Attracted to straight men (majority)

[JustMe5]

I seriously don't see a roid-pumped coward Cody Cummings as ANY more masculine than moaning little Seth Knight for example. I am also way more attracted to the latter, and not because I like effeminacy, but because open and honest sexuality is arousing to me. Unlike stiff, scared pretend hetness...

I didn't know who Seth was so I looked him up. I found a video interview of him. Just listening to him speak is ugh, repulsive! He's what I would consider a "woman with muscles". And he kept saying how he wants to get fucked by muscular guys. I think the whole superficiality of the gay community is more detrimental to gays' emotional well-being than lusting over straight men.

 

[JustMe5]

The straight married guys I used to fuck on a regular basis sometimes had on women's lingerie and other accessories that gay men never had.

....

On the other hand...it takes a real secure man to have the balls to wear lingerie IMO.

It's been theorized that men (sexual orientation notwithstanding) who achieve arousal by wearing women's lingerie are actually a form of transsexual (believe it or not).

 

[weinerslav]

Oh, sure, when a gay guy has sex with women, that's one thing. But it is not the same in both directions, simply because society is heteronormative. Opposite-gender sex is the norm. So everyone who can, partakes in it. I am very disinclined to believe that when it comes to supposedly straight men who want to GET fucked on a regular basis. Heterosexual males don't really want dick up their ass. And are you in their heads, to know that they are emotionally and sexually attracted to women? A Kinsey 4 is still gay to me, whether he has sex with women, or not.

Jesus, get a rainbow flag and go scream to the street! You're just dying to put labels in everything and play the victim...

I had affairs with girls when I was younger and confused, never had sex but I actually would like to try, I don't feel I'm straight or even bi because of that! I am gay and I'm happy with it. I also know straight guys that tried something with a guy and while it was fun, is not their cup of tea, I still think they are straight because it never happened again, at most, they are/where curios...

If you quote the Kinsey scale you know that there are not extremes, people fall more for a side than the other and that's it, you're spending most of the time shouting about issues that don't have the same answer to everybody, sexuality is complex, is not easy and plain, I had to fight myself a lot to understand me, some people may not have the same kind of strength or even the need to have a reply.

And about the feminine guys not being the plate of the day, well there are also a lot of guys that say, no fat guys, no ugly guys, no old guys, bears only, and so on, probably that is not the right place to find something meaningful, on the opposite, and I see those requirements as clear sighs to steer away... The internet is full of creeps, I don't see anything new about this.

 

[weinerslav]

I didn't know who Seth was so I looked him up.

I didn't knew either, just saw some images right now and was more than enough, I don't see it as a men, it's just a kid and if he's feminine, thank you very much but, no, thank you very much!

More than the fetishism with straight guys I worry about the fetishism with the youth, and worse, youth and androgyny mixed up, that probably as some serious psychological causes, and yes, probably homophobic origins, the refusal of the man and the search for the man-girl, and yet is so well accepted! The real problem is if you like men lol

 

[Rolyo85]

I didn't know who Seth was so I looked him up. I found a video interview of him. Just listening to him speak is ugh, repulsive! He's what I would consider a "woman with muscles". And he kept saying how he wants to get fucked by muscular guys. I think the whole superficiality of the gay community is more detrimental to gays' emotional well-being than lusting over straight men.

No, he is not a "woman with muscles". He's a dumb kid who does porn. I am not talking about wanting to marry him, I'm just saying physically I'd be way more attracted to him than to the supposedly heterosexual Cody Cummings who propagates the "Dominant Straight Macho Dominates the Submissive Faggot Who Is Helpless Against The Dominant Straight Macho's Dominant Straightness" stereotype. I don't know how any gay guy could feel anything but anger to such a douchebag.

 

[Rolyo85]

Jesus, get a rainbow flag and go scream to the street!

You're saying it like it's a bad thing. Are you that embarrassed by the people who fight for your rights? You know, the Stonewall riot was started by a drag queen. You know, one of those people the modern gay man isn't attracted to because they aren't straight enough.

You're just dying to put labels in everything and play the victim...

1. I don't know where you saw labels. I analyze things and I am not satisfied with face value. If you enjoy getting fucked, you are NOT straight. Maybe you're not entirely gay either, but you're not straight. It's really simple as that.
2. I do not play the victim. In fact, I see guys lusting after hets as victims. I'm just trying to help ^_^

I had affairs with girls when I was younger and confused, never had sex but I actually would like to try, I don't feel I'm straight or even bi because of that! I am gay and I'm happy with it. I also know straight guys that tried something with a guy and while it was fun, is not their cup of tea, I still think they are straight because it never happened again, at most, they are/where curios...

Um, thank you for providing an example to prove my point, I guess? Having sex with a girl doesn't make you straight. You said it yourself - you were confused. As for the "for fun" part, I would also be curious to try having sex with a girl. That said, there is an ocean of difference between this and a married guy cheating continuously by getting fucked by a dude. That is NOT straight. That is a need deeper than random curiosity and fun-having. The story of the self-denying married closet homosexual is WAY too common for us to play pretend here.

If you quote the Kinsey scale you know that there are not extremes, people fall more for a side than the other and that's it, you're spending most of the time shouting about issues that don't have the same answer to everybody, sexuality is complex, is not easy and plain, I had to fight myself a lot to understand me, some people may not have the same kind of strength or even the need to have a reply.

Actually, there ARE extremes. I am one. I have 0 physical response to girls. That said, most people fall somewhere in the middle, and that's fine. However, outside of truly bisexual people, to me if you prefer one gender to the other, your sexuality should bear the name of that gender preference. Otherwise might as well call EVERYONE but the small percentage of people like me "bisexual", and make sexuality distinctions meaningless, when they are clearly not so.

A Kinsey 2 does NOT physically need to cheat over and over again on his wife with guys. While he may be interested in trying stuff, he would be satisfied with her (this is if we consider just the physical element of a relationship). The same way as a Kinsey 4 doesn't need to go inseminate every girl around him just because he has some interest in girls. So when a guy tells me some crap like "girls are for love, guys are for fucking" or "I love my girlfriend, but I really need some dick", I call that a closet case that needs to deal with his sexuality and stop hiding behind "oh, I don't label myself" or "I'm straight bi-curious". The difference between curiosity and need for something more fulfilling is vast, and one doesn't jump into a series of same-sex hook-ups or an ongoing same-sex affair behind a spouse's back just to scratch an itch.

And about the feminine guys not being the plate of the day, well there are also a lot of guys that say, no fat guys, no ugly guys, no old guys, bears only, and so on, probably that is not the right place to find something meaningful, on the opposite, and I see those requirements as clear sighs to steer away... The internet is full of creeps, I don't see anything new about this.

All concepts of physical beauty, while largely different from each other, share some common ideals that are genetically encoded in us. As a general rule, we want the fittest, most virile partner, so a tall muscular guy will always have a much higher chance of being pursued, regardless of culture and perceptions.

That said, do you equate femme guys with obesity or baldness, or other markers of unattractiveness? Because frankly, their femininity notwithstanding, they are often very attractive. Well groomed, well dressed, largely in shape... True, it's a type, and not everyone is attracted to types, but I believe there is a strong aversion to feminine qualities in gay culture, which is actually new - since the mid 80s or so - and goes beyond preferred types. And there is serious literature written on the subject too. I recommend trying "Why Are Faggots Afraid of Faggots?" - a collection of essays by different people on the subject of how much tamer, more rigid and heteronormative gay culture has tried to become in order to gain acceptance by heterosexuals.

Issues exist. Social tendencies and the programming they enforce exist. Just because there is a simple surface reasoning for something, doesn't mean it's the only possible one.

 

[Rolyo85]

I didn't knew either, just saw some images right now and was more than enough, I don't see it as a men, it's just a kid and if he's feminine, thank you very much but, no, thank you very much!

More than the fetishism with straight guys I worry about the fetishism with the youth, and worse, youth and androgyny mixed up, that probably as some serious psychological causes, and yes, probably homophobic origins, the refusal of the man and the search for the man-girl, and yet is so well accepted! The real problem is if you like men lol

I don't see the logic behind calling this homophobic. How is not caring about stereotypes of masculinity OR femininity homophobic?

As far as the obsession with youth, and the general superficialness of gay culture, that's true, and I agree. Unfortunately, there are and there always will be way fewer of us than there are straight people. So everyone will have that much less of a chance to find a partner. So feathers need to be bright... Not to mention that monogamy is the opposite of what's in the male genetic code haha. I don't see the obsession with visuals and youth ever going away really.

 

[AngolaZee]

1. First of all, as a Grindr veteran, I have seen COUNTLESS "no fems" profiles, and NOT A SINGLE "looking for fems" one. Same for Hornet, Scruff, Asshole4Asshole or any of the others. The ONLY time fems are EVER mentioned, is to tell them to gtfo. So while I can't imagine that there is NOBODY who likes them, the rampant femmephobia in the gay community is certainly harmful.

This is where we disagree, its not femmephobia its sexual attraction, some people are not attracted to fat people, black people, short people, pretty boys etc will you accuse them of having phobias. E.g I'm attracted to Taylor Lautner & Kellan Lutz, I would not be interested in Robert Pattinson (too twinky for ME) or Carlisle even though they both quite handsome they just don't get my mojo ticking. Trust me there are many men who like fem types but like I said you would expect the majority of gay men to like masculine men (gay or straight) simply because the whole point of being gay is that you are like a woman hence you are attracted to masculinity not femininity.

 

[Rolyo85]

This is where we disagree, its not femmephobia its sexual attraction, some people are not attracted to fat people, black people, short people, pretty boys etc will you accuse them of having phobias. E.g I'm attracted to Taylor Lautner & Kellan Lutz, I would not be interested in Robert Pattinson (too twinky for ME) or Carlisle even though they both quite handsome they just don't get my mojo ticking. Trust me there are many men who like fem types but like I said you would expect the majority of gay men to like masculine men (gay or straight) simply because the whole point of being gay is that you are like a woman hence you are attracted to masculinity not femininity.

I'm sorry, every time you equate me with a woman, your argument crumbles and you embarrass yourself. We are in no way more like women than the left stick is "like a fork" when you eat Chinese.

As for the rest - I am not exactly disagreeing with you here, but I just see two layers where most people see one.

First layer - personal preference.

Second layer - cultural intolerance that influences that preference.


Preferring heavily muscled guys to lean ones is JUST a personal preference, and whatever influenced it isn't a major factor in any culture. Preferring blondes to black-haired boys - same stuff. But preferring "straight-looking" guys to more feminine ones, while potentially JUST a preference, is heavily influenced by a strong intolerance to femininity in the gay community, which comes from the broader homophobic concept that "gays aren't real men". So we want to prove them wrong by hating on the less masculine among us and ostracizing them.

So while yes, it IS personal preference, there are different factors that determine personal preferences, and not all of them are random or harmless.

 

[weinerslav]

Oh Rolyo85, I love how you read between the lines, so you see homophobia in liking straight/straight looking kind of guys, and you don't see homophobia in liking guys that look like girls? Did you read what I wrote before about the Latin culture and the Brazilian prostitutes? I love how some people that pretend to care just completely spoils their speech because they don't actually care about the whole problem, just the part that matters to them.

"You're saying it like it's a bad thing. Are you that embarrassed by the people who fight for your rights?"

No, is not that, I was just stating that you're screaming fire where there isn't smoke. Yes they did a lot for us, but I hope you understand that nowadays raising a flag and march around will hardly take you anywhere, and honestly, constantly attacking people that are gay but have different preferences, will take you anywhere either, as far as I recall basically everybody in this topic was already called homophobic.

And there is so much more that I actually could refute, like:

"You know, one of those people the modern gay man isn't attracted to because they aren't straight enough." - I believe there was a lot of different kind of people there, men in drag where the first victims, but everybody was hit and everybody went to the fight so, for you, other men that fought that night don't matter because they weren't using a dress is that it?

"If you enjoy getting fucked, you are NOT straight." There are a lot of straight guys that like anal play (with girls) because, you know, they are guys, and the prostate is there, so...

"married guy cheating continuously by getting fucked by a dude" See? you keep doing this, every time you reply you add something, "married guy cheating continuously" is something that wasn't said earlier, before was just guys that had something with a men...

"Actually, there ARE extremes. I am one. I have 0 physical response to girls." Kinsey always said that the extremes would be very rare cases, and what you call perfect bisexuals are the same, and I would go further to say they don't exist at all and are a myth except in the cases of people that have mental/psychological blocks that really don't allow to process the fact that they have attraction for the opposite. So, you are an extreme but you would like to try something with a girl just for fun? That's rich, I can assure you that my boyfriend always says he is an extreme and he wouldn't EVER have sex with a girl, he just can't understand how am I capable to say that I would like to try, and yes, I also don't believe he is an extreme.

"That said, do you equate femme guys with obesity or baldness, or other markers of unattractiveness?" No, that's what you said, and again, offensively, I like bald/shaved guys and I like guys with meat for me to grab, so what are you trying to say? And I'm sorry but the one offended now is me, are you saying that I only date ugly guys? You are the only one making a fuss with the physical types, calling what you are or like beautiful flowers that deserve love and disdaining all the rest.

Honestly, those are just a few, very few aspects that deserve some attention, but I don't see any point in discussing the rest, I would also say that none of these should be discussed because they are obvious but, hey, why not pointing out the obvious?!

And by the way, that Cody Cummings is ugly as hell, give me Arpad Miklos any day of the week...

 

[Rolyo85]

Ok, I'm getting tired by the whole back and forth, and we're both too aggressive here to actually acknowledge when the other guy is right about something, so I think I'm gonna ignore the parts that are pointless to continue argue about, and focus on the rest:

Oh Rolyo85, I love how you read between the lines, so you see homophobia in liking straight/straight looking kind of guys, and you don't see homophobia in liking guys that look like girls? Did you read what I wrote before about the Latin culture and the Brazilian prostitutes? I love how some people that pretend to care just completely spoils their speech because they don't actually care about the whole problem, just the part that matters to them.

I didn't ignore it, I just think different cultures have their own unique problems when it comes to homosexuality. Also, yes, it's homophobic, you are right. And also disgusting, to me. I am so comfortable with being a guy that I can't begin to imagine how much a NON-transsexual guy has to hate himself to actually switch genders just so he isn't gay anymore... It's appalling.

But I still think it's a stretch to claim attraction to feminine guys to be a sign of internalized homophobia. And I think you misunderstand what I say when I mean I can be attracted to them. I like men. I don't care how masculine they are, as long as I get MAN from them. A feminine guy can still read like a guy for me, up to a point. When everything from look to body language, attitude and mannerisms gives me WOMAN, I can't be attracted to them. THIS is a preference, because it has to do with actual physical response (and my Kinsey 6 comment, which I'll get back to in a bit). I don't put all femme guys in the same category because I see degrees of femininity, and some of them - I'd go as far as to say most of them - still have the potential to be arousing to me. And that's how I know that when I'm not attracted to a femme guy, it's not internalized homophobia. And am not bothered by ANY level of femininity when looking, listening or in other non-sexual ways interacting with a guy. I read some pretty disgusted comments in this topic about how much people are grossed out by just looking and listening to femme guys. And that, to me, is a problem. When you come out, you are vulnerable and you expect this welcoming environment. Instead, you get ostracized all over again for being too girly... Not cool.

"You know, one of those people the modern gay man isn't attracted to because they aren't straight enough." - I believe there was a lot of different kind of people there, men in drag where the first victims, but everybody was hit and everybody went to the fight so, for you, other men that fought that night don't matter because they weren't using a dress is that it?

This is so devoid of any logic, or relation to anything I said, that I wasn't even sure you were serious... Everyone in that riot matters. Everyone who has done anything for us to be where we are, matters. But those police raids were a common thing. And it took a spark to light the fire and make people fight back. Now, you can say that if it weren't for that drag queen, somebody else would have been that spark. Maybe. Maybe not. Many times before nobody was. So it's a moot point. I never said other people didn't matter, but that it was a drag queen who first had the balls to fight back, is something that should be acknowledged.

"married guy cheating continuously by getting fucked by a dude" See? you keep doing this, every time you reply you add something, "married guy cheating continuously" is something that wasn't said earlier, before was just guys that had something with a men...

It breaks my heart to disagree, but...

The straight married guys I used to fuck on a regular basis...

Sooooo, yeah...

"Actually, there ARE extremes. I am one. I have 0 physical response to girls." Kinsey always said that the extremes would be very rare cases, and what you call perfect bisexuals are the same, and I would go further to say they don't exist at all and are a myth except in the cases of people that have mental/psychological blocks that really don't allow to process the fact that they have attraction for the opposite. So, you are an extreme but you would like to try something with a girl just for fun? That's rich, I can assure you that my boyfriend always says he is an extreme and he wouldn't EVER have sex with a girl, he just can't understand how am I capable to say that I would like to try, and yes, I also don't believe he is an extreme.

1. Perfect bisexuals do exist, I know two. And that's why I know that bisexuality operates on a different principle than homo- or heterosexuality. While our drives are gender-based, bisexuality is based on person, environment and circumstance. A guy who falls for a girl in his hick town but then goes to college, meets a dude and gets with him, didn't crave dick while he was with the gal, nor pussy while with the man. Which is why I know people who claim they're bisexual because they have a girlfriend and fuck guys on the side, are full of shit, and are just closet cases who can still get it up for a girl.

2. I am very careful in how I word my posts and it's only polite of you to read them just as carefully. I AM a perfectly gay guy SEXUALLY. I have zero PHYSICAL response to the female body. INTELLECTUALLY I don't mind girls, I am not repulsed by doing anything with a girl. I am a very sexual guy and I love new things. So yes, INTELLECTUALLY I would love to try having sex with a girl. PHYSICALLY I am incapable of convincing the middle management to cooperate. I hope now it's clear.

Frankly, I don't get guys who are repulsed by girl. Seems like so much posturing haha.

"That said, do you equate femme guys with obesity or baldness, or other markers of unattractiveness?" No, that's what you said, and again, offensively, I like bald/shaved guys and I like guys with meat for me to grab, so what are you trying to say? And I'm sorry but the one offended now is me, are you saying that I only date ugly guys? You are the only one making a fuss with the physical types, calling what you are or like beautiful flowers that deserve love and disdaining all the rest.

Again, you blazed through my post without actually paying attention to it. Baldness (and I meant partial, not full on bald/shaved head) and extra fat are MARKERS of unattractiveness. Of course guys can still be hot with either - hell, they can be hotTER with them - but these things are culturally (and I would again say, in our genetic code) less desirable than firm muscle with no excess fat, or full head of hair. What I was asking is, do you put femininity in the same list? Not for you, but objectively.

And by the way, that Cody Cummings is ugly as hell, give me Arpad Miklos any day of the week...

Well, I lean heavy on the top side, so I got little I can do with Arpad, but otherwise I'm with you a 100% on that one

 

[Callum]

Positive? Not really, though I use it exclusively jokingly, and with some friends even affectionate, the way I'd call a friend "dummy". It's an insult, but not used as one.

And frankly, what you describe at that bar, is a situation that I have NEVER encountered, and I live in fucking Boystown, Chicago. It's full of straight people in our bars, and nobody is ever hostile to them, openly or behind their backs. The opposite is true - total mixing and friendliness. Maybe in some bitter smalltown gay bar which is the only escape from vitriolic homophobia, I could see such a thing happen there. But as I said, I've never experienced it myself.

Yep, I was in Church + Wellesley, which is Toronto's famous gay village. Such a shitty experience. I don't see anything positive with being labeled a 'breeder', in jest or not. Makes heterosexuals seem like nothing less than baby making machines and completely dehumanizes them.

 

[Rolyo85]

Yep, I was in Church + Wellesley, which is Toronto's famous gay village. Such a shitty experience. I don't see anything positive with being labeled a 'breeder', in jest or not. Makes heterosexuals seem like nothing less than baby making machines and completely dehumanizes them.

Well, that's your experience. Mine is different. Maybe Canada has a different dynamic between gay communities and straight people? I have no idea.

And I just can't take the whole issue seriously when it's like black people calling us "whities" or Native Americans calling us "pale skins" . I mean, come on. When you are the dominant majority, the world belongs to you. What do you care how some minority calls you? Evidently not much, seeing as how most people I've met haven't even heard of the term.

 

[eastofeden]

Oh, sure, when a gay guy has sex with women, that's one thing. But it is not the same in both directions, simply because society is heteronormative. Opposite-gender sex is the norm. So everyone who can, partakes in it. I am very disinclined to believe that when it comes to supposedly straight men who want to GET fucked on a regular basis. Heterosexual males don't really want dick up their ass. And are you in their heads, to know that they are emotionally and sexually attracted to women? A Kinsey 4 is still gay to me, whether he has sex with women, or not.

I see what I failed to mention...might have saved alot of time. I have had this conversation with at least 1000 guys over the years in varying degrees.

I lack a gaydar which is really odd for me because I have been openly gay since I was a sophomore in HS. I am not sure why...my mind doesn't travel there for some reason....or maybe I just don't care one way or the other because I have the same attitude toward my own sexuality (non issue)

...so when someone says they are straight I take it at face value. If I go deeper...i think sexuality is complex and maybe more individualistic than anyone realizes but the need to categorize and define everything puts us all in boxes. I think the Kinsey Scale comes closest to explaining sexuality but still not close enough....just a general overview.

The only time I ever think someone is a homosexual that does not admit being gay is when they have reparative therapy or preach about the sins of being gay to others...such as Teddy Haggard and Marcus Bachmann. I still don't think they are gay but I think they hate the part of them that isn't straight.

The only time I really KNOW when someone is gay is when they say it. I realize that other people have a completely different POV...but that is mine.

 

[Rolyo85]

Yeah, for sure. To me, if your dick points at boys, it doesn't matter what you want to call yourself, you're gay. Sexuality is not black and white, but it is quite simple none the less. We try to make it complicated to avoid unpleasant truths, mostly...

 

[eastofeden]

More than the fetishism with straight guys I worry about the fetishism with the youth, and worse, youth and androgyny mixed up, that probably as some serious psychological causes, and yes, probably homophobic origins, the refusal of the man and the search for the man-girl, and yet is so well accepted! The real problem is if you like men lol

If you aren't into these types of people...fine. Why denigrate them? Maybe they hate tired old gender/role dogma. Maybe they are expressing themselves and being true to who they are.

Not too long ago people said we had serious psychological damage because we were gay. Perhaps the real psychological damage comes from the people who expect other people to conform to their idea or what a man or woman "should" act like.

All too often...the more things change the more they stay the same. Changing who we demonize is not progress.

 

[eastofeden]

Yeah, for sure. To me, if your dick points at boys, it doesn't matter what you want to call yourself, you're gay. Sexuality is not black and white, but it is quite simple none the less. We try to make it complicated to avoid unpleasant truths, mostly...

We have to agree to disagree...it is how all of these conversations end for me. Hell...you might be right for all I know...I dont' have the definitive answer...only my opinion. I think human sexuality is far too complex versus being simple.

 

[newbored]

Yep, I was in Church + Wellesley, which is Toronto's famous gay village. Such a shitty experience. I don't see anything positive with being labeled a 'breeder', in jest or not. Makes heterosexuals seem like nothing less than baby making machines and completely dehumanizes them.

Of course. I mean, the mere fact that there are "gay villages" (something I think it's completely and absolutely ridiculous) reeks of heterophobia. In what universe is the action of segregating yourself from everybody that doesn't share your sexual orientation something wise or intelligent at all?

Maybe the Thought Police and the PC Patrol in this site would tell me: "OMG, it's because the christian breeder white men have oppressed us and killed us since the dawn of time! You're so homophobic!", or some stupid bullshit like that, and will never admit that there are lots of homosexual people who are heterophobic and abusive towards heterosexuals and will try to "justify" all those things with embarrassingly stupid excuses, but the truth is, self-segregation and attitudes like the one you describe denote stupidity, bigotry, insecurity, fundamentalism and HYPOCRISY.

 

[newbored]

Trust me there are many men who like fem types but like I said you would expect the majority of gay men to like masculine men (gay or straight) simply because the whole point of being gay is that you are like a woman hence you are attracted to masculinity not femininity.

This is THE CORE of the issue. However, the Homosexual Thought Police here, WILL NEVER admit it. They'd like to bully you into believing that signifies "internalized homophobia" in one way or another. You're not allowed to have preferences and openly express them without shame or without being called a homophobe or an "internalized homophobe" if they're not previously approved by the Homosexual Thought Police.

 

[Rolyo85]

I'm sorry, but the vocabulary you're using is preventing me from taking you seriously enough to actually respond to you.

To claim that gayberhoods are a sign of heterophobia is just too childish and silly to argue with.