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Dems calling Republicans bluff on 'fiscal cliff', the Bush tax cuts aided Romney the most

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evanrick

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No surprise, and even more - my own senator picked up on this latest republican ploy, to blackmail Americans into extending their special 15% capital gains rate and other tax loopholes for millionaires somehow amounts to driving America off a 'fiscal cliff'.

Except liberals don't respond to threats. Republicans will have to defend the special tax breaks they want to keep for the wealthy and they will have to continue to hold our country hostage over the threat of 'killing jobs' when its the tax cuts that allowed the job killing in the first place.

If the special breaks the Bush tax bill put into place is allowed to die, Romneys' tax rate will go from 15% to 39.6%. Income taxes will go up, but a lot less. Payroll taxes, which are in a separate bill, would go up 2%.

So who will the Bush breaks hurt the most if they are allowed to expire? Mitt Romney, who has amassed his giant fortune off the same special deals that allow him to claim a 15% rate because its investment income when a business goes bankrupt.

I cannot wait for this debate to unfold, and this is why I think democrats should start making demands now, to extend the payroll tax cut before even discussing the bush breaks.


Off the cliff, Thelma & Louise-style

The Last Word's Off the Cliff! campaign continues. Democrats have found their Senator Thelma and she wants to render Grover Norquist and his anti-tax pledge irrelevant. Can President Obama and the Democrats hold the line? MSNBC's Lawrence O'Donnell discusses with MSNBC Contributors economist Jared Bernstein and the Washington Post's Ezra Klein.

msnbc
 
No bluff. The Republican House will simply extend all the tax cuts. If the Senate and the President do not go along, the Middle Class will get the biggest tax raise in history, a bigger percentage raise than the hated rich.
 
Benvolio said:
No bluff. The Republican House will simply extend all the tax cuts. If the Senate and the President do not go along, the Middle Class will get the biggest tax raise in history, a bigger percentage raise than the hated rich.
Click to expand...

so your admitting that republicans are trying to hold us hostage and that the rich are hated. i see im making progress here. :biggrin:
 
I sincerely hope both the inept congress critters push us off the cliff and the One Trillion in cuts goes into effect. It wont substantially hurt anything but massive rich bottom lines. That is fine with me. It puts us almost immediately on a path to debt payoff. There is bipartisan support to restore or not even cut portions of the military because democrats and republicans in their states and districts benefit every single day from defense spending.

So lets push.... and this convo could easily be between bohner and Pelosi


 
Oh and in Feb they could pass a tax break for the people who need it.... after all the wheels fall off...
 
JayHawk said:
Oh and in Feb they could pass a tax break for the people who need it.... after all the wheels fall off...
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yeah. i love how corporate america and the wealthy class are always threatening us with economic calamity if things dont go their way, theyre so nice arent they?

then you have apologists who couldnt pass the 3rd grade.
 
If all the cuts are extended, no one is holding anyone hostage.
 
It is a rational policy. With a weak economy, probably slipping back into recession, we should not be raising taxes.
 
Benvolio said:
It is a rational policy. With a weak economy, probably slipping back into recession, we should not be raising taxes.
Click to expand...

Both the government and civil services like police, libraries and schools are paid for by taxes.
.
There are 3 options to pay for those necessities:

1) Cut back the budget on these services. This means that firemen and teachers get a huge pay cut. Which means they spend less money and pay less in taxes.

2) Get rid of food stamps and other social aid programs. Then poor people can't eat, and either they get sick (adding to healthcare costs) or they resort to crime (filling up jails and costing more taxpayer money than just giving them food stamps).

3) Raise taxes to pay for these services.

I choose Door #3

If someone knows some other way to pay for the military or congress without resorting to paying policemen less than minimum wage, I'd like to hear it.
 
FuryOfFirestorm said:
Both the government and civil services like police, libraries and schools are paid for by taxes.
.
There are 3 options to pay for those necessities:

1) Cut back the budget on these services. This means that firemen and teachers get a huge pay cut. Which means they spend less money and pay less in taxes.

2) Get rid of food stamps and other social aid programs. Then poor people can't eat, and either they get sick (adding to healthcare costs) or they resort to crime (filling up jails and costing more taxpayer money than just giving them food stamps).
1. Police etc are paid from local taxes, rather than federal income tax. Many cities are going bankrupt because of extravagant benefit extorted in the past. But here we are talking about federal taxes.
3) Raise taxes to pay for these services.

I choose Door #3

If someone knows some other way to pay for the military or congress without resorting to paying policemen less than minimum wage, I'd like to hear it.
Click to expand...
1. Police etc are paid by localities, not from federal taxes. We have no choice but to scale down the benefits extorted in the past, as many cities are going bankrupt.
2. The Dems are actively encouraging illegal aliens to take food stamps as a fom of vote buying. We are not allowed to ask for ID, remember? The programs should be a safety net, not a multigenerational way of life. Hussein has eliminated the work requirement to buy votes. These programs must be scaled down to move people into the work force. If you care about the poor, should we not stop immporting them.
3. Raising taxes during a recession takes money out of the economy and makes it worse. In better times we should raise taxes but the Dem plan of shouldering the entire burden on fewer and fewer people is turning us into a nation of beggars--people voting for benefits for themselves paid entirely by others. Hussein hopes to destroy capitalism, simply by taxing away the capital.
 
Benvolio said:
1. Police etc are paid by localities, not from federal taxes. We have no choice but to scale down the benefits extorted in the past, as many cities are going bankrupt.
2. The Dems are actively encouraging illegal aliens to take food stamps as a fom of vote buying. We are not allowed to ask for ID, remember? The programs should be a safety net, not a multigenerational way of life. Hussein has eliminated the work requirement to buy votes. These programs must be scaled down to move people into the work force. If you care about the poor, should we not stop immporting them.
3. Raising taxes during a recession takes money out of the economy and makes it worse. In better times we should raise taxes but the Dem plan of shouldering the entire burden on fewer and fewer people is turning us into a nation of beggars--people voting for benefits for themselves paid entirely by others. Hussein hopes to destroy capitalism, simply by taxing away the capital.
Click to expand...

I'd love to see some proof of your second assertion.

Please do explain how your third assertion is true.

And you still haven't given your explanation on how to pay for congress and the military without cutting back everything severely.
 
I don't think it is going to be that hard a sell, there are enough Democrats who think that raising taxes in a bad economy is not a good thing to make it quite possible to push an extension through.
 
Thynight said:
How nice of you to admit that Republicans are holding things hostage until they get their way.
Click to expand...

No, as i said in #2 above, the Republican House will simply adopt a bill extending the tax cuts. What hostage?
 
Hussein is actively encouraging illegal immigrants to come to the US and collect food stamps.The Food Stamp President of Mexico | Power Line
What does Hussein expect in return? He is trying to keep states from requiring an ID to vote. Accordingly, he is persecuting the Arizona sheriff for trying to keep catch illegals. Simultaneously, he is giving amnesty to young illegals. Will the illegal vote be enough to rescue his candidacy? No way, Jose.

As for #3, this thread is about the fiscal cliff, i.e. the recession which would result from the tax increase if the cuts are not extended. The Dems are playing chicken with the economy, threatening to let the cuts expire if they do not get their class warfare.
 
Benvolio said:
Hussein is actively encouraging illegal immigrants to come to the US and collect food stamps.The Food Stamp President of Mexico | Power Line
What does Hussein expect in return? He is trying to keep states from requiring an ID to vote. Accordingly, he is persecuting the Arizona sheriff for trying to keep catch illegals. Simultaneously, he is giving amnesty to young illegals. Will the illegal vote be enough to rescue his candidacy? No way, Jose.

As for #3, this thread is about the fiscal cliff, i.e. the recession which would result from the tax increase if the cuts are not extended. The Dems are playing chicken with the economy, threatening to let the cuts expire if they do not get their class warfare.
Click to expand...

A semi-coherent rant from some nutbar on a Breitbart-clone site is the best proof of your #2 assertion, Benny?

Please explain how extending this tax break will make the economy better? We have had that tax break since the Bush II era, and it didn't make everything better, did it?

I'm still waiting for your solution on how to pay for congress and government without raising taxes, Benny.
 
BTW - Obama tried to pass a bill that would give tax breaks to businesses that hired Americans instead of outsourcing jobs to other countries... but guess who voted it down? Go ahead...guess.

GOP senators block top Obama jobs initiative - CNN.com

Tax breaks! More jobs for Americans! He was giving it it to you guys, and you turned it down! I guess it was Obama's fault that all but 4 Republicans blocked it. Damn him and his Kenyan Voodoo Mind Control Powers for making them vote against tax breaks and more US jobs! DAMN HIM TO HELL! *shakes fist"
 
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