On Topic Discussion 2019 Coronavirus (COVID-19/SARS-CoV-2)

[Kulindahr]

I apologize if this is way too much detail but I've mentioned "S" and "N" proteins but never really delved into the detail about why these are important to testing for antigen and for triggering immune responses in vaccines.

S and N Proteins: In the the upper left hand corner of the illustration above is a picture of the general structure of SARS-CoV-2 (labeled "a"). Notice that on the outside of the virus, there's a broccoli-shaped "S" protein and on the inside there's a twisting "N" protein.

Antigen Testing: The antigen tests look for these proteins. If the test strip reacts, then the sample contains these proteins.

Antibody Testing: In protein subunit and mRNA vaccines, proteins similar to the "S" spike are used to trigger your body to make anti-S antibodies.

In antibody tests, if you have antibodies to the "N" protein, you've had a past infection with COVID-19 because most of the modern vaccines introduce the "S" protein but not the "N" protein. Your body would only make anti-N antibodies if you had actually been exposed to the virus.

Why is the "S" protein important in vaccine-making? Because this spike protein is what the virus uses to infect cells in the lungs and on the lining of blood vessels. On the bottom of the illustration, you can see that the "S" spike attaches to an ACE2 receptor on the outside of cells and this is how it gets into the cell to infect it.

How do protein subunit vaccines work? What the protein subunit vaccines contain is proteins that are in the RBD section of the spike protein (in the upper right hand corner of the illustration). The RBD section is where the spike "sticks" onto the ACE2 receptor.

When your body sees the RBD proteins from the vaccine, it starts making antibodies for that protein.

Antibodies are like glue, so if you have antibodies that can stick on to the RBD part of the spike, it cannot infect the cells.

Why do vaccinated people get mild symptoms but unvaccinated people are more likely to get severe illness? Without the "S" protein, SARS-CoV-2 would be just another coronavirus and would cause a "common cold". It's that "S" protein that makes the virus more dangerous.

The vaccines trigger your body to make antibodies that stick onto the "S" protein which keeps it from infecting the lungs and blood vessels. Without the lung infection and the blood clotting from the effects on the lining of the blood vessels, you're less likely to get severe illness after being vaccinated.

So the endosome is like its own little nucleus-like structure that lets the virus just hang out in the cell?

 

[belamyi]

Oh, don't say "subunit"! The anti-vaxxers will say that's code for a(nother) microchip! Call it a "protein fragment" and describe the vaccine as like a fragmentation grenade -- that should being someof the "tough guys" around because it sounds macho.

Does that sound then like it would screw them "fragmenting" their insides?

And doesn't "subunit" sound like some A-team or

or, on the contrary, would be more on the side of "underpar"?

 

[KaraBulut]

Oh, I hope so! It would be nice to get our vaccine rate to 85%.

The manufacturers making the protein subunit vaccines are saying they can adjust the protein quickly in the event the virus mutates its "S" spike structure. That might be a good option in the future as these new variants arise.

If the protein subunit vaccines prove to produce a high antibody levels over the long term, it might also be an option for a booster since one of the reasons people hesitated to get the mRNA boosters is that they had flu-like symptoms for a day or two after their booster. The protein subunit vaccines don't seem to have as many flu-like side effects.

Oh, don't say "subunit"! The anti-vaxxers will say that's code for a(nother) microchip! Call it a "protein fragment" and describe the vaccine as like a fragmentation grenade -- that should being someof the "tough guys" around because it sounds macho.

"I am subunit alpha two three zero. You will be assimilated".

So the endosome is like its own little nucleus-like structure that lets the virus just hang out in the cell?

Oh, the virus doesn't hang. Inside that round viral capsule is an mRNA payload. When the virus creates an endosome to get inside the cell, the cell doesn't immediate recognize it as foreign. At this point, it's a Trojan Horse. The virus then finds its way to the part of the cell that is designed to make more cells. That's when it ejects the mRNA payload which coverts the cell into a virus factory to make more SARS-CoV-2.

Unfortunately, the immune system only has one way to stop the hijacked cell that is a virus factory: kill it. In some cases, the infected cell kills itself.

This is where things can go bad and it explains why so many people who get very sick from COVID-19 don't end up in the hospital for a couple of weeks. If the infection isn't under control, the immune system begins throwing everything at the infected cells which is what triggers the autoimmune cascade... which is what can ultimately kill the patient.


People who have been trained in virology were really puzzled by the whole anti-vaxxer thing about "having DNA injected into me" and "it's genetic poisoning!". A virus works by injecting RNA or DNA into your cells which kills them.

Given the choice of getting a strand of mRNA from a vaccine to produce spike protein for a couple of days versus getting infected with the virus which comes with a buttload of mRNA that will turn my cells into a SARS-CoV-2 factory, I'd take the vaccine option.

 

[smokeshadow]

this won't change any minds

https://theweek.com/news/1011498/ne...tin-is-clinically-useful-in-treating-covid-19

 

[eddielee]

I understand that there is an increase in covid cases in Europe related, apparently, to a more contagious Omicron variant. No one is ringing an alarm yet, but it's hard not to be worried.

 

[KaraBulut]

this won't change any minds

https://theweek.com/news/1011498/ne...tin-is-clinically-useful-in-treating-covid-19

It's Brazilian study of about 1,400 patients that confirms what previous studies have shown- that ivermectin, given by itself, doesn't have any therapeutic benefit in COVID-19.

Fortunately, the ivermectin discussion is becoming less relevant because a large majority of the US population has either received the vaccine or had COVID-19 (or both, in some cases).

At this point, what we're working toward is a situation where you go to a pharmacy or an urgent care, they test you and if you test positive, they send you home with a week-long course of an oral anti-viral medication. The studies on PAXLOVID, which is Pfizer's antiviral, are showing it to be very effective and the proposed dosing is 2 pills a day for 5 days.

No word on whether PAXLOVID tastes as horrible as ivermectin paste.

I understand that there is an increase in covid cases in Europe related, apparently, to a more contagious Omicron variant. No one is ringing an alarm yet, but it's hard not to be worried.

Scroll up to post #3904 for a series of posts with a discussion of what is going on in Europe. These peaks are going to happen periodically. It's going to be the same pattern- people who were vaccinated are going to either have mild to medium cases (or are not going to know they are infected); unvaccinated people are going to have a rougher time of it. This pattern seems to be repeating itself in country after country.

Keep in mind that a case is just someone who had a positive test. What we're watching more now is hospitalizations, ICU hospitalizations and how many patients are on ventilators. Cases may surge periodically but as long as ICU hospitalizations and ventilator patients don't surge, there's less reason for concern unless you're unvaccinated or you have a condition that weakens your immune system. If you do have a surge in your area, then increase your precautions when in public.

 

[cityboy-stl]

One of the big hospitals here reported today that for the first time in two years, they have no admitted Covid patients. That's remarkable. Maybe things are starting to get better?

I'm still not taking my mask off though, in case it is just the calm before the next variant storm. I went grocery shopping this afternoon and around two-thirds of the customers were not masked. Many people are not masking now and it scares me.

 

[KaraBulut]

One of the big hospitals here reported today that for the first time in two years, they have no admitted Covid patients. That's remarkable. Maybe things are starting to get better?

It is getting better. At the most conservative interpretation, the omicron surge is over and we are in a period where there doesn't seem to be another variant of concern on the horizon.

This is the nationwide hospital census numbers on Saturday for the past 7 weeks:

US Hospital COVID-19 Inpatient Census for Saturday:

• 05-Feb: 15,510
• 12-Feb: 10,936
• 19-Feb: 9,523
• 26-Feb: 5,390
• 05-Mar: 3,661
• 12-Mar: 2,642
• 19-Mar: 2,121

...I'm still not taking my mask off though, in case it is just the calm before the next variant storm. I went grocery shopping this afternoon and around two-thirds of the customers were not masked. Many people are not masking now and it scares me.

They're being a bit premature with the masks. BA.2 is still circulating and we are reaching the point where it has been 4 to 5 months since the last boosters. The grocery stores don't worry me as much as the fact that sporting events, nightclubs and large conventions are resuming before omicron has completely run its course.

The good news is that blood bank testing is showing that >90% of donors have antibodies to COVID-19, so there is a large adult population that has been exposed to the virus or has been vaccinated.

We still have those kids under 5 that aren't eligible for vaccines, so they are the remaining reservoir for infection.

 

[Kulindahr]

One of the big hospitals here reported today that for the first time in two years, they have no admitted Covid patients. That's remarkable. Maybe things are starting to get better?

I'm still not taking my mask off though, in case it is just the calm before the next variant storm. I went grocery shopping this afternoon and around two-thirds of the customers were not masked. Many people are not masking now and it scares me.

It's not that high here, but the numbers of unmasked make me nervous.

 

[belamyi]

https://www.rtve.es/noticias/20220321/mapa-mundial-del-coronavirus/1998143.shtml

 

[ruggerladirish]

Not commenting on the war at all.

But we've taken in 8000 from Ukraine in 2 weeks. Huge numbers by our standards.

But transpires very few are vaxxed. And even lower numbers are boosted


Here we go again

 

[cityboy-stl]

^ I can see this becoming a real problem as more and more refugees disperse throughout the world. I hope governments are considering this. I have not heard anything yet about the U.S., but I hope these refugees where ever they end up, for both their health and safely and ours, will be given vaccines. Given vaccines for all diseases, not just Covid. And I have to say it, because it's how I feel, vaccinated voluntarily, by force if necessary, or deported.

 

[belamyi]

- - - Updated - - -

I have been thinking for a couple of weeks how long it would take for people to start with that shit.

Hope same applies to all tourists and voyagers.

 

[belamyi]

Consider that, in the event of an American Civil war, it would not be precisely the filthy unvaccinated rednecks the ones to go around seeking a refuge overborders and overseas.

 

[KaraBulut]

Not commenting on the war at all.

But we've taken in 8000 from Ukraine in 2 weeks. Huge numbers by our standards.

But transpires very few are vaxxed. And even lower numbers are boosted

Here we go again

Vaccination in the former Warsaw Pact countries has been low.

• Ukraine: fully vaccinated 35%, boosted - 1.7%
• Moldova: fully vaccinated 40%, boosted - 3%
• Romania: fully vaccinated 42%, boosted - unknown
• Poland: fully vaccinated- 59%, boosted 30%
• Slovakia: fully vaccinated- 59%, boosted 32%
• Hungary: fully vaccinated- 66%, boosted 42%

There seems to be two factors at work:

1. There's been a degree of vaccine hesitancy in some of the countries bordering Russia. There have been reports that in rural areas, locals are traveling to surrounding villages for fear that someone in their home village will see them getting the vaccine.
2. Vaccine availability has been an issue. Many of the countries in eastern Europe used Sinovac, Sputnik V, AstraZeneca, J&J and other vaccines that didn't require super-cold refrigeration. The refrigeration requirements of the mRNA vaccines has been a big issue and has limited their usage until recently. There's an effort underway to vaccine all Ukrainian refugees who have not been vaccinated. Unfortunately, some countries like Poland are offering adults J&J and AstraZeneca. Children under age 18 are offered mRNA vaccines.

I suspect that by the time the refugees arrive in Ireland, they will have been medically screened and offered COVID-19 vaccination.

UNESCO and WHO are working with the country of entry for the refugees to get them vaccinated for COVID and any other disease where they may have a deficiency. One problem is that many of the refugees don't have access to their medical records, and in some cases, unaccompanied minors are fleeing Ukraine with little or no documentation. There is going to be a need to address all communicable diseases on the short term and to immunize them against communicable diseases.

It's not hard to see why communicable diseases may be an issue, considering that many of the refugees are being house in congregate settings like gymnasiums and community centers:

There's not really a way to avoid the political issues surrounding vaccination. The far right parties across the globe have pushed conspiracy theories and QAnon paranoia has also gone global. It's something that we're going to have to deal with and we need to investigate the sources of the disinformation.

BBC and DW have done stories in the past few months about anti-vax and anti-mask sentiment in Poland. There are social media posts and billboards that are appearing in Poland that suggest that the COVID-19 vaccines cause infertility- basically the same far right conspiracy crap that the US and other countries have been getting.

Poland’s vaccine skeptics create a political headache [Politico.eu - Aug 2021]

Something that I noticed yesterday was that, in Poland, there was a large fundraiser held in a stadium to raise money for Ukrainian refugees. While it's wonderful that there has been such a humanitarian outpouring, while watching the video from the event, I couldn't help but notice the crowded conditions, the inconsistency in masking, all the while knowing that only 30% of Poles are boosted.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C50-cZTHrw0

 

[Kulindahr]

^ I can see this becoming a real problem as more and more refugees disperse throughout the world. I hope governments are considering this. I have not heard anything yet about the U.S., but I hope these refugees where ever they end up, for both their health and safely and ours, will be given vaccines. Given vaccines for all diseases, not just Covid. And I have to say it, because it's how I feel, vaccinated voluntarily, by force if necessary, or deported.

I'm feeling the same way. Personally I'd love to see a law in the U.S. that you can't cross a state line unless you're vaccinated, though I know there's no way to implement or enforce such a thing.

- - - Updated - - -

I have been thinking for a couple of weeks how long it would take for people to start with that shit.

Hope same applies to all tourists and voyagers.

No vaccine, no travel.

 

[belamyi]

^ See what I was talking about: it's about vaccines

 

[KaraBulut]

Week ending 19-Mar-2022:

Global COVID-19 Weekly Mortality/Morbidity

• Global Cases reported: 470,168,244 (up from 456,908,767 / 2.9%) - *‬*13,259,477 new cases this week
• Global Deaths: 6,076,686 (up from 6,041,077) - **35,609 people died this week

US COVID-19 Weekly Mortality/Morbidity

• Cases reported in the US - 79,732,834 (up from 79,517,492 / 0.3%), 215,342 new cases, 1.6% of world's new cases were in the US
• Deaths reported in the US - 971,135 deaths, 3,583 deaths this week , 10.0% of the world's reported deaths this week were in the US
• Hospitalizations reported in the US - 22,815 new hospitalizations (up from 8,990 last week) - 4,579,519 Americans have been hospitalized for COVID-19 since Jan, 2020

US Vaccination Weekly Stats

• Approx number of US doses distributed - 698,418,375 (up from 695,483,935 / +2,934,440) - 80.0% US doses have been administered
  
  Total US residents vaccinated
• 1st dose: - 254,984,673 (up from 254,551,489 / +433,184) - 77.3% of US population
• 2nd dose: - 217,060,180 (up from 216,647,869 / +412,311) - 65.8% of US population
• 3rd dose: - 96,617,421 (up from 95,973,403 / +644,018) - 29.3% of US population
  
  US residents over age 5 vaccinated
• 1st dose: - 254,897,966 (up from 254,468,547 / +429,419) - 81.6% of US population > 5 yo
• 2nd dose: - 217,028,058 (up from 216,618,914 / +409,144) - 69.5% of US population > 5 yo
  
  US residents over age 12 vaccinated
• 1st dose: - 245,128,387 (up from / +244,777,734) - 86.5% of US population > 12 yo
• 2nd dose: - 209,223,063 (up from / +208,921,072) - 73.8% of US population > 12 yo
• 3rd dose: - 96,596,512 (up from / +95,954,173) - 46.2% of US population > 12 yo
  
  US residents over age 65 vaccinated
• 1st dose: - 56,214,657 (up from 56,177,238 / +37,419) - 95.0% of US population >65 yo
• 2nd dose: - 48,729,696 (up from 48,698,587 / +31,109) - 88.9% of US population >65 yo
• 3rd dose: - 32,634,225 (up from 32,523,061 / +111,164) - 67.0% of US population >65 yo

Coronavirus weekly cases/deaths in active countries (preference to countries with JUB members):

• South Korea: 9,373,646 (up from 6,556,453 / +2,817,193 / 43.0%) - 12,428 deaths (+2,033) - avg daily: cases (+402,456) / deaths (+290)
• Germany: 18,730,442 (up from 17,202,756 / +1,527,686 / 8.9%) - 126,920 deaths (+1,343) - avg daily: cases (+218,241) / deaths (+192)
• France: 24,323,239 (up from 23,565,274 / +757,965 / 3.2%) - 141,961 deaths (+907) - avg daily: cases (+108,281) / deaths (+130)
  [*]UK: 20,243,940 (up from 19,673,347 / +570,593 / 2.9%) - 164,099 deaths (+782) - avg daily: cases (+81,513) / deaths (+112)
• Italy: 13,861,743 (up from 13,323,179 / +538,564 / 4.0%) - 157,785 deaths (+1,003) - avg daily: cases (+76,938) / deaths (+143)
• Netherlands: 7,686,593 (up from 7,290,470 / +396,123 / 5.4%) - 22,407 deaths (+94) - avg daily: cases (+56,589) / deaths (+13)
• Japan: 6,100,331 (up from 5,721,845 / +378,486 / 6.6%) - 27,122 deaths (+1,054) - avg daily: cases (+54,069) / deaths (+151)
• Australia: 3,903,113 (up from 3,596,466 / +306,647 / 8.5%) - 5,730 deaths (+144) - avg daily: cases (+43,807) / deaths (+21)
• Russia: 17,327,694 (up from 17,040,721 / +286,973 / 1.7%) - 357,234 deaths (+4,180) - avg daily: cases (+40,996) / deaths (+597)
• Brazil: 29,624,435 (up from 29,361,024 / +263,411 / 0.9%) - 657,389 deaths (+2,155) - avg daily: cases (+37,630) / deaths (+308)
  [*]US: 79,732,834 (up from 79,517,492 / +215,342 / 0.3%) - 971,135 deaths (+3,583) - avg daily: cases (+30,763) / deaths (+512)
• Switzerland: 3,268,953 (up from 3,072,758 / +196,195 / 6.4%) - 13,423 deaths (+157) - avg daily: cases (+28,028) / deaths (+22)
• Turkey: 14,693,917 (up from 14,534,239 / +159,678 / 1.1%) - 97,267 deaths (+918) - avg daily: cases (+22,811) / deaths (+131)
• New Zealand: 483,965 (up from 362,111 / +121,854 / 33.7%) - 151 deaths (+50) - avg daily: cases (+17,408) / deaths (+7)
• Spain: 11,324,637 (up from 11,223,974 / +100,663 / 0.9%) - 101,703 deaths (+568) - avg daily: cases (+14,380) / deaths (+81)
• Poland: 5,891,140 (up from 5,818,687 / +72,453 / 1.2%) - 114,218 deaths (+775) - avg daily: cases (+10,350) / deaths (+111)
• Belgium: 3,707,561 (up from 3,640,052 / +67,509 / 1.9%) - 30,529 deaths (+121) - avg daily: cases (+9,644) / deaths (+17)
• Israel: 3,771,293 (up from 3,715,230 / +56,063 / 1.5%) - 10,431 deaths (+64) - avg daily: cases (+8,009) / deaths (+9)
• Argentina: 9,006,526 (up from 8,970,196 / +36,330 / 0.4%) - 127,483 deaths (+361) - avg daily: cases (+5,190) / deaths (+52)
• Canada: 3,404,964 (up from 3,371,194 / +33,770 / 1.0%) - 37,215 deaths (+(63) ) - avg daily: cases (+4,824) / deaths (+(9) )
• Mexico: 5,633,928 (up from 5,605,636 / +28,292 / 0.5%) - 322,072 deaths (+1,018) - avg daily: cases (+4,042) / deaths (+145)
• Romania: 2,816,039 (up from 2,791,994 / +24,045 / 0.9%) - 64,685 deaths (+324) - avg daily: cases (+3,435) / deaths (+46)
• Ireland: 1,365,467 (up from 1,341,826 / +23,641 / 1.8%) - 6,638 deaths (+27) - avg daily: cases (+3,377) / deaths (+4)
• Iran: 7,141,033 (up from 7,119,763 / +21,270 / 0.3%) - 139,610 deaths (+779) - avg daily: cases (+3,039) / deaths (+111)
• India: 43,007,841 (up from 42,990,991 / +16,850 / 0.0%) - 516,479 deaths (+629) - avg daily: cases (+2,407) / deaths (+90)
• South Africa: 3,704,218 (up from 3,693,532 / +10,686 / 0.3%) - 99,881 deaths (+169) - avg daily: cases (+1,527) / deaths (+24)
• Sweden: 2,475,687 (up from 2,466,577 / +9,110 / 0.4%) - 18,053 deaths (+255) - avg daily: cases (+1,301) / deaths (+36)
• Columbia: 6,080,589 (up from 6,076,333 / +4,256 / 0.1%) - 139,434 deaths (+151) - avg daily: cases (+608) / deaths (+22)
• Lebanon: 1,087,835 (up from 1,084,114 / +3,721 / 0.3%) - 10,243 deaths (+43) - avg daily: cases (+532) / deaths (+6)
• Ukraine: 5,040,518 (up from 5,040,518 / +0 / 0.0%) - 112,459 deaths (+0) - avg daily: cases (+0) / deaths (+0) - unable to submit due to war

 

[belamyi]

This week started in Spain with the official "influenzation" of COVID-19: no more general tests or quarantines, treatment of the disease as any other respiratory (which we learned was not the best way to label it) disease.

 

[cabinfever]

I stopped caring if anyone else is or isn't wearing a mask - or if they are vaccinated or not.

If someone isn't wearing a mask I just stay away from them. I have one on all the time when I have to be around other people and I will keep it on for years if need be.