boys" those damned dirty white boys that you seem smart, clever.
I am sure that you could discuss simple math and stretch 2plus 2 equals 4 in to at least two paragraphs. It does not make you look intelligent... only confused.

 

[Cormac135]

Bringing in the big guns.

It's pretty disheartening to see some of the nicer people here trying to tear strips out of each other, shame on you Zombie.

 

[luckynumbah7]

It's a rhetorical question when asking why there is a difference in the numbers between black and Asian single mothers.

That's not an actual rhetorical question because you don't have a point to be made. Considering some of your post's contents, racism and cultural differences when they intersect with the other -isms like misogyny and homophobia in combination are not nearly as, ahem, 'black and white' on the single parent wear-a-condom-dammit issues as you believe them to be. And they sure as hell aren't simple or you would've gotten the point by now. Others experiences have more to say on the topic than your feelings about something you're fundamentally unfamiliar with. The best anybody gets when they've no experience is reading/listening to others others while not arguing that their experiences are all in their head, or made up, or used as 'playing a card', or you complaining yet again that you want to feel at the expense of someone else's sanity - you can only repeat things so many times, after all, while having another demand your experiences with a finger wags under your nose. When you have a feeling without the personal experience, shut up and take a back seat. It'll save you both time and embarrassment. Actual learning goes faster that way too.

 

[luckynumbah7]

-And you really don't want me to bring up your sexist/misogynistic views on plan B and abortion in general. Family planning and contraception isn't only the man's job. He's (or she's, as the case may be) responsible for their bits and their reproductive capabilities, no one else's. Intersectional analysis - it's a thing. I cannot conceive of why you think it's a simple issue when most of the population has more than one minority status to deal with. At least by my count, there's not a whole lot of middle class able-bodied white guys floating around, what with the rapid class distinction at the very least. But a lot of people sure like to imagine they're temporarily inconvenienced members of the upper echelon don't they.

 

[Cormac135]

Now it's just a pissing contest.

 

[luckynumbah7]

Now it's just a pissing contest.

I'm not the one who claimed condoms were The Answer while being unashamed of my beliefs that once you're preggers you should stay that way. Tho that latter addition of his beliefs was in an abortion thread in....I believe it was the Politics forum. I have an obscenely long memory. Since the thread turned from Deadbeat Dad insinuations to a "why do so many women have kids?!" question it fits right in. I trust you can look up the longevity of attacks on uterus specific family planning concerning the' U.S. of Shame' yourself, though for the life of me I can't remember what country you're in so no idea of the particulars of where you're at.*

*Not that I'd have time to look them up if I did, I'm due to cart salt to Fallen London and make bank so I can afford to help Evil Santa.

 

[Cormac135]

I'm not the one who claimed condoms were The Answer while being unashamed of my beliefs that once you're preggers you should stay that way. Tho that latter addition of his beliefs was in an abortion thread in....I believe it was the Politics forum. I have an obscenely long memory.

Not so long that you've forgotten the rule about not dragging arguments over from other threads, still it's a slow night so have at it.

 

[luckynumbah7]

Not so long that you've forgotten the rule about not dragging arguments over from other threads, still it's a slow night so have at it.

It isn't an argument as I brought no arguments here. I described his belief system, and politics isn't the only forum he's expressed it in; it's just the most recent one I'm familiar with. Well, besides this one. And he used the belief system here because he's flatly advocating condoms are the answer. It's a belief system that's also pertinent when he's trying to beg the question of single mothers while leaving out most of the actual information on what family planning and sexist discrimination entails in the hopes that he can whittle it down to 'wear a condom'. A deliberate lack of information and outright dismissal of others' statements to the inclusion of different minority viewpoints on their own reproduction issues when 'begging the question' of black vs asian is still a statement of personal beliefs. And he's made those very clear here with no help from me.

I'm not the one who brought up condoms and family planning after all. He brought it up first, you can check for yourself. If he didn't want to discuss it he shouldn't have brought it up for discussion in the first place trying to 'beg a question'.

 

[luckynumbah7]

Shorter version is he stated his views, I replied. Now, I could've asked him why he's fixated on condoms as the means to an end but I already know the answer is because he dislikes the other options. If he didn't he wouldn't keep shooting them down when people point out that sexism and misogyny matter when discussing race-based statistics. Which I explained in multiple ways in several posts.

I saw no reason to let him limit the boundaries of family planning to condoms. Again, if he didn't want it brought up perhaps he shouldn't have done it here himself first.

Tho if my posts get removed it's only fair that his reproduction-themed posts also get removed. They are the same topic that I didn't bring up in the first place after all.

 

[Cormac135]

Ad nauseam.

 

[luckynumbah7]

Ad nauseam.

Not exactly, no. I don't deliberately posit questions while leaving out vital information so a specific result can be inferred. I also reply to what's actually said. I won't wait for an apology for statement that my posts be removed for replying to the same information Peeonme posted in the first place in this thread on the first page. Just because you don't want to follow a heated discussion isn't much of a reason to claim the thread is down to random sniping. I wouldn't say it's random at all.

"It has been suggested that the use of condoms and birth control pills (both just to be safe) would stop (in most cases) these pregnancies.".

I'm surprised he typed that as his severe dislike of plan B has the same affect that 'generic' birth control does. You'll rarely see an american equate the two specifically in conversation (birth control and that Evol Plan B), it has to do largely with religious values and not the science behind the actual medication. But when one is actively ignored/attacked the other is attacked by default, as it is the same medication. It is literally, simply speaking, just a higher dose of birth control meds, does the same job in the same manner with the same result.

If he wants a conversation on the statistics of one set of women vs another while actively ignoring the multiple intersections and what goes on in the real world, I ain't going to give it to him.

 

[luckynumbah7]

Here, I'll make it shorter for the people in the back;

It's two-faced behavior to 'make a hypothesis' about unwed mother's birth rates by racial statistics while taking nothing of racial or other minority experiences that affect how the 'have a baby' outcomes play out into consideration. When your actual opinions are helping cause the statistics you complain about in the first place there's a glaring hole where enlightenment should be.

That's the shortest I can condense it to unless you wanna go with "He needs to stop being a particular kind of ass about this. And if he can't, ya'll need to stop whinging when he brings it up in the first place." You would not believe the amount of shit I let slide most of the time, my responses are actually on 'rotation' (here as also in real life) because there's too much crap to point out that people actively strive not to learn, so rotation it is, if only for my own sanity, mandatory.

 

[luckynumbah7]

It's not like I dislike him in particular, quite the contrary.

I just loath willful ignorance. It's why I tried to actually answer his race-based question with, as an example, how misogyny affects racism, but then he responded that it was meant to be a rhetorical question; ie, not a honest question at all but a 'begging the question' since he included no variation (not even cultural expectations) and that he didn't expect an actual response or a way to examine more information in the light of day - what he seems to be looking for is nothing less than an "You're absolutely right."

Whereas I am not looking for a "You're right!", it's not an answer I ever expect to receive. I'm merely hoping he cracks a book when he realizes what he doesn't know and, by way of a happy coincidence, shoves a sock in it via Too Busy Reading on this particular subject for a while.

 

[peeonme]

It's not like I dislike him in particular, quite the contrary.

I just loath willful ignorance. It's why I tried to actually answer his race-based question with, as an example, how misogyny affects racism, but then he responded that it was meant to be a rhetorical question; ie, not a honest question at all but a 'begging the question' since he included no variation (not even cultural expectations) and that he didn't expect an actual response or a way to examine more information in the light of day - what he seems to be looking for is nothing less than an "You're absolutely right."

Whereas I am not looking for a "You're right!", it's not an answer I ever expect to receive. I'm merely hoping he cracks a book when he realizes what he doesn't know and, by way of a happy coincidence, shoves a sock in it via Too Busy Reading on this particular subject for a while.

Self loathing is not the answer. Just for your information, I have "cracked" many books, you will find that the answers to the problems encountered by minorities in these books largely depend upon who wrote the book.
Now, pour some Pepto Bismal on your key board, it has a bad case of the shits.
Many of life's troubles are self inflicted, no doubt life and America has been unfair to minorities, but, there comes a time to put on your big boy pants and take some responsibility for your actions.

 

[zombiekiller]

That's not an actual rhetorical question because you don't have a point to be made. Considering some of your post's contents, racism and cultural differences when they intersect with the other -isms like misogyny and homophobia in combination are not nearly as, ahem, 'black and white' on the single parent wear-a-condom-dammit issues as you believe them to be. And they sure as hell aren't simple or you would've gotten the point by now. Others experiences have more to say on the topic than your feelings about something you're fundamentally unfamiliar with. The best anybody gets when they've no experience is reading/listening to others others while not arguing that their experiences are all in their head, or made up, or used as 'playing a card', or you complaining yet again that you want to feel at the expense of someone else's sanity - you can only repeat things so many times, after all, while having another demand your experiences with a finger wags under your nose. When you have a feeling without the personal experience, shut up and take a back seat. It'll save you both time and embarrassment. Actual learning goes faster that way too.

All of this word salad and you managed to dodge his main point. Good job.

You majored in the humanities?