Citizens Should Work and Pay a Tax to Qualify for Universal Healthcare [SPLIT]

[The Fly]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

.What on earth does an unemployed, uninsured person with cancer do?

Die...........preferably quietly, and out of sight, so conservatives don't have to be disturbed by it.

 

[zombiekiller]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

Well, the bill to repeal the ACA just passed the senate.

 

[peeonme]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

Free health care has never been a legal right in the US, and you cannot distort the Constitution to create that right. Your argument would apply with greater force to free food. You will die soon without it, so why is there not a right to free food? Free shelter? Free clothing? So if you are right, everyone has a right to live in a communist country where everything is provided by the government, and no one has to work or pay for it.

If the government knew that a large segments of our society did not have access to food or shelter they should take action.
By having ACCSESS no one is saying it should be FREE, food, shelter and health care should be AFFORDABLE, not free.

You like to point out those who have no job, infer that they are lazy and just want to rob from the rich. The truth is that many Americans work hard and make so little money in this wonderful global fucking free trade economy that they have just enough to keep a roof over their head and food on the table.

They no longer receive health insurance through their greedy capitalist pig employers, so they would go without if our President Obama
had not complied with the original intent of our founding fathers and made sure that this group also had acces to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness by creating the AFFORDABLE care act.

Is it perfect? No, but it is a start to realizing the value of all human life regardless of "class" distinctions. We will have universal health care in America, it will happen, adjust to the idea.

 

[frankfrank]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

I can only imagine the bill for the month and 1 day I spent in the hospital.

I can, too - probably $250,000 to $400,000.

$500 aspirin tablets and all. Martin Shrkeli has nothing on them.

Even with ordinary private insurance, you would be fucked.

 

[jbrown329]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

Yeah, healthcare isn't a legal right. Neither is access to drinking water. Alan Grayson said it best about getting sick. The repuke plan is "die and die quickly".

 

[T-Rexx]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

But it costs a lot of money to run. I therefore do not understand why the USA cannot afford to set up a similar system;

Your system of comprehensive coverage for every illness for everyone in the country only costs you about two-thirds per person per year what the USA spends on healthcare. And you have better outcomes (across the board) for treatments.

What on earth does an unemployed, uninsured person with cancer do?

They die, of course.

We are not very keen on keeping people alive in the USA. It would save us too much money.

 

[peeonme]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

They die, of course.

We are not very keen on keeping people alive in the USA. It would save us too much money.

I find it ironic that the same party that does a war dance about abortion (which I wish did not exist) cares little for those who make it out of the birth cannel and take their first breath.

 

[Kabluey]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

Free health care has never been a legal right in the US, and you cannot distort the Constitution to create that right. Your argument would apply with greater force to free food. You will die soon without it, so why is there not a right to free food? Free shelter? Free clothing? So if you are right, everyone has a right to live in a communist country where everything is provided by the government, and no one has to work or pay for it.

Whatever. No country that I can think of had free universal health care in 1789.
Since then, plenty of countries have improved the welfare of their citizens through public healthcare, education and social security.
And their social indicators are healthier in each of those respects. Especially the whole lack of dying people in the streets-thing. Stop using the constitution to bang on about things you hate. They didn't have any provisions for space programmes, motor vehicles, air travel, knowledge of germs... ...anyway - if there were hicks with pitchforks trying to block any laws or provisions around these as unconstitutional (because they don't agree with them), then where would we all be?

If you'd prefer an 18th century USA, don't let the untreated venereal disease hit you on the way out - at that stage the country's human development levels would have been on a par with modern day Bangladesh, maybe lower.

 

[gsdx]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

Free health care has never been a legal right in the US, and you cannot distort the Constitution to create that right.

There are constitutional rights and there are basic human rights. Nobody, even you, should die because they cannot afford medical care.

NObody!!

Why should only those who have enough money be allowed to live?

Besides, if you had bothered to read any of these posts, you would have read that even Ontario's health care system is not 'free'. We pay for it. Even I pay for it every time I buy something which requires that I pay the provincial sales tax. Everybody pays. Even those on welfare when they buy their flat-screen TVs. Even the alcoholics every time they buy a bottle of wine or a six pack of beer. Even the children every time they buy a package of gum or a bottle of pop.

EVERYbody.

Yet nobody in Ontario will be turned away from necessary medical attention.

You might do well to educate yourself than to sit there at your keyboard and spout the same old nonsense over and over again. And while you're at it, you might want to start being very careful that you don't fall down and break your hip... or your head. I'd hate to think that you might be turned away at a hospital because you can't afford to pay for the surgery.

 

[rareboy]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

Your superiority complex is showing again. Don't be so rude, it just makes you look low rent.

And your inability to add anything of substance to the discussion makes you look

 

[jbrown329]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

Well, the repukes in congress just voted to overturn the ACA again. It made it through both the house and senate. 17 million people could lose coverage if that happens. It's time to repeat the French revolution. Bring out the guillotine. Set it up on the White House lawn and march the repukes over from capital hill.

 

[Benvolio]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

Well, the repukes in congress just voted to overturn the ACA again. It made it through both the house and senate. 17 million people could lose coverage if that happens. It's time to repeat the French revolution. Bring out the guillotine. Set it up on the White House lawn and march the repukes over from capital hill.

17 million is a small part of the population. The Senators and Representatives who voted against it were elected by people who wanted it repealed, many of them the taxpayers who are the intended victims of the plan.

 

[peeonme]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

http://www.senate.gov/reference/glossary_term/override_of_a_veto.htm
The President will not sign this, it will be vetoed, it will take a 2/3 vote in each chamber to override his veto.
Notgonnahappen!!!!!

 

[Benvolio]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

http://www.senate.gov/reference/glossary_term/override_of_a_veto.htm
The President will not sign this, it will be vetoed, it will take a 2/3 vote in each chamber to override his veto.
Notgonnahappen!!!!!

Every knows or assumes that. But it sets obama up care as a clear election issue which Republicans feel favors them, and there is likely to be a Republicans President and Congress next year.

 

[Willie Boy]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

The problem with the health care system in the US is that we allowed the major drug and insurance companies to take control of it. The drug companies set the costs and the insurance companies set what will be paid and who gets help paying. Individuals, especially those who need the help, get shit.

 

[NotHardUp1]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

Let's not leave the hospitals, clinics, and doctors out of it. A long time ago doctor ceased to mean "caregiver" and took on the role of the highest paid professional that most parents pushed their kids toward. There are some doctors who give a damn, but a lot more simply went into it for the lifestyle it afforded them.

The capitalist model failed the US in the medical profession.

 

[Benvolio]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

The problem with the health care system in the US is that we allowed the major drug and insurance companies to take control of it. The drug companies set the costs and the insurance companies set what will be paid and who gets help paying. Individuals, especially those who need the help, get shit.

It is more accurate to say that most people have insurance and the has enabled providers to charge much more than they could charge if people had to pay from their own pockets. But, it has also indirectly funded research and development and purchase of drugs and devices, and the construction of hospitals and facilities.

 

[Kabluey]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

It is more accurate to say that most people have insurance and the has enabled providers to charge much more than they could charge if people had to pay from their own pockets. But, it has also indirectly funded research and development and purchase of drugs and devices, and the construction of hospitals and facilities.

Other developed countries achieve the same or better for around half the cost.
No one would ever reasonably suggest that countries like Germany, the UK and France aren't providing a similar contribution to research and development while funding a very high quality of amenities, professionals and pharmaceuticals.

 

[Benvolio]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

Other developed countries achieve the same or better for around half the cost.
No one would ever reasonably suggest that countries like Germany, the UK and France aren't providing a similar contribution to research and development while funding a very high quality of amenities, professionals and pharmaceuticals.

My point was that insurance has raised the price of healthcare beyond what it would be if people paid personally, and those high prices have motivated and funded research. Even companies in other countries are motivated and funded in part by the prospect of selling into the large rich US market without price controls.

 

[Kabluey]

Re: Anyone uninsured?

My point was that insurance has raised the price of healthcare beyond what it would be if people paid personally, and those high prices have motivated and funded research. Even companies in other countries are motivated and funded in part by the prospect of selling into the large rich US market without price controls.

Are you advocating that overseas companies overcharge US citizens?
Marketing and advertising spends are higher than R&D costs at the large pharma companies.
Their profit margins are also greater than their R&D costs.

They spend more money advertising their current drugs than developing new ones... and they choose to bank more in profit each year than they spend developing new drugs too (the development of which is often publicly funded).