On-Topic Edward Snowden: NSA Whistleblower Revealed, Interview

[rareboy]

When the heck did Harke ever post here and what harassment? Hey Lost....you're just delusional on this one.

 

[Corny]

Wow, it's interesting how, again, you tell me what I think. Pure dishonesty? I think I know better what I think of my government. Or what I think of any other government. I have a lot of criticism for my government. Contrary you to the blind patriot likes of you, I am able of critical reflected thoughts about my country. But this is also of no interest here, just as your further miserable ad hominem and tu quoque failures.

And you know what's funny? Just like I didn't criticize the companies in this thread, I neither criticized the NSA or the US government in this thread. Go back to page one and re-read the thread. In case you don't remember: this thread was about Mr. Snowden. Not about you, not about me. But you're like the really small but really loud dogs, that bark no matter what.

 

[JayHawk]

Fish don't fry in the kitchen;
Beans don't burn on the grill.
Took a whole lotta tryin'
Just to get up that hill.
Now we up in the big leagues
Gettin' our turn at bat.
As long as we live, it's you and me baby
There ain't nothin wrong with that.
Well we're movin on up,
To the east side.
To a deluxe apartment in the sky.
Movin on up
To the east side.
We finally got a piece of the pie.

Seems just about as apt as the current discussion. Why the worldly posters figured they could turn this into a "you fucking guys" chit chat I have no idea. However, it surely does not further discussion but neither does basing a discussion on tin foils hats and supposed infractions of the law.

 

[JayHawk]

Oh just so.... all about Snowden...

So enquiring minds, why did he steal four laptops and then proceed to our biggest global intelligence competitor? Musta been their record for human rights and such...lol. The sad part is he has you dolts lapping it up like creme of some yung guy.

 

[Corny]

^ as I said earlier, I don't believe that this was smart move:

http://www.justusboys.com/forum/thr...ed-Interview?p=8951280&viewfull=1#post8951280

But honestly, which other options did he have? Do you honestly believe he would receive a fair process? Or even keep his basic human rights (see Manning). He already got his passport revoked, limiting his freedom of movement while he has an active request for asylum. This is a human rights violation already (and the WHO commented on it). What do you think what would happen to him if he would have stayed in the US?

I doubt that his initial plan included going to Russia. But Russia for sure has his hands on him now. The cold war supposedly is over for some time now. If only, we learnt from this now is that the cold war was merely the warm up. The war of the agencies continues, "just" without nuclear weapons. Kinda.

 

[JayHawk]

Nah I have known for a long time who our enemies are and who they will remain. Trying different diplomatic methods does not equate to laying down all security measures. The four guys before him who have raised suspicions that the NSA is overreaching its authority still live in quite the open and free society as here. manning was a criminal just as Snowden is a criminal and neither deserve any extra precaution. Guess what? Snowden will affect as much change as the guys not considered criminal -- that is none. how many congressional or senatorial panels have been erected for this versus the IRS?

 

[rareboy]

There is a certain delicious irony that he is caught in the never never land of an airport departures area in Russia.

 

[JayHawk]

I think the most delicious irony are these government leaders attempting to now say that if the NSA spied on them they would be upset. What morons, they did not think all spying is on all persons external to the country doing the spying? My god we spy on our closest ally the UK and guess what? They spy on us.

"There's a certain schadenfreude here that we're important enough to be spied on," said one of the officials. "This was bound to come out one day. And I wouldn't be surprised if some of our member states were not doing the same to the Americans."

You can bet your ass the countries that can afford to do it are spying on us as well.

 

[Telstra]

I suspect Russia has already copied all Snowden's harddrives ?
If that is true, it is the US fault for not letting Snowden stays in Hong Kong.

 

[JayHawk]

I suspect Russia has already copied all Snowden's harddrives ?
If that is true, it is the US fault for not letting Snowden stays in Hong Kong.

please apply Telstra logic to this so I can understand... you imply we should have either invaded Hong Kong to get him back or snet in the black helicopters???? really dude.... turn off Alex Jones it makes ya think funny.

 

[Telstra]

please apply Telstra logic to this so I can understand... you imply we should have either invaded Hong Kong to get him back or snet in the black helicopters???? really dude.... turn off Alex Jones it makes ya think funny.

Believe it or not, i don't watch Alex Jones, i hate his guts.
My logic stands, don't you think it is better for Snowden to stay in Hong Kong or let Russia copy all his harddrives ?


*remember Snowden wanted to stay in Hong Kong but the US forced him to run.

 

[JayHawk]

The US didnt force him to run, CHina wanted nothing to do with it. Mostly because they feel quite confident in their own spying abilities.

So what you are saying is the US should have forgotten it was a country of laws? Snowden wasn't asking for poltical assylum either when he was stripped of his passport, he sought asylum after ending up in a Russian catch 22. Weird huh?

 

[Telstra]

The US didnt force him to run, CHina wanted nothing to do with it. Mostly because they feel quite confident in their own spying abilities.

So what you are saying is the US should have forgotten it was a country of laws? Snowden wasn't asking for poltical assylum either when he was stripped of his passport, he sought asylum after ending up in a Russian catch 22. Weird huh?

It is 110% obvious that snowden was forced to run.
Now Russia has copied all his hard drives i assumed.

 

[JayHawk]

It is 110% obvious that snowden was forced to run.
Now Russia has copied all his hard drives i assumed.

He was a criminal then and he is a criminal now. Just like his inept plan, his escape has proven inept as well. He remains in limbo.

 

[Lostlover]

He was a criminal then and he is a criminal now. Just like his inept plan, his escape has proven inept as well. He remains in limbo.

What world are these people living in?

Snowden commits a criminal act and is "forced to run." Seriously?

In what world can you qualify a criminal being "forced to run" after intentionally breaking a law

 

[Lostlover]

I've been neither harassing Harke (with whom I haven't interacted in years), nor running from Jack (of whom, despite his political opinopns, I have a much higher opinion than of you). I have a general disrespect for your miserable attempts at a "discussion". You are deflecting open discussion, you are ruining threads. It's probably not a surprise for anyone that of all JUB user, you are the one that has been most warned and infracted of all. YOU are one of the reasons that hardly anybody uses this forum except for the usual republican vs democrats circlejerk. And this is a topic which should be completely outside of this circlejerk, so you have to look for something else. Note that there are several other posters in this thread on "your side", but none of them manages to derail the thread or pointing fingers. I'm not sure if I can rule out that you really have that lack of reading comprehension or if you are doing it on purpose. Given your history here, I do believe you're doing it on purpose. And I'm obviously not the only one sick and tired of your shit.

Congratulations, you did it again.

Ask Harke if he feels harassed by you. He might not. I don't talk to him. But I do know that you were always quick to comment about his comments on Muslims, without saying why you disagreed with him. That was something I noticed. Evidently you were trying to play thought cop and an outsider (me) noticed.

I never asked you for your opinion of me. Nor did I even give you the hint that I cared what you thought of me personally.

I think you've shown what you're about in that you don't like to be questioned especially when it comes to your own country. If you gave a damn about anything you've said here, you have serious issues with your own government. Again, last week a German court refused to release documents and names from WWII.

How's that for transparency?

I "did it again" by daring to ask you questions you never intended to answer about the matter. Which is why you ran initially from Jack Springer when he turned the tables on you. It's funny in that you are baffled that someone would question Germany's recent history. Surely, you had to have seen it coming.

And, I read perfectly fine. If I didn't, I guess my academic scholarships were wasted.

(BTW: for someone who cares about staying on topic, please tell me how your response stayed on topic?)

 

[Telstra]

He was a criminal then and he is a criminal now. Just like his inept plan, his escape has proven inept as well. He remains in limbo.

umm US law only apply to the US.
Other countries don't agree with the US law meaning he is not a criminal out side the US.
And now all his harddrives being copied by the Russians, only the US has it self to blame for this.

And you didn't answer my question,
Is it better for Snowden to stay in Hong Kong (all secrets in his hands) or in Russia (all secrets in russian hands).

 

[tigerfan482]

There are legal means in place for any government employee to report suspected abuses and illegal activities. They range from talking to your supervisor to contacting Congress directly. He could have followed the legal avenues and still be living with his cush job and girlfriend in Hawaii. Instead, he stole secrets and ran off to our enemies.

And if anyone thinks that our secrets were safe in Hong Kong, you obviously know nothing about China's knack for stealing anything and everything. In fact, they probably already had it from the hacking they've done.

 

[JayHawk]

What world are these people living in?

Snowden commits a criminal act and is "forced to run." Seriously?

In what world can you qualify a criminal being "forced to run" after intentionally breaking a law

I don't necessarily agree with all you say but honestly, this "he is a hero" crap kills me. Some people still think that 911 was orchestrated. There just isnt enough tin foil in the world

 

[bankside]

Even US law has something called Whistleblower Protection, because there is recognition that this kind of action may be necessary, ethical, and correct. The whole point is to encourage leaks of embarrassing or damaging information when it shows wrongdoing, government overreach, and to protect the individual from retaliation by the embarrassed government.

http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2013/06/surveillance-0

LET'S get the most contentious point out of the way first: Edward Snowden made the right call to make public the extent of the National Security Administration's surveillance of electronic communications. The American people can now have a debate about whether or not they consent to that level of surveillance in order to prevent terrorist attacks, a debate that we were previously denied by the government's unwillingness to disclose even the broad outlines of what the NSA was doing. There may be some slight risk that knowing more about the breadth of NSA surveillance will lead terrorists to take better precautions in concealing their communications. But that risk seems manageable, and is of far less importance than the ability of Americans, and the rest of the world for that matter, to finally have an honest discussion about how much we think our governments should be able to see of our online behaviour.

One does not have to be a tin foil milliner to believe Snowden acted with integrity and did something of value for free societies. To suggest it's one and the same with 9/11 conspiracy theorists is just an empty tantrum, not an argument.

For the record, there is also a big difference between Snowden (who disclosed a specific piece of information, after he considered the potential harm to society of keeping it secret, and found the consequences of secrecy to be detrimental to society and alarming) and Manning (who was having a tantrum of his own, had no purpose or reasoned consideration behind his disclosure except to "get even," and did nothing to mitigate the effects of leaking information indiscriminately.)