End Gay4Pay

[JasunStrikesBack]

I thought of Jensen, but he was advertised as bisexual,

Not by us. He's had sex with girls before but calls himself gay. So... no different than me now, really.

It annoys me when gay men say the sexual identity of the performer doesn't matter because it does matter as you state. I would also mention Tucker Scott/Dean Phoenix as another one that shows being gay in gp does make a difference.

An excellent example.

gay men in online porn doing straight scenes. Next Door is obsessed with doing that.

Meh.. We've done that twice, although the second time, we didn't know we were doing it. Arpad wanted to do a straight scene just for a lark and to show that he could do it. The other guy... we offered him the SG4GE scene and he said he'd do it... didn't tell us he was gay until afterward. I thought he was straight too. Go figure.

 

[cmlei70]

Meh.. We've done that twice, although the second time, we didn't know we were doing it. Arpad wanted to do a straight scene just for a lark and to show that he could do it. The other guy... we offered him the SG4GE scene and he said he'd do it... didn't tell us he was gay until afterward. I thought he was straight too. Go figure.

That plays to what I'm talking about. Miklos did that scene to prove how much of a man he was. "See, I'm a real man. I can fuck a woman." He then follows that up with comments so homophobic he could have been copying them out of an ex-gay ministry pamphlet. I refuse to watch any scene or buy any movie he's in. I know he's tried to backtrack from his remarks, but I have a zero tolerance for that thing. I would never tolerate those kinds of comments from a straight person so why should I tolerate them from a "gay" performer? I know people say it's just gay porn, and I'm overthinking it, but so many gay men form their sexual identity through gay porn, and what does it say to them that a gay man like Miklos would make those kinds of comments?

Not by us. He's had sex with girls before but calls himself gay. So... no different than me now, really.

I'm glad he calls himself gay. CocksureMen really should advertise that part because it's not well known, and a lot of men would appreciate that.

 

[JasunStrikesBack]

That plays to what I'm talking about. Miklos did that scene to prove how much of a man he was. "See, I'm a real man. I can fuck a woman."

Oh I don't think that's it at all. He just wanted to show that he could do it.

Kinda like when Meryl Streep made those comedy movies in the 90s.

 

[cmlei70]

Oh I don't think that's it at all. He just wanted to show that he could do it..

Why even do a straight scene to prove he could do it. Prove it to whom? The whole thing left a sour taste in my mouth, but it doesn't matter as I don't watch anything he does. He's like Fox NEws. I just skip right past him.

If we're going to talk about g4p, we should mention someone like Jeremy Bilding. He does straight and gay scenes, but he's always 100 percent committed to his gay scenes. His cocksuremen scene with Kelly Taylor for ex. is one of my favorites. Sexy, playful, and if you didn't know any better, you'd think Bilding was gay based on that scene. If all g4pers were like that, there wouldn't be an issue. He doesn't insult gay fans and he has a sense of humor about the whole thing.

 

[JasunStrikesBack]

If we're going to talk about g4p, we should mention someone like Jeremy Bilding. He does straight and gay scenes, but he's always 100 percent committed to his gay scenes. His cocksuremen scene with Kelly Taylor for ex. is one of my favorites. Sexy, playful, and if you didn't know any better, you'd think Bilding was gay based on that scene. If all g4pers were like that, there wouldn't be an issue. He doesn't insult gay fans and he has a sense of humor about the whole thing.

VERY true... but then why can't Arpad do the same thing in reverse? HE was totally committed to the scene and I think many of us in the industry start to get tired of hearing that straight men can't have gay sex when many of us gay guys have convincingly had straight sex.

I dunno... it's a dead horse now. And Arpad can defend himself. But I still don't really understand the extreme negative reaction some people had to that scene. Maybe i'm just too close to it.

 

[Hellax24]

Who exactly in their right mind uses porn to form their sexual identity? Not all gay men watch porn. Their identity is form by the multitude of media their are exposed to each day TV, radio, etc. It is also formed largely by their upbringing, culture, relationships with friends, status in school. Not fucking porn. I came out at 15 and the only porn i could get my hands on was str8 porn. It didn't form my sexuality watching men have sex with women. It just gave me the opportunity to see hot guys have sex and get off watching them.

Now, there are times when the G4P thing gets to me, like Bo Dean being made the first ever exclusive for cocksure. There have been so many scenes that he has done that looks like he wanted to be anywhere else then making the video he was doing at the time. I'm happy they have finally have an out gay model as an exclusive, though the Str8 company that Jasun accused of copying his scene had an out gay exclusive first, Drew Cutler.

Now, back to this whole Mason Wyler thing. Mason, Himself blogged about being fired. Then Nextdoor said he wasn't and would be doing web shows, yet his last one scheduled 2 months ago never happened. My question to the universe is was Mason lying, telling the truth or confusing reality with fantasy?


Bottom line: I don't care if someone is gay or str8 as long as they do their jobs and perform. Because the online studios are in no hurry to feature more out gay models then they already do.

CXXX

 

[JasunStrikesBack]

Who exactly in their right mind uses porn to form their sexual identity?

I sure did... but then... I'm a bit of a freak.

 

[cmlei70]

VERY true... but then why can't Arpad do the same thing in reverse? HE was totally committed to the scene and I think many of us in the industry start to get tired of hearing that straight men can't have gay sex when many of us gay guys have convincingly had straight sex.

I dunno... it's a dead horse now. And Arpad can defend himself. But I still don't really understand the extreme negative reaction some people had to that scene. Maybe i'm just too close to it.

I'm like Paul Wagner. I have never had sex with a woman. Never wanted to. I was always out. Never pretended or felt ashamed. MY family has always supported me. In fact, I've often felt overly proud of being a five star gay.

MY short answer to your difficult question is: So many gay men don't see positive representations of gay male sexuality. GP is their only outlet and they form their gay identity from the gay sex they see. Most of these men have been victimized for being gay so they latch on to a gay porn performer to make themselves feel good about being gay. When they see a gay performer like Miklos or Blake Riley or Cameron Marshall do a straight scene, it plays on the fear that gay can be changed especially when the promotions read, "Blake Riley goes straight and loves it." The message sent is that these gay men can really turn straight. It's no different from churches or homophobes saying it's just a phase.

 

[cmlei70]

Who exactly in their right mind uses porn to form their sexual identity? Not all gay men watch porn. Their identity is form by the multitude of media their are exposed to each day TV, radio, etc. It is also formed largely by their upbringing, culture, relationships with friends, status in school. Not fucking porn. I came out at 15 and the only porn i could get my hands on was str8 porn. It didn't form my sexuality watching men have sex with women. It just gave me the opportunity to see hot guys have sex and get off watching them.

You're lucky because a lot of gay men do form their sexual identities through gay porn. It's often their only outlet especially if they are in more isolated gay unfriendly areas. I've lost count of the number of times I've encountered people offline and online who tell me that gay porn was their first exposure to gay sex. Straight porn or skinemax is readily available. Gay sex either in porn or in mainstream movies is hard to locate especially if you're in living in an anti-gay environment.

 

[JasunStrikesBack]

Fair enough. I know that when I found a gay porn rag when I was 16, it was my salvation... seeing that gay men could be hot and sexy and love sex and not be ashamed of who they were... it's one reason why I love to incorporate so many smiles and so much laughing and joking around.

But I don't necessarily see Arpad having a laugh in one scene and still calling himself gay really... changing that for me.

 

[cmlei70]

Fair enough. I know that when I found a gay porn rag when I was 16, it was my salvation... seeing that gay men could be hot and sexy and love sex and not be ashamed of who they were... it's one reason why I love to incorporate so many smiles and so much laughing and joking around.

But I don't necessarily see Arpad having a laugh in one scene and still calling himself gay really... changing that for me.

You speak to what I'm talking about. Gay porn can be so important for some men and that's why I'm single minded in wanting gay porn to be so gay sex positive.

I didn't use porn to form my gay identity. I did it on my own and with the help of my parents who bought me gay books and gay themed films. But if you're family and church constantly tell you that gay is a choice, you can be straight; gay is sinful, it's devastating when you see a gp performer like the ones mentioned telling you the same thing. This is not my experience, but it is the experience of many men I know.

 

[mm12]

I completely agree, gay for pay is wrong and should end now! But it's not just porn that this is happening to: I watched the movie Prince of Persia today and was appalled to see that Jake Gyllenhaal was portraying the title character, despite the fact he is neither a prince or a Persian. And then the other day I watched a film called Hairspray featuring John Travolta playing a woman, even thought he himself is a man. It's a conspiracy I tells ya; this kind of mainstream deception has been happening for decades.

Please, for the good of society, these lies need to be stopped!

 

[KURT10677]

Gay for pay is a myth, though a damaging and sad one. The notion that men who have sex with men over and over on camera could be straight is ludicrous. The fact that some sad gay porn fans actually believe they are straight is pathetic, a reflection of the fact that so many gay men suffer from a profound inferiority complex that makes them fantasize about unattainable straight males. Outside of a subset of gullible gay porn fans, PEOPLE do NOT believe that these gays could be straight. The idea that they are doing it simply for the money makes people laugh and roll their eyes, beyond a naive minority of gay porn fans.

At the same time, it is even more tragic that some gay and bisexual men are so in denial and hate their sexuality so much that even when they engage in public sex acts, they deny their obvious sexual orientation. There is nothing sexy about bisexual and gay men in denial.

How do you all the men that do gay 4 gay pay are gay. Gay men are always trying to make someone out to be gay, and I'm sure your talking all this shit but I bet you sit up and watch all str8 stuff. and all the bullshit your writing about everyone else is probaly really you.

 

[Schizosan]

It comes down to basic concepts you either like watching two guys get it on without worrying about what is going in their wallets (God forbid we let people live their own life and have their own careers) or you get over it.

When I'm watching porn, I am not going "Hm, I wonder if these guys are straight and being paid to get fucked." I'm usually saying, "Wreck that shit, yo!" In my brain, because out loud it would sound a little crazy without a sex partner.

But this is my opinion, to each his own. : )

 

[cmlei70]

mm12, if you're going to use mainstream films to show the idiocy of disliking g4p (assuming that's your position), how about citing real examples? I'm a film buff, and the longest one I can think of is the anger over non-Asian men playing Charlie Chan. And the controversy over that has lasted over 70 years! The controversy is so bad that an American film channel had to cancel a Chan movie marathon because Asians were/are upset that an Asian actor did not play Chan. OR you have white actors in blackface. Or hispanic characters played by whites. It's not just a g4p thing. It's a representation thing.

A g4p similar debate in mainstream films: Look at the gay men and lesbians who are furious that they have a lesbian sleep with a man in the Annette Bening/Julianne Moore movie. It's the same shit repeatedly: all a lesbian needs is a good man. I've seen some gay men write, "Get over it. It's just a movie." That's ridiculous. Most of us don't live in a vacuum, and we get out impressions of other people and cultures from the media so images and representations do matter.

Let's say that labeling doesn't matter in gay porn. They're just bodies. Who's really in favor of labels? It's the dvd and online companies that are for labeling. Why label sexuality at all? Why not just have the performers perform as some successful companies do. Most studios do it because labels are very important to the companies. Why else do they insist on reminding viewers that they are watching a "Straight hunk" have gay sex? Why else does Chi-Chi Larue list a performer as gay who said from the beginning he's straight, but now says he's bi? Why do straight performers say they're bi? (Good way to check on the fake bisexuals: check their following list on Twitter). Or gay men say they're bi? OR gay men who pretend to be straight? I joked on Twitter about a gp performer interviewed by Michael Lucas. He was asked about his sexuality. He said, "I'm str...bisexual."

 

[Telstra]

I completely agree, gay for pay is wrong and should end now! But it's not just porn that this is happening to: I watched the movie Prince of Persia today and was appalled to see that Jake Gyllenhaal was portraying the title character, despite the fact he is neither a prince or a Persian. And then the other day I watched a film called Hairspray featuring John Travolta playing a woman, even thought he himself is a man. It's a conspiracy I tells ya; this kind of mainstream deception has been happening for decades.

Please, for the good of society, these lies need to be stopped!

i don't see that is going to happen.
Unless you can replace porn with something else.

 

[cmlei70]

This is very interesting it reminds me of the old hollywood indian movies where american indians were always portrayed as belligerent savages who attacked poor white people...and take a look at the more recent Avatar for example...what do we have?A white random boy who teaches "blue savages" how to fight and saves them from other white folks....Isn't it the same shit over and over only with a lot of CGI? and apparent good intentions?

OR the noble white woman who saves the savage black man--The Blind Side. White people are always saving or protecting themselves from non-white savages. A gay porn equivalent is how "straight" and "masculine" is seen as the ultimate, what you want to achieve, what you want to fuck. The less "masculine" men are less than, are there solely to be used by the ideal, straight or straight acting (a term I hate) man.

Porn actors are working so I don't blame them for changing their sexuality according to a market demand,if the trend was being effeminate 90% of them, str8 included, would act naturally effeminate or pretend to be...it's a job,it's an act so I can't really blame them for not being honest or having more balls to say no to studios that push the st8 image...

I don't blame the models per se until they start spouting off about how gay sex is so disgusting, how it's so difficult it is for them, how many diseases are in gay porn, etc. Most g4pers will eventually do this. OF course, once they can't find work elsewhere, they crawl back, and gullible gays will fall for them. EX. Jason Adonis.

recently I've started to see more and more guys turning bi overnight,probably they are afraid of the negative feedback g4p get online...speaking about Lucas I appreciate studios like LE,say whatever you want about him,but he never portrays gays as the "lucky" dudes who have the privilege to sit on a str8 cock...quite the opposite

A lot of straight guys pretend to be bi in the porn industry. When I see a performer lists himself as bi, I immediately know he's probably straight. Although, gay performers are now claiming to be bi. I've joked that "bi" is the new gay. Again, it's a sign that labels do matter or the performers and/or studios wouldn't put so much emphasis on them.

Michael Lucas doesn't play the straight guy is the desired one card. He's all about gay sex. His interviews are interesting. He brings out the guys' personality for better (Ex. Parker London) or worse (Rod Daily).

 

[wooffy]

But I don't necessarily see Arpad having a laugh in one scene and still calling himself gay really... changing that for me.

I'm not familiar with the details of Arpad's straight scene (though I had heard of it) or any comments he made about it. I don't think, however, that being able to do an act for money really means much.

When I was in college, a bunch of the straight jock types got all shocked and traumatized because they say naked photos of men when picking up film in the drying cabinet (this was a photography program). Of course they assumed one of only two out gay men in the class shot the photos, because you had to be gay to be able to shoot erotic photos of a man (somehow they ignored the straight women in the class, and the several openly bi people).

To prove a point, I shot female nudes for an assignment - and no blushing virgin shots, these were as racy as I could get away with. The straight jocks were traumatized again at the fag who took hot photos of a chick... and asked me for copies of the prints ;-)

 

[cmlei70]

As ridiculous as Rod Daily came off with Lucas looking fascinated and condescending at the same time, Rusty Stevens came off as a total asshole. Parker London could not even keep a straight (ha!) face during some of his comments. It pissed me off because Stevens perpetuates the notion that gay men are gay because they hate women. Why not just say you're gay? When he caught flack for barebacking, it was said that he got the flack because he was gay, and the other barebackers were straight so they were let off the hook.

 

[JasunStrikesBack]

Well I've interviewed Parker and Rusty and I think they both came off pretty damn well.

Parker is a SWEET guy. Whenever he shoots with us, he always comes into my office, curls up on my couch and goes to sleep.