Active Duty's Axl tattoo controversy

[marcopolomarco]

Re: Active Duty update thread

<<<have you gooogled 14 88 and you will see what pops up.
>>>

Yeah, the numbers don't look good, but everything I'm seeing on the net shows them in the form - 14/88. Giving him the benefit of the doubt, the artist either was ignorant of the usual meaning or perhaps did it on purpose. Who knows? It seems like he would use the backslash though if he wanted to make a statement. And you're right, people should research the meaning of what they get put on their body. But numbers are so universal and can stand for all kinds of things, so most people probably don't even think about that. For example, the Anti-Defamation League site also lists 311, 100%, and 420 as numerical hate symbols. So I guess either he's clueless and this is an unfortunate thing, he's a reformed nazi who regrets his past, or he's at home ironing his white sheets for a rally. We may never know.

 

[Singularity]

Re: Active Duty update thread

I'd like to kindly remind you all that symbolism can change within the means of a current trend.

Before WWII, the Swastika was a symbol for good fortune (shakti). It still is in some parts of the world but when people see it they immediately associate it to Neo-Nazism and cry wolf.

As for the tattoo culture of today, most kids these days are not aware of the true symbolism of their favorite motifs. I'm reminded of Danny Baker, an English journalist and radio DJ, who recently ranted about how today's punk rock is not the true punk rock. When he was young, his mates and him used punk rock as a means of rebellion. It wasn't a "cool lifestyle" they chose but a way to show authority the middle finger.

Nowadays, punk rock is used in a romanticized way - a trend if you will - far removed from its original roots.

The same goes for tattoos. They used to originate from the Polynesian culture when western sailors returned with their own motifs or mermaids and anchors. Later, prisoners started to use them as brandmarks, the same goes for gangmembers in urban areas, and from there it all branched out into the categories and symbolism that we know of today.

But as times change, youth doesn't realize or understand the meaning of certain motifs from the past so they start getting tattoos of them that to many are offensive but to them are 'cool'. Axl is only 18 years old, given that he's probably from a remote Midwestern part of the US he maybe doesn't even know the original meaning of the Swastika.

Having said all that, Ion Davidov, a Bel Ami model from the 90s, who couldn't look any more innocent, had a spiderweb tattoo on one of his shoulders... I doubt he was a convicted felon.

 

[StlKj]

Re: Active Duty update thread

Hot model. Repulsive tattoos. Offensive defense and misdirection to attack posters discussing the issue, especially considering that Cowboy Bob defended this studio less than a year ago against claims of racism in this very thread, and established himself as at least an occasional paying customer of the site. Still, Cowboy Bob could have presented the evidence more as a question instead of as an accusation.

No one bashed this young man as scum or advocated violence against him. They questioned the meaning of his tattoos and whether or not he's a racist. To attack them for questioning such a thing is ridiculous considering the tats' possible meaning when considered together. The conversation was not particularly venomous towards him, but the energy directed against those who were concerned seemed to be.

No, one cannot please all customers' tastes or whims, but when something as serious as customers' discomfort with a potentially racist model occurs, one could show more concern for their fears right from the start rather than appearing to side step, excuse or explain it all away.

"Your concerns about this model are understandable, and since I don't have any knowledge regarding the meaning of his tattoos, I will look into it and get back to you. I can only assure you that my interactions with him have all been positive and that we would never knowingly showcase a racist model." *Follow that up with, "I checked with Axl, and here is his explanation...I choose to believe him, but I understand why someone would still be wary, so if you are an offended customer of our site, I would like to offer you..."

That's better than just appearing evasive, defensive and attacking. It also presents the exact same message across multiple forums/sites, so one can't be seen as changing one's story. It even serves to subtly turn a deaf ear to those who aren't paying customers and who just want to jump in. It reassures customers that their true concerns matter.

That's just good customer service.

 

[Hellax24]

Re: Active Duty update thread

Hot model. Repulsive tattoos. Offensive defense and misdirection to attack posters discussing the issue, especially considering that Cowboy Bob defended this studio less than a year ago against claims of racism in this very thread, and established himself as at least an occasional paying customer of the site. Still, Cowboy Bob could have presented the evidence more as a question instead of as an accusation.

No one bashed this young man as scum or advocated violence against him. They questioned the meaning of his tattoos and whether or not he's a racist. To attack them for questioning such a thing is ridiculous considering the tats' possible meaning when considered together. The conversation was not particularly venomous towards him, but the energy directed against those who were concerned seemed to be.

No, one cannot please all customers' tastes or whims, but when something as serious as customers' discomfort with a potentially racist model occurs, one could show more concern for their fears right from the start rather than appearing to side step, excuse or explain it all away.

"Your concerns about this model are understandable, and since I don't have any knowledge regarding the meaning of his tattoos, I will look into it and get back to you. I can only assure you that my interactions with him have all been positive and that we would never knowingly showcase a racist model." *Follow that up with, "I checked with Axl, and here is his explanation...I choose to believe him, but I understand why someone would still be wary, so if you are an offended customer of our site, I would like to offer you..."

That's better than just appearing evasive, defensive and attacking. It also presents the exact same message across multiple forums/sites, so one can't be seen as changing one's story. It even serves to subtly turn a deaf ear to those who aren't paying customers and who just want to jump in. It reassures customers that their true concerns matter.

That's just good customer service.

School'em!

Dink never wanted a discussion, he just wanted people to ignore what was right in front our eyes and spin the situation. Which he did poorly. But, he gave it his best shot, bless him .......................**

You don't grow up in the south and pick up guys at the local Wal-Mart from the military and not know what those tatt's meant. I do not believe for one second that Axl, and Dink were unaware of yet Dink went right ahead put those videos on his website and claimed surprise when people pointed out the tatt's and he goes on the attack.and once apologized for offended any of the members on this board. No surprise he will milk this model for all he's worth.


CXXX

 

[Singularity]

Re: Active Duty update thread

Hellax24, did you purposely skip my post or are you that biased to begin with? The minute you added 2+2 you haven't even given one iota of doubt that you might be wrong.

 

[seaguy]

Re: Active Duty update thread

Regarding Axl's tats: personally I have better things to do with my time than to be researching the tats of porn stars. I watch them have sex jerk off and that's about it. Hopefully he is not a racist but really people are we that bored?

 

[Hellax24]

Re: Active Duty update thread

Hellax24, did you purposely skip my post or are you that biased to begin with? The minute you added 2+2 you haven't even given one iota of doubt that you might be wrong.

Hmmm..Who are you? No I didn't read your post because it just offers more excuses. Just because you want something to be true doesn't mean they are. Yes there are many symbols that the Aryans and other hate group have taken corrupted there true meaning. However, if he is not smart enough to think getting a tattoo through and let's anyone put anything on your body is pretty dumb. "A friend of a Friend" my ass.

You want to help and try to white wash this all you like, I am not buying it. As i have said before 1 maybe, 4-5 then he knows exactly what he is doing. A good example is that is the NN tattoo he got just 3 weeks ago and in the video he remarked he couldn't say on camera what those letters stand for. dink just to spin it about him not wanting tell because it was a girl and he didn't want any backlash. Back lash having a girls Initials tatt'd on him.In mostly every single video the STR8" military guys are talking about girls and how much they love pussy. It's AD Niche. Str8 Military men having sex with other guys. There was no logic in this post from Dink. But, I'm sure you can rationalize that also.

There's also his friends site called "My Str8 Buddy" that is all about str8 guys hanging out and occasionally fool around with fellow str8 military guys. But, according to Dink he didn't mention a girls name because he thought us "Gays" might nail home the wall. WTF? On the one hand he is naive an really trusting and let's people whatever they want to him and on other other he has internet access and has done extensive research about how focal the gay community are about Gay4Pay models and we string up every single one of them.

Sorry you can't it both ways and i say again AD is apparently 99.9% about str8 military guys having sex with other but there 100% str8. Once again the logic is wrong. On a site like that they are encourage to talk about the Str8-ness before, during and after they have sex. But this kid doesn't explain the "NN" he got 3 weeks ago. Not at 14 or 16 but at 18.

CXXX

 

[Soilwork]

Re: Active Duty update thread

Hellax, isn't it time to feed your cats or something?

Have you really been at this all night?

 

[Hellax24]

Re: Active Duty update thread

I forgot to add this to my last post. Thanx to jesse at Men of Porn for remembering. This is not the same words i used when i said that Dink would only hire aryans. Though it is very close to it.

Jesse said...
Dink Flamingo is completely out of touch (or playing dumb) when it comes to issues of race. There is a thread at JUB where Flamingo is asked why he has never used any men of color at Active Duty. His response was pathetic:

-Fans rarely write him asking for black, Asian or hispanic performers (I guess they write him and request that he only cast white guys?)

-He once tried to hire a black guy, but the guy stole from him (sterotype much?)

-Ethnic models, after being booked, often were "no shows" or cancel (wow, who knew that white guys are so easy to work with?)

He then suggested that there are other sites that "cater" to those that want to see more diversity. He refered fans to websites: itsgonnahurt, ebonyu and latinoboys.

Oh well, as is typical for Dink Flamingo, new year/new controversy.

Thanx again Jesse.



CXXX

 

[ChaseO310]

Re: Active Duty update thread

Gee - I didn't hear anything about this in Obamarama's State of the Union Address last night, so I guess it's not that earth-shattering .....

 

[Pangelboy]

Re: Active Duty update thread

Disappointing, but after I saw what Dink wrote earlier in this thread about how his black model(s) have stolen from him in contrast to his white models, and then suggested that those who would like to see more diversity on his site look elsewhere, I got his hint that Active Duty is not welcoming to diverse models who don't look white.

The neo-nazi/skinhead is just the icing on the cake. I do find some of his videos hot, but subscribing to his site to watch Axl would be a level of self-hate that this gay black man couldn't handle. I can barely stand the G4Payers who seemed revolted by gay sex in interviews but have taken more dick than I have...lol

Edited to add that gays and fascism (and all the wonderfulness that comes along with it, neo-nazi, aryan brotherhood, etc.) have had gay people involved in them. To act as if this guy sucking and fucking prevents him from being hateful is being woefully ignorant. I guess people would actually have to read and know what the hell they're talking about before they made such claims, and we can't have that can we?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/johann-hari/the-strange-strange-story_b_136697.html

 

[quasar]

Re: Active Duty update thread

Just a couple of thoughts on some comments made in the last couple of days.

Whilst it's a different thread topic altogether, there IS one element of truth in something Dink said, in so far as like most things, 'supply is driven by demand'. The simple truth of the matter - and I'm sorry if it offends the 'politically correct' brigade or the holier than thou 'if you don't want to fuck a black guy it's because you're racist' brigade - the demand for black guys in porn is simply not as great as the demand for white guys in porn.

In addition to this simple truth, very few black men come forward to audition for porn - certainly not for the big companies. Whether this is because they're just not interested in it or whether it's because they feel that studios only want white guys, I don't know.

That said, there ARE many specialist sites featuring black guys and any combination of ethnicity - although to look at JUB's galleries you could be forgiven for not believing that, and I've had many members ask me why. The simple answer is that we can only publish affiliate material if the companies send it - and from my own experience as a blogger with affiliate programmes on my blog, if companies can't be bothered to mail out to their affiliates regularly, then I'm not about to chase them for it... I'll simply concentrate on the ones who can.

The porn industry is a similar model to your local high street. You've got the big megastores that provide virtually anything you want, and then you've got all of your little specialist shops. You wouldn't expect your little antique shop to be selling the latest HDTV's or dildos - nor would you petition him or criticise him for not doing so.

Dink has his specialist niche, as do the likes of CorbinFisher, Dark Thunder , Broke Straight Boys , Bel Ami , Boy Crush etc - and I don't hear anyone questioning Boy Crush for not employing muscular black guys...

By all means question the wisdom of ActiveDuty in making such a glaring error with regard to Axl, but if you're going to question whether someone is racist because they happen to know their market, then you need to start casting your net wider and criticise other porn companies - some of whom were also interested in signing Axl.

As someone who has spent my life working in PR, Customer Service and Marketing, the one thing that I would agree upon is the disaster that was Dink's 'explanation'. It should have settled the matter instead of adding to it.

Whether Dink was aware of the meanings behind the tattoos, I genuinely don't know. How many of us knew - until CowboyBob brought it to our attention and we all headed to Google to research some more? Certainly here in the UK, the symbolism associated with White Supremacy and Neo-Nazism isn't instantly recognisable.

As for Axl, he can't win. If he says they ARE the remnants from a time he regrets, people will either not believe him, or question why they haven't been removed already - and well, he's hardly going to admit to being a white supremist is he?

Of course there will also be those who have the same mind as some of the gay4pay supporters who don't mind that the straight guys they toss off to refer to gays as faggots and sick, and will be a fan of Axl anyway.

Whilst everyone seems to have plenty to say about what is wrong with this issue - there's been very little said about how it can be rectified. When faced with a complaint, my favourite question was "What can I do to make it up to you?" More often than not I was presented with a blank expression and an "Erm, I don't know" reply. "Well, if YOU don't know, how can I meet your expectation?"

And this is what the last couple of pages have been about. It seems like you all want to sign the complaint as 'Disgusted, from Houston' but have no idea what Dink or Axl could do that will make things better.

 

[TallOneCA]

Re: Active Duty update thread

Quasar, frankly I'm very frustrated with the explanation that ethnic diversification in the business of porn is based on demand.

I have been a dedicated and consistent paid subscriber of Active Duty for years. I have hung in there with all of the ups and down of AD, understanding that it is an amateur site pretty much managed solo by Dink Flamingo. For years I purchased each and every tape and DVD (good value) that was sold. On occasion, I contacted AD regarding customer service issues and usually got a prompt and friendly response (unless it was about the bonus sites that have not been updated--those questions are ignored.) Once in a while I would email about issues regarding content/creativity and the responses ranged from polite to snippy to no response at all.
As a fan of porn, I appreciate diversity and I'm the type of fan that wants to see porn reflect the society in which I live. For years, I have wondered why only white guys are featured at AD. This question has been asked by other fans too. Is that not "market demand?" A couple of months ago Dink Flamingo finally addressed this issue in this very thread. Dink's response floored me, but it was finally an answer. Based on his answer, I finally understand AD's business model. Active Duty produces, markets and sells gay porn featuring young, white military men. Forget the fact that the US Military is ethnically diverse or the fact that he films or filmed in at least two very ethnically diverse locations -- North Carolina and San Diego. Then to suggest that if one is looking for ethnic performers they should visit ethnic sites is just rude. Does Flamingo believe that he has no black, Asian or hispanic customers? Does he believe that porn fandom is segregated by ethnicity?

The issue of diversity has been bubbling under service with AD (and porn in general) for a long long time. Now the "Axl" controversy has illuminated race and diversity. Nevertheless, the bottom line is clear. Active Duty is a privately owned business that makes decisions based on what is best for Active Duty. This also means that these decisions clearly reflect the values of it's owner.

Lastly, Quasar, using your rationale regarding "demand" can you explain the success and popularity of two fairly new sites, timtales.com and Maverick Men.com? Both sites regularly feature ethnically diverse casts. I would argue that "demand" for ethnic diversity in porn is often ignored.

 

[quasar]

Re: Active Duty update thread

Quasar, frankly I'm very frustrated with the explanation that ethnic diversification in the business of porn is based on demand.....As a fan of porn, I appreciate diversity and I'm the type of fan that wants to see porn reflect the society in which I live.

It's like any business, you stick at what you're good at - it's the old 'if it ain't broke, don't try to fix it' addage. As I mentioned, there are sites that cater for that diversification and sites - like Dink's, that don't. There are those of us that like to watch porn featuring purely black guys, latin guys etc, interracial couples, twinks, older guys etc. Although you have sites like BadPuppy which provide every combination and then some - the content is basically from a large number of smaller 'niche' sites.

Based on his answer, I finally understand AD's business model. Active Duty produces, markets and sells gay porn featuring young, white military men. Forget the fact that the US Military is ethnically diverse or the fact that he films or filmed in at least two very ethnically diverse locations -- North Carolina and San Diego. Then to suggest that if one is looking for ethnic performers they should visit ethnic sites is just rude. Does Flamingo believe that he has no black, Asian or hispanic customers? Does he believe that porn fandom is segregated by ethnicity?

It's not about the ethnicity of the customers - it's about what the customers want to see - and if only a minor amount want to see ethnic models, then you don't necessarily deviate from your business model.

The issue of diversity has been bubbling under service with AD (and porn in general) for a long long time. Now the "Axl" controversy has illuminated race and diversity.

I originally had a paragraph in my post above which I later decided not to use. The basic point was simply that people would rather put their head in the sand than admit that there was still an issue with ethnic and racial diversity in porn.

Active Duty is a privately owned business that makes decisions based on what is best for Active Duty. This also means that these decisions clearly reflect the values of it's owner.

Surely this is true of any porn company though?.

Lastly, Quasar, using your rationale regarding "demand" can you explain the success and popularity of two fairly new sites, timtales.com and maverickmen.com? Both sites regularly feature ethnically diverse casts. I would argue that "demand" for ethnic diversity in porn is often ignored.

I think that the two sites you mention market themselves as exactly what they are. Simply from looking around the sites, you know what you're getting for your money - as you do with the likes of Sean Cody , Fratmen , Corbin Fisher , Active Duty , College Dudes , Bel Ami , etc.

I haven't said there ISN'T a demand for this diversity, I've simply said that the demand isn't as great. After all, most of the ethnically diverse sites were created to fill the obvious gap that the big players weren't catering for, and whilst I don't have any figures to hand, I'd say that there is a major difference in membership numbers between them.

And yes, I think some of the big sites DO ignore it - choosing to let others provide it, but whether it's morally right or wrong for many of the more popular sites to restrict themselves to mainly athletic white college type guys is another thing altogether.

The point I'm trying to make is that you can't apply the same diversity and equality laws to porn that you apply to a working environment, and some other areas of entertainment.

 

[quasar]

Re: Active Duty update thread

Oh, I should add that the 'Axl tattoos issue' is under discussion at Mod Towers at the moment.

 

[Hellax24]

Re: Active Duty update thread

Dirk Yates is still putting out movies from San Diego and has had several AF-AM models in his videos. Dink has made a judgement about ALL AF-AM models based on one experience with trying to hire one AF-AM model(If it's even True) That's not racist?

CXXX

 

[JayQueer]

Re: Active Duty update thread

Oh, I should add that the 'Axl tattoos issue' is under discussion at Mod Towers at the moment.

Quasar,

I think most people agree that Dink at "Active Duty" has the right to produce whatever content he wishes. If he believes that most of his paying customers want to only see the whitest of white guys on camera, that is his decision. If he wants to feature suspected white supremacists and Aryan Brotherhood guys on his site, that's his decision too. People who don't agree with his decisions will not join, or cancel their memberships.

This may have actually been a ploy to drive up publicity for "Active Duty" -- Dink may have known he had someone who might cause everyone to start talking.

The issue that the mods at "Just Us Boys" have to decide, is if the images of Axl and his white supremacist-associated tattoos are a good match with what the "Just Us Boys" website stands for.

What is the JUB policy regarding posting photos of white supremacist tattoos such as "14" and "88" and the "Celtic Cross," etc. when they are all on the same person?

I think that the best decision that JUB could do -- is to simply not feature photo galleries or content of Axl, or any other model (from any studio) who has more than one tattoo associated with the Aryan Brotherhood or white supremacist movement.

One tattoo might be a coincidence. When you have 4 to 5 tattoos associated with the Aryan Brotherhood, that's not a coincidence AT ALL.

Again, who Dink decides to feature on his "Active Duty" website is his decision.

Whether JUB will continue be a showcase for tattoos associated with white supremacists will be a decision that JUB and the mods will have to make.

 

[JaredPad]

Re: Active Duty update thread

My opinion---AD should terminate Axl. The issue is too important to allow him to appear with those tats. The things they represent are so heinous that, even if he didn't know what they meant, they must not appear on any site.

I'm white, and I feel so horrible that blacks were treated as if they weren't human. Any vestige of that must go. There's no way we can undo the past, but we owe this world every effort we can make.

 

[Glass7River]

Re: Active Duty update thread

One thing I did learn about Axl, like so many of these young men, is that he had a very hard childhood.

I wish we could talk to Axl to learn more about his childhood and his side of the story. Is there any chance Dink would tell Axl about this controversy?

Whilst everyone seems to have plenty to say about what is wrong with this issue - there's been very little said about how it can be rectified. When faced with a complaint, my favourite question was "What can I do to make it up to you?" More often than not I was presented with a blank expression and an "Erm, I don't know" reply. "Well, if YOU don't know, how can I meet your expectation?"

And this is what the last couple of pages have been about. It seems like you all want to sign the complaint as 'Disgusted, from Houston' but have no idea what Dink or Axl could do that will make things better.

We don't appear to have the full story about the tattoos. If we did, then we could begin a serious dialogue about "rectifying" the matter.

 

[Mnestor]

Re: Active Duty update thread

I wish we could talk to Axl to learn more about his childhood and his side of the story. Is there any chance Dink would tell Axl about this controversy?





We don't appear to have the full story about the tattoos. If we did, then we could begin a serious dialogue about "rectifying" the matter.

You probably will not here anything from AXL about this GlassRiver7 as Dink said on page 10 # number 471 When Axl called him he didn't mention anything to him about the outrage on the blogs about his tattoos. So it is a good bet you probably will not hear anything about it on that subject