Deal Reached In US-Iran Negotiations

[Vitamin]

We should trust Iran why? Talk about peace is not the same as peace. Let us not be fooled.

If Iran is found to have broken the conditions at any time the sanctions "snap-back" immediately.

What part of that is so difficult to understand?

 

[chrisrobin]

Nations oughtn't ever trust one another. But Iran is not North Korea. Iranians are urbane, rational, and on Facebook.

"Is a danger to be trusting one another
One will seldom want to do what other wishes
But unless someday somebody trust somebody
There'll be nothing left on earth excepting fishes"

from...The King and I

 

[johaninsc]

strange that Ben is so much against abortion, but seems to have no problem with our young men/women being sent off to die in yet another war that we can't pay for

 

[T-Rexx]

We have all seen the movie of Nevill Chamberlin getting off the plane waiving the scrap of paper assuring peace in our time. And we know the consequences of his appeasement. Iran is closing no facilities and has not agreed to give up its "research". When Iran gets the bomb--and who can doubt that it will get it--Obama's place in history will be like Nevill's.

Video in link
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-32166814

I hope this is not a Neville Chamberlain 'Peace for our time' moment.

The comparisons to Neville Chamberlain are absurd.

Iran WILL get the bomb. Of that there can be no question. The question is to what extent the rest of the world may slow down this process.

Had GWB been willing to negotiate with iran, it is likely that the US could have reached agreements that would have delayed iran's U-235 purification process. Because Bush refused to "negotiate with terrorists," Iran is now significantly further along in the development process than would have been likely with agreements and monitoring in place.

As it stands, there is still some hope of slowing Iran's progress. Iran desperately wants the economic sanctions lifted, and is willing to give up some of its expedience in acquiring a bomb in exchange for that. That is a lever that the world can (and is) using to improve the situation in the middle east.

But make no mistake. These talks are not about stopping iran from ever acquiring nuclear weapons. Even Pakistan has the bomb. Iran will acquire that technology in time. It is not that difficult.

That is why Bibi Netanyahu wants the USA to start a war with Iran. But that is not likely to stop the region from acquiring a bomb, either. As we (should have) learned from Iraq and Afghanistan, spending trillion$ of dollars and thousands of American lives only creates cesspools of instability, which even less desirable entities then exploit. We can deal, at least, with Iran. It is more difficult to deal with a nuclear ISIS or a nuclear al-Qaeda.

Netanyahu's (and the Republicans') desire for war is the middle east is spectacular folly. It is somewhat unbelievable to me that they have learned nothing from the past 15 years of failure from the worst foreign policy mistake in American history.

 

[kallipolis]

The comparisons to Neville Chamberlain are absurd.

Agreed...for Neville Chamberlain fought with The Army in the trenches during the Geat War, very well aware from personal experience that those horrors should not be repeated...

...Chamberlain was also aware that the United Kingdom needed a little more time to complete the construction of its early warning radar system, to cope with the Luftwaffe's 4:1 advantage over the RAF....further, the construction of new fighters for the RAF such as the Spitfire needed a few more months for sufficient numbers to enter front line squadrons of the RAF...

Over the past thirty years it has become clear that the Munich Agreement bought sufficient time for the UK to repel invasion by German forces.

 

[kallipolis]

Netanyahu's (and the Republicans') desire for war is the middle east is spectacular folly. It is somewhat unbelievable to me that they have learned nothing from the past 15 years of failure from the worst foreign policy mistake in American history.

This opinion is shared by many in the Israeli security, and military establishments were even a former Mossad chief has publicy castigated Netanyahu for advocating war with Iran....

 

[Benvolio]

strange that Ben is so much against abortion, but seems to have no problem with our young men/women being sent off to die in yet another war that we can't pay for

It is nonsense to think I or Republicans want war. Absolutely not a ground war with Iran. But the sanctions were having an effect and should not be ended on the fond hope that the UN will detect the continued development of the bomb.

 

[Benvolio]

Agreed...for Neville Chamberlain fought with The Army in the trenches during the Geat War, very well aware from personal experience that those horrors should not be repeated...

...Chamberlain was also aware that the United Kingdom needed a little more time to complete the construction of its early warning radar system, to cope with the Luftwaffe's 4:1 advantage over the RAF....further, the construction of new fighters for the RAF such as the Spitfire needed a few more months for sufficient numbers to enter front line squadrons of the RAF...

Over the past thirty years it has become clear that the Munich Agreement bought sufficient time for the UK to repel invasion by German forces.

You give Neville to much credit. He was completely bamboozled by Hitler. And you forget that the Munich Agreement gave Germany time to build its forces. When Iran gets its bomb, nuclear war may be difficult to avoid. Israel cannot survive a bomb and may have no choice but to hit first with enough force to end the threat.

 

[kallipolis]

It is nonsense to think I or Republicans want war. Absolutely not a ground war with Iran. But the sanctions were having an effect and should not be ended on the fond hope that the UN will detect the continued development of the bomb.

The deal has been agreed to ensure that international monitors can continue to inspect Iran's nuclear facilities...and, also continue to encourage Iranian military cooperation with The West, to battle, and subdue IS forces....it's that straightforward....

 

[kallipolis]

You give Neville to much credit. He was completely bamboozled by Hitler. And you forget that the Munich Agreement gave Germany time to build its forces. When Iran gets its bomb, nuclear war may be difficult to avoid. Israel cannot survive a bomb and may have no choice but to hit first with enough force to end the threat.

By 1938 Germany's armed forces had developed into the most powerful in Europe...the collapse of France in 1940 evidenced this fact of life....The UK bought valuable time to restruture, and modernise its armed forces resulting in the failure of Germany's attempt to invade the UK.

The West desperately needs the cooperation of Iran, the most powerful military machine in the region, apart from Israel...to defeat IS, and to engage in relationship building measures that ensure Iran ceases to view The West as its enemy.

Netanyahu won the recent Israeli general election by using scare tactics....most of Israel's security, and military establishment oppose Netanyahu's determination to bomb Iran's nuclear industry's plants...fearing it could lead to the total collapse of organised resistance to IS...permitting the development of a void that creates the development of a monster that cannot be defeated....Vietnam is a reminder that super powers can be defeated by third world guerilla armies.

 

[Benvolio]

Oops, Iran is already accusing Kerry of lying about the "agreement". http://freebeacon.com/national-security/iran-accuses-u-s-of-lying-about-new-nuke-agreement/
That victory did not last long. With "allies" like these, who needs enemies.

 

[otters]

Oops, Iran is already accusing Kerry of lying about the "agreement". http://freebeacon.com/national-security/iran-accuses-u-s-of-lying-about-new-nuke-agreement/
That victory did not last long. With "allies" like these, who needs enemies.

Benvolio, I'm fearing you're in a bad health state: You're so very forgettable recently. Just one example: people of your ilk are supposed to write "The Roman Catholic John Forbes Kerry correctly The Austrian Jew Kohn".

 

[kallipolis]

The Roman Catholic John Forbes Kerry correctly The Austrian Jew Kohn

Subtle..but may fall on ignorant ears...

 

[Sausy]

If Iran is found to have broken the conditions at any time the sanctions "snap-back" immediately.

What part of that is so difficult to understand?

China and Russia would have to agree to resume them.. they aren't exactly known for their morality based decision making. Not at all likely they could get as tough a sanctions regimen going if Iran was found out to have not lived up to the agreement. Arrogant presumptuousness on your part here.

 

[nafhoosier]

The title of the thread is a little too optimistic, but I'm a sane and rational person and do hope a deal will be reached that avoids war.

All too often, people on the left and right both are completely hypocritical and dumb on this issue. The right insists extremist Islamic governments have no access to nuclear weapons while possessing them themselves, while the left completely ignores all legitimate concerns Western governments and Israel have of a nation too recently ruled by a racist Holocaust denier.

This is turning more into immature high school BS drama and is becoming less and less of a legitimate concern. Frankly, there are bigger problems happening in Africa that need more attention.

 

[Benvolio]

The west is attempting to prevent the spread of nuclear weapons, because, the more countries who get them the more likelihood that a general nuclear war will result. Suppose the US is hit be a nuclear weapon. It may not be possible to know immediately from whence it came, and perhaps the only effective deterrent is massive retaliation. We may be forced to merely guess when the bomb came from.
Liberals tend to think vital questions can be answeredb simplistic labels, so you dismiss the nuclear problem as "hypocrisy", as though we should allow all countries to have the bomb in order to avoid being hypocrites.

 

[otters]

The west is attempting to prevent the spread of nuclear weapons, because, the more countries who get them the more likelihood that a general nuclear war will result. Suppose the US is hit be a nuclear weapon. It may not be possible to know immediately from whence it came, and perhaps the only effective deterrent is massive retaliation. We may be forced to merely guess when the bomb came from.
Liberals tend to think vital questions can be answeredb simplistic labels, so you dismiss the nuclear problem as "hypocrisy", as though we should allow all countries to have the bomb in order to avoid being hypocrites.

Are you implying that the US aerial surveillance (etc.) is completely useless?

That's … VERY thick.

If Benvolio were military personnel, his commanding officers wouldn't tolerate this kind of defeatism, which is: undermining of military morale and hence punishable; in event of war, court martial would deliver that he'd deserve a bullet.

 

[Vitamin]

Are you implying that the US aerial surveillance (etc.) is completely useless?

That's … VERY thick.

If Benvolio were military personnel, his commanding officers wouldn't tolerate this kind of defeatism, which is: undermining of military morale and hence punishable; in event of war, court martial would deliver that he'd deserve a bullet.

Ben could be referring to the theory that 12,000 years ago intense cosmic radiation caused a major alternation in the Carbon-14 molecules in the atmosphere above the Great Lakes region of North America resulting in extreme levels of radiation exposure usually only found in atomic reactors being beamed down on the environments below. Such levels would have proved lethal for life in the Great Lakes region at the very least, and also caused massive glacier melting in the Artic.

http://www.viewzone.com/paleonuke.html

Ben is quite right that our missile defense systems are no better prepared to identify the culprit behind such an attack, if it were to happen again today. Clearly, this ineptitude is due the liberals hatred of America and her citizens, who were so merciless slaughtered in an nuclear attack 12,000 years ago.

 

[Benvolio]

Ben could be referring to the theory that 12,000 years ago intense cosmic radiation caused a major alternation in the Carbon-14 molecules in the atmosphere above the Great Lakes region of North America resulting in extreme levels of radiation exposure usually only found in atomic reactors being beamed down on the environments below. Such levels would have proved lethal for life in the Great Lakes region at the very least, and also caused massive glacier melting in the Artic.

http://www.viewzone.com/paleonuke.html

Ben is quite right that our missile defense systems are no better prepared to identify the culprit behind such an attack, if it were to happen again today. Clearly, this ineptitude is due the liberals hatred of America and her citizens, who were so merciless slaughtered in an nuclear attack 12,000 years ago.

Actually I was responding to nafhoosiers prior post seeming to say that we should allow Iran and others to obtain the bomb because it is hypocritical to stop them. Of course we should stop them if we can.

 

[T-Rexx]

Ironically, the US government shut down research on thorium reactors in 1973, specifically to support the use of civilian breeder reactors in the production of uranium for US nuclear weapons.

Were thorium reactor technology available today, such technology could be offered to virtually any nation, friend or foe, without the possibility of it being used to create weapons.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thorium-based_nuclear_power