Am I the Only One Annoyed with the "Sexuality is Fluid/No Labels!" Comments?

[DiamondSkin]

I am not the one obsessing over the sexual self identification of my sexual partners. Thus the width, and depth of bisexuality is never a concern for me.

Well, to be honest, I never ask the sexual orientation of my sexual partners either. I don't think anyone truly does....

But's not really the topic of discussion.....

 

[kallipolis]

Well, to be honest, I never ask the sexual orientation of my sexual partners either. I don't think anyone truly does....

But's not really the topic of discussion.....

So why infer that you are the oracle of understanding, who is well able to identify the sexual identity of so many human beings, with sufficient clarity to attach labels?

 

[DiamondSkin]

So why infer that you are the oracle of understanding, who is well able to identify the sexual identity of so many human beings, with sufficient clarity to attach labels?

Noone can truly identify the sexual identity of a person except the person themselves. People can lie to others and they can lie to themselves.

I am simply advocating truth. That people be truthful with themselves.

As a person who in his youth lied about his "heterosexuality" and pretended to be straight, I learned to accept myself as a gay man.

And I believe that advocating "no labels" or "fluid sexuality" is just another way for bisexual or sexually confused people to lie about themselves.

If you're bi, you're bi. Nothing to be ashamed of.

 

[kallipolis]

Noone can truly identify the sexual identity of a person except the person themselves.

Absolutely correct.

Thus for you, or I to label another person would serve no useful purpose, for we are not in a position to know another person, better than we know our self.

Being honest with oneself should not depend upon the perceptions of others, when presuming to know us, better than we know our self.

 

[kallipolis]

We all have the right to define ourselves.

Absolutely, so. And without the pretensions of others, presuming to know us, better than we know our self.

 

[DiamondSkin]

I could say I'm "bi" but does sleeping with a woman every few years while hitting on them all the time qualify me? Some say "yes," some say "no."

People call me "confused" all of the time. It's just whatever. They're the ones confused if they think it's necessary to filter me into a box. I'm just me. And I'd rather people know me for me.

And I abhor the term "bisexual" because it implies an equal attraction to two genders. I believe that there's more than two genders out there, so that pretty much falls apart. I'm attracted to men, women and trans men with vaginas. I don't know or care if there is a label for that, but I think "bisexual" sells that short.

I completely understand where you're coming from but I think you're refusal to self-identity as a bisexual doesn't do yourself or the bisexual community any service.

If you are attracted to men, women and yes, transsexual people than you would most likely fall under bisexual.

You said that you abhor the term "bisexual" because it implies equal attraction to both genders. I definitely agree that many people have that misconception.

Bisexuality is a VERY wide field. I don't think many people have any idea how wide it is.

I would say based on what you're stated, you're in that field. You may be 90% into men and 10% into women and 30% into transsexual FTM post-ops. That's fine but it's still in the field of bisexuality in the strict sense of the word.

There are many 'gay' men who refuse to identify as gay or homosexual because of the implications of what the word means. So they identify as "men who have sex with men".

If you don't want to identify as bisexual because you're still working out your sexuality, I completely understand that.

My only issue is that I view a person who says they have sexual attractions to men and women (and trans) and doesn't want to be perceived as bi or acknowledge that they're bi, in the same way I view a person who has sexual attractions to men only and doesn't want to be perceived as gay or acknowledge they're gay.

I know a person who is as gay as it gets. He has relationships with men. He only has sex with men. He's only attracted to men.

But he doesn't want to call himself gay or homosexual because he doesn't like what the word means in a societal sense.

 

[DiamondSkin]

It's actually funny you see things that way. To me, the removal of a label makes it easier to implicitly state what I'm into, because there are no prior assumptions. The person can ask me a question and I'm free to answer exactly what I like.

For instance, the whole "top"/"bottom" label I can't stand. Even though some treat it as the pinnacle of gay sex, I'd much rather be told exactly what someone likes to do in bed. Because to some people, being a top means that they prefer to be the penetrative partner. To other people, it actually means much more--that person doesn't want to suck cock or do anything "too gay" in bed. See the problem there?

I'd rather replace "bottom" with a synopsis of exactly what the guy wants.

An analogy between "top" and "bottom" to "gay" and "bisexual" is a false analogy.

As I said before, I think many bisexuals refuse to 'label' themselves as bisexuals or acknowledge their bisexuals because they're afraid what people will think of them, or afraid that people will make judgements of what they like, or make an air of knowledge of who they are as a person.

 

[blackbeltninja]

Wait a minute... Is this really just a bi bashing thread?

-d-

 

[kallipolis]

The aphorism know they self, and become what you are is inscribed over the entrance of the temples of ancient Greece as an invitation to better know our self and to become that person, so that our life may be lived in freedom from fear of the unknown.

Delusional self blindness is a fact of life for very many people, who choose to live a life of self denial that they may more easily fit into society's attempts to mould people, into a clone that identifies them as normal members of society.

Only we can release our self from our self incarceration.

For not a few people the process of self liberation takes many years, and for others their self imposed imprisonment accompanies them to their grave.

 

[DiamondSkin]

The aphorism know they, and become what you are is inscribed over the entrance of the temples of ancient Greece as an invitation to better know our self and to become that person, so that our life may be lived in freedom from fear of the unknown.

Delusional self blindness is a fact of life for very many people, who choose to live a life of self denial that they may more easily fit into society's attempts to mould people, into a clone that identifies them as normal members of society.

Only we can release our self from our self incarceration.

For not a few people the process of self liberation takes many years, and for others their self imposed imprisonment accompanies them to their grave.

I have no idea what you're saying. You're speaking in non-sequitur.

I feel like I'm in my Freshmen Philosophy class all over again.

 

[DiamondSkin]

-d-

How is suggesting that bisexual people admit, accept and be comfortable with being bisexual instead of saying they're "fluid" or cannot be "labeled" a form of bi-bashing?

Is suggesting that gay people admit, accept and be comfortable with being gay instead of saying they're "men who have sex with men" or "totally straight, brah!" a form of homophobia?

Blackbeltninja: "Telling bisexual people they're really bisexual is biphobia!"

Diamondskin: Yeabuhwha?

 

[kallipolis]

I have no idea what you're saying. You're speaking in non-sequitur.

I feel like I'm freshman Philosophy class all over again.

You are speaking much about truth, which is also a philosophical discussion that encourages us to better know our self.

You are the poster who has self identified as the teacher of truth for those poor students who might benefit from your teaching lessons.

I am saying that being true to our self can only be realised by our self, and that the pretensions of others, who presume to know us, better than we know our self is hardly likely to add any value to our awareness of self.

 

[kallipolis]

How is suggesting that bisexual people admit, accept and be comfortable with being bisexual instead of saying they're "fluid" or cannot be "labeled" a form of bi-bashing?

Is suggesting that gay people admit, accept and be comfortable with being gay instead of saying they're "men who have sex with men" or "totally straight, brah!" a form of homophobia?

Why self label? Labels mean absolutely nothing. It is our actions, our deeds that identify the real person, and not words that might satisfy the insecurities of a person who wishes to identify with a particular sub set of society.

 

[DiamondSkin]

You are speaking much about truth, which is also a philosophical discussion that encourages us to better know our self.

You are the poster who has self identified as the teacher of truth for those poor students who might benefit from your teaching lessons.

I am saying that being true to our self can only be realised by our self, and that the pretensions of others, who presume to know us, better than we know our self is hardly likely to add any value to our awareness of self.

Why self label? Labels mean absolutely nothing. It is our actions, our deeds that identify the real person, and not words that might satisfy the insecurities of a person who wishes to identify with a particular sub set of society.

 

[kallipolis]

^^Your choice to avoid responding. Bear in mind that you have delivered the accusations, and made the judgements.

 

[kallipolis]

One of the many attributes that identifies those self appointed teachers of sexual identification clarity, is their easy willingness to speak about the sexual life of others, when having absolutely no idea about the sexual life of other people.

 

[DiamondSkin]

I disagree with your understanding of bisexuality's definition, as "bi" means "two" and I'm not sure if trannsexuals fit under the gender of male or female when they're pre-op.

"Bi" also means equally split. That's also a false connotation attached to bisexuality as well.

I view transsexuals as "dual-gendered" as they have elements of the male and female gender in a physical and sometimes mental sense. But that's a whole other can of worms.

In general, I don't like the term bisexual for me. I don't feel bad for that.

And that's fine. I know plenty of gay people who refuse to call themselves gay or acknowledge they're gay.

Labels, to some, are a pressure to live up to. I like "Queer" because of it's all-engulfing nature. It's something I know it's something I'll never not be. I can't say the same about the rest.

I think you're treating the 'label' of bisexuality as something heavy to carry, which I understand.

I'm gay.

People know I'm gay.

And I acknowledge that the word "gay" comes with alot of baggage too. People assume all sorts of things about me. I must know how to garnish a Roman salad properly because I'm gay.

 

[DiamondSkin]

^^Your choice to avoid responding. Bear in mind that you have delivered the accusations, and made the judgements.

No sweetie, you're speaking in non-sequiturs in the pretense of intelligence.

I deal with that all day at work for a living.

Lofty speaking and double-speak doesn't make an argument.

 

[DiamondSkin]

One of the many attributes that identifies those self appointed teachers of sexual identification clarity, is their easy willingness to speak about the sexual life of others, when having absolutely no idea about the sexual life of other people.

"Sexual Identification Clarity"?

Did you just make that up?

Ooooh, can I try?

"Sexual Predetermination Cognizance"

No, it doesn't quite roll off the tongue....

 

[bendted]

Fully agree with the OP, but I'm compelled to point out the irony of him leaving the "orientation" thing on the left blank.