Healthcare going forward

[Kulindahr]

I'm actually surprised that you didn't make a Sadducees reference. Funny how human nature remains the same across the millennia.

LOL

I sometimes have to explain who the Pharisees were; the Sadducees were even more obscure. Though you're right; it would make a decent reference.

 

[thewiz]

There's a couple of things here.

Once upon a time, there were a group of evangelicals who railed against a Presidental candidates who were divorced or against a President who cheated on his wife. Now, we're dealing with a group of "prosperity gospel" power-players who are willing to vote for a foul-mouthed billionaire who not only cheated on his three wives, he also bragged about sexually assaulting women. Those faux religious leaders are cut from the same cloth as Trump and they've supported him in exchange for legislation that they want.

They got their proxy Pence in the White House to get these pro-religious favors codified into a government that is not supposed to advocate for any particular religious. The political horse-trading that got Trump into the White House includes legislation that gives them the right to impose their religious beliefs on others. And, if they have their way, it will include legislation that allows them to both advocate for political parties and political candidates but retain their tax-exempt status.

The other thing that is going on is that they're interested in keeping the culture wars going because it's a major distraction to gay organizations and it siphons cash from liberal organizations that will fight against this kind of pandering legislation and executive orders.

Don't be fooled. The way to deal with this nonsense is to remind these holier-than-thou types that if they aren't willing to take care of patients who need their services, it's time for them to find another career. Patients pick their healthcare providers; healthcare providers don't pick their patients.

And get this Adminstration out of the White House as soon as possible.

In his day Jesus called the religious (as did John the Baptist) "A Brood of Vipers." Something tells me that after meeting today's Evangelicals, He'd repeat the same term.

 

[gsdx]

In his day Jesus called the religious (as did John the Baptist) "A Brood of Vipers." Something tells me that after meeting today's Evangelicals, He'd repeat the same term.

Evangelicals conveniently forget that verse along with a lot of other verses that tell them how not to be Christian.

 

[KaraBulut]

In his day Jesus called the religious (as did John the Baptist) "A Brood of Vipers." Something tells me that after meeting today's Evangelicals, He'd repeat the same term.

Well, and the related verse from Isaiah:

Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

Applicable to a lot of disinformation and perversion of truth that has gone on lately, as well as the Dominionist minions that are complicit.

It's worth noting that during the ACA repeal [STRIKE]debate[/STRIKE] Republican sabotage, these same evangelicals were largely silent. The US Conference of Catholic Bishops spoke out in opposition to ACA repeal and about the effects of a repeal on the poor (and they made similar statements about the delayed renewal of CHIP).

On the other hand, groups like FRC put out statements supporting the repeal and defunding of the ACA, apparently ignorant of the existence of the New Testament. And of course, Tony Perkins of FRC and Franklin Graham are out and about saying that Trump deserves a mulligan for his "past sins" (conveniently changing the subject about the current sins).

 

[Kulindahr]

Evangelicals conveniently forget that verse along with a lot of other verses that tell them how not to be Christian.

Oh, they know the verse, but they say it applies to "liberals" who want to make the government into God. How they can say that and not see that they're trying to do the same thing, just the other side of the coin, baffles me.

 

[Kulindahr]

Well, and the related verse from Isaiah:


Applicable to a lot of disinformation and perversion of truth that has gone on lately, as well as the Dominionist minions that are complicit.

It's worth noting that during the ACA repeal [STRIKE]debate[/STRIKE] Republican sabotage, these same evangelicals were largely silent. The US Conference of Catholic Bishops spoke out in opposition to ACA repeal and about the effects of a repeal on the poor (and they made similar statements about the delayed renewal of CHIP).

On the other hand, groups like FRC put out statements supporting the repeal and defunding of the ACA, apparently ignorant of the existence of the New Testament. And of course, Tony Perkins of FRC and Franklin Graham are out and about saying that Trump deserves a mulligan for his "past sins" (conveniently changing the subject about the current sins).

They REALLY need to read what Martin Luther, the greatest of the Reformers, had to say about government. He said flat out that it's better to have a total unbeliever at the helm if that unbeliever was virtuous and honorable than a Christian who couldn't be trusted.

It's why I've long despised (just about ever since I've ever been a Christian) the Calvinist and Zwinglian versions of reformation: both teach that entangling church and state is just fine, so long as the church dominates.

 

[KaraBulut]

A follow-up to the costs of pharmaceuticals discussions:

The Attorney General for the state of Connecticut is suing generic drug makers for price-fixing. He has evidence that before generic drug prices were increased- some have been increased as much as 1000%- the manufacturers of the drugs had phone exchanges in which they both agreed to raise their prices.

"Massive fraud" by generic drug makers an "attack on the American people," Connecticut AG says

Twenty of the biggest generic prescription drug makers are accused of committing a multi-billion-dollar fraud in the U.S. Forty-three states and Puerto Rico filed a complaint Friday alleging the companies coordinated to inflate prices and reduce competition on more than 100 generic prescription drugs...

"What blew this thing wide open are the phone records. And we've gotten, I think, 11 million phone records, seven million documents and they started piecing it together," Tong said.

Around the times of the price increases of certain generic drugs, Tong said competitors starting calling each other at high rates.

Also, WaPo recently published an investigation into the cost of Truvada - which costs between $1,300 to $1,700 per month. This has become a bigger issue now that the drug is being prescribed to HIV- people as pre-exposure prophylaxis (PrEP). Truvada was developed using Federal grant money- the US taxpayers paid for it. Gilead has been profiting off a drug that US taxpayers paid to develop.

An HIV treatment cost taxpayers millions. The government patented it. But a pharma giant is making billions. [WaPo]

Thomas Folks spent years in his U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention lab developing a treatment to block deadly HIV in monkeys. Then San Francisco AIDS researcher Robert Grant, using $50 million in federal grants, proved the treatment worked in people who engaged in risky sex.
Their work — almost fully funded by U.S. taxpayers — created a new use for an older prescription drug called Truvada: preventing HIV infection. But the U.S. government, which patented the treatment in 2015, is not receiving a penny for that use of the drug from Gilead Sciences, ¬Truvada’s maker, which earned $3 billion in Truvada sales last year.

 

[gsdx]

^ FYI - PrEP in Ontario:

PrEP used to cost over $1000 per month. Now, with generic Truvada approved in Canada, PrEP costs between $250 and $280 per month in Ontario depending on your pharmacy. This is the amount that you will pay for PrEP if you do not have any insurance coverage.

Most insurance plans now cover PrEP, including the Ontario Drug Benefit program. If you are 24 years old or under, your prescription medications, including PrEP, PEP and HIV medications are covered under OHIP+. Most university and college health benefits plans also cover PrEP.

https://www.get-prep.com/prep-costs

 

[KaraBulut]

^ FYI - PrEP in Ontario:

PrEP used to cost over $1000 per month. Now, with generic Truvada approved in Canada, PrEP costs between $250 and $280 per month in Ontario depending on your pharmacy. This is the amount that you will pay for PrEP if you do not have any insurance coverage.

Most insurance plans now cover PrEP, including the Ontario Drug Benefit program. If you are 24 years old or under, your prescription medications, including PrEP, PEP and HIV medications are covered under OHIP+. Most university and college health benefits plans also cover PrEP.

https://www.get-prep.com/prep-costs

It's interesting that Truvada is offered as a generic in Canada- which helped lower the cost of the drug for Canadians.

It doesn't go generic in the US until late 2020, so Americans will continue to pay between $1,300-$1,700 per month for the next 16 months.

 

[gsdx]

It's interesting that Truvada is offered as a generic in Canada- which helped lower the cost of the drug for Canadians.

It doesn't go generic in the US until late 2020, so Americans will continue to pay between $1,300-$1,700 per month for the next 16 months.

I sometimes wish Benvolio were still here so I could see how he would defend this.

The only justification is 'greed'.

 

[KaraBulut]

I sometimes wish Benvolio were still here so I could see how he would defend this.

The only justification is 'greed'.

When I was writing the last couple of posts, I was chuckling thinking that Benvolio would claim the high prices were "to cover research costs"... on drugs researched by the US government, research paid for with taxpayer funds... for individual generic drugs that had been on the market before they were combined into one pill called "Truvada" that Gilead has made no payments to reimburse the government for under the original patents.

 

[KaraBulut]

Couldn't decide whether this should go into the Deplorables thread...

In the middle of a pandemic, with nearly 40 million people unemployed in the US, the Trump Administration is trying to kick 24 million people off Obamacare. If they are successful, this would also mean that insurance companies would be able to use pre-existing conditions to deny you coverage.

Trump administration asks Supreme Court to invalidate Obamacare [CNN]

In the midst of a global pandemic with the presidential election just months away, the Justice Department asked the Supreme Court on Thursday to invalidate the Affordable Care Act, the landmark health care law that enabled millions of Americans to get insurance coverage and that remains in effect despite the pending legal challenge.

In a late-night filing, Solicitor General Noel Francisco said that once the law's individual coverage mandate and two key provisions are invalidated, "the remainder of the ACA should not be allowed to remain in effect."

The justices will hear arguments in the case sometime next term, although it is unclear if they will occur before the November election.

 

[gsdx]

I often read about 'late-night filing'. Is there a specific strategy behind that?

 

[KaraBulut]

I often read about 'late-night filing'. Is there a specific strategy behind that?

It used to have more significance but now, most US Federal Courts accept e-filings 24x7, so a late-night filing is now probably an indicator that someone was working late.

The only unusual thing that I can think of is that Noel Francisco is one of the DOJ employees who has submitted their resignation and will be leaving in the near future.

 

[gsdx]

^ As always, thanks for the info.

 

[rareboy]

Couldn't decide whether this should go into the Deplorables thread...

In the middle of a pandemic, with nearly 40 million people unemployed in the US, the Trump Administration is trying to kick 24 million people off Obamacare. If they are successful, this would also mean that insurance companies would be able to use pre-existing conditions to deny you coverage.

Trump administration asks Supreme Court to invalidate Obamacare [CNN]

It is hard to decide isn't it?

For me, this is beyond comprehension.

The GOP and Trump have offered absolutely ZERO plans for an Obamacare replacement....it is now an election year....many of those affected will be Republican voters....what the actual fuck are they thinking.

This reminds me of a total scorched earth attempt to destroy everything before November, in order to make the Democrats have to re-build everything from scratch.

It appears reckless and cruel.

 

[KaraBulut]

It is hard to decide isn't it?

For me, this is beyond comprehension.

The GOP and Trump have offered absolutely ZERO plans for an Obamacare replacement....it is now an election year....many of those affected will be Republican voters....what the actual fuck are they thinking.

This reminds me of a total scorched earth attempt to destroy everything before November, in order to make the Democrats have to re-build everything from scratch.

It appears reckless and cruel.

The thing that makes the timing so horrible for Americans is that most of us have our insurance through employment. The minute we lose our jobs, we lose our insurance. Since public assistance is based upon historical earnings and net worth, most people who have lost their jobs in 2020 won't qualify for Medicaid.

There's a lot of really good reasons why an American would want health insurance but the one that seldom gets cited is contractual pricing. If you have insurance with Cigna or Aetna, and you need an emergency appendectomy, your insurance company pays a contract price that they negotiated in advance with the hospital and the various doctors- that price might be $33,000, for example. If you show up at the hospital without insurance for that same appendectomy, you pay full price which could be as high as $200,000 for the same procedure.

The same applies for things like outpatient drugs- instead of a $20 copay, you might have to pay $300 for a couple of weeks of antibiotics.

The RNC got into this mess because Republican State Attorneys General filed lawsuits to try to undo Obamacare. After the Republicans in Congress failed to repeal Obamacare, they abandoned their efforts and instead have attached changes into budget bills to do things like shorten the signup window and remove the mandate that requires all Americans to carry health insurance or pay a penalty. This is where they got into trouble. In 2011, a Federal judge issued an opinion that said that because the individual mandate had been repealed, the entire ACA law was invalidated. In 2018, Texas Attorney General and accused felon Ken Paxton got another Federal judge to declare the ACA unconstitutional and the Trump Administration immediately got on the bandwagon.

Now, the Trump Administration is desperately trying to push as many of these "fuck Americans" lawsuits until after the election. If the Democrats (and the Lincoln Project) were smart, they would be running ads pointing out that if this effort succeeds, ACA conditions regarding pre-existing conditions (like COVID-19, for example), coverage for children under age 26 and other things that Americans take for granted will be gone.

 

[gsdx]

^ For those who are late to the party, I shall repeat my own hospital experiences.

In January, 2014, I fell on ice and shattered my left hip. I was in hospital for 1 week and 3 days. I had surgery the next morning to replace my hip with a titanium replacement.

Total cost to me: $45 Cdn for the ambulance ride.

In November, 2016, I fell again and broke my right hip, my right wrist, and my right shoulder. I was in hospital for 1 month and 1 day. I had 2 surgeries to plate and pin both my hip and wrist. (My shoulder was bound by sling to allow it to heal itself. It could not be operated on nor be put in a cast.)

Total cost to me: $45 Cdn for the ambulance ride.

 

[HoodedRat]

^
I'm shocked to hear that they charge for ambulances in Canada!

 

[gsdx]

^ That's just a co-pay. The rest of the cost is paid for by my OHIP (health insurance). I don't know how much it actually costs, nor do I know how much my surgeries or hospital stays, nor even my doctor visits, x-rays, scans, bloodwork, or anything else medically related. I never see a bill.

I also pay a $4.11 co-pay for my pharmacy medications. OHIP pays the rest.