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Healthcare going forward

^ Numbers, please. You can't justify a 6,000% profit without numbers. You've been yapping about this crap for weeks now, so show us numbers that justify what you say. Your words just don't cut it.
 
You guys have undertaken to criticize the price, but to do so, you must show the company's full investment, and the time remaing on the patent. Remember people who cannot afford it are not hurt; they are just where they would be if the company had not developed the new drug.
 
Benvolio said:
You guys have undertaken to criticize the price, but to do so, you must show the company's full investment, and the time remaing on the patent. Remember people who cannot afford it are not hurt; they are just where they would be if the company had not developed the new drug.
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And YOU must show the companies' full investment and time remaining on the patent to justify the outright thievery of the drug companies. The only thing you've presented is a single corrupt Canadian drug company that is as corrupt as your new president, and that comply proved our argument rather than yours.

We've already provided stories and links and evidence. We've proved that drug companies spend much more on advertising than on R&D, and even R&D and advertising don't come anywhere close to profits. Hell. Even McDonald's has a profit margin of only 20%.

You cannot and will not ever justify the profits by drug companies at the expense of human beings.
 
gsdx said:
Are my calculations correct? Isn't that a 2857% profit? So at full price, that's 5714% profit.

How can that be justified? How can it be ethical?
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There was an article in one of the journals trying to determine the source of the pricing. Literally, the company decided to announce the price at $1,000 per dose to see if they got any pushback on the pricing. Since the drug is covered by insurance and most patients never see the actual cost before insurance pays, the price has never been lowered.

Also in today's news, the FTC fined Mallinckrodt for price-gouging and anti-competitive activities:

A drug maker was accused of slowly hiking the price of a life-saving medication used to treat infants from $40 a vial to more than $34,000 a vial, and preventing other pharmaceutical firms from creating a competitive drug.

The company, Mallinckrodt, agreed Wednesday to settle charges of anti-competitive practices by paying a $100 million fine and allow a competitor to produce a similar medication.

Schneiderman's office said Mallinckrodt's (MNK)U.S. subsidiary -- formerly known as Questcor -- purchased Acthar in 2001 and proceeded to slowly raise the price of the drug 85,000%. The complaint says a single course of treatment can cost "well over $100,000."
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^ I can't wait to see how Benvolio justifies that.

That certainly isn't about saving lives. It's all about P-R-O-F-I-T.
 
^ Yeah, but now he can put his own name on it and it will be bigly great all of a sudden.
 
smokeshadow said:
The Donald has announced that his replacement plan will be based on private insurance companies ](*,) ](*,) as if the PPACA isn't :rotflmao:
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*sigh* It's getting harder to tell the real Trump from the Alec Baldwin version.

 
The CBO just released a new report about the effects of the repeal of the ACA (in an earlier post in this thread, references an earlier 2015 CBO report that showed that the deficit would increase).

The report, How Repealing Portions of the Affordable Care Act Would Affect Health Insurance Coverage and Premiums, provides more information about the effects of repeal:
  • The number of people who are uninsured would increase by 18 million in the first new plan year following enactment of the bill
  • Later, after the elimination of the ACA’s expansion of Medicaid eligibility and of subsidies for insurance purchased through the ACA marketplaces, that number would increase to 27 million, and then to 32 million in 2026
  • Premiums in the nongroup market (for individual policies purchased through the marketplaces or directly from insurers) would increase by 20 percent to 25 percent.

The report also scores a couple of proposed "replacement" plans. :##:

Meanwhile, the American public has clear opinions about the repeal: :rolleyes:
 
It is amazing that with 6 years to come up with a plan...the Republicans have no plan.
 
Most people see no difference between health care and health insurance.

As those of you who live in lands with a single payer health care system are aware, you don't pay a premium to a company that doesn't want you to use the health care insurance. Deductibles and co-pays are meant to discourage people from seeking treatment until it's essential. So we pay a premium to a company that has a conflict of interests or perhaps no interest in our well being at all.

Doctors have told me that insurance companies try to keep them from doing what is best for their patients. My wife's doctor is from Pakistan and is an excellent doctor and a kind caring Moslem (I had to say that), he referred to the insurance companies as "bastards"
who try to tie his hands.

Now, a single payer system would work as well here as it does anywhere else. When former President Obama proposed that he was met with opposition not just from repubs. but from dems. as well.
I was involved in the Democratic party and we held meetings about health care, what killed the single payer system was not just "the other side", but people in our own party that didn't want to give up their Cadillac coverage and go to single payer health care for fear that the guy in the ghetto would be equal in his access to health care and thereby reduce his standard of care.

Taking the middle man out of health care (the insurance companies) and negotiating prices with pharmaceutical companies would bring down cost.

The following link has some good stats about health care in the US compared to other nations:http://www.commonwealthfund.org/pub.../oct/us-health-care-from-a-global-perspective
 
Those Cadillac owners never 'get' that in countries with universal healthcare, you can also opt for private insurance.

Although the premiums are much cheaper here than in the USA, private hospitals are often silver service affairs. They have to work hard to compete with free.
 
gsdx said:
^ I can't wait to see how Benvolio justifies that.

That certainly isn't about saving lives. It's all about P-R-O-F-I-T.
Click to expand...

Actually I think that's an insult to the word "profit". A more accurate word would be "plunder".

Calculating profit on a drug should include research costs spread over the life of the patent. Do it that way, and tax any profit over 20% at 95%, over 22% at 96%, over 24% at 98%, and over 25% at 100%.

All of said tax to go into a trust fund with untouchable principal, the interest to be fed into Medicare.
 
The GOP should drag is feet and let Obamacare collapse, as it will. Covering preexisting illnesses with "insurance" cannot work because it is not insurance, it is charity. The companies cannot gouge healthy people enough to cover the people who are already sick. Obamacare tries to get around that by subsidizing the people who cannot pay their premiums, so the people who pay for their insurance also have to pay for the other people by taxes. Even so, it is failing and will fail.
 
Boehner and Rendell got it right this week at HIMMS in Orlando this week:

Boehner: Obamacare repeal and replace 'not what's going to happen'

"They'll fix Obamacare," the former Ohio congressman predicted at a conference hosted by the Healthcare Information and Management Systems Society in Orlando, Florida. "I shouldn't have called it repeal and replace because that's not what's going to happen. They're basically going to fix the flaws and put a more conservative box around it."....

"This is not all that hard to figure out, except this: In the 25 years that I served in the United States Congress, Republicans never, ever one time agreed on what a healthcare proposal should look like. Not once," Boehner said....

He said lawmakers were too confident in how easy they thought the process would go.
"All this happy talk that went on in November and December and January about repeal, repeal, repeal -- yeah we'll do replace, replace -- I started laughing because if you pass repeal without replace, first, anything that happens is your fault. You broke it."
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If the GOP cannot agree, then Obamacare will not get fixed. It will collapse.
 
It has been said, that the progressive person looks to the future and imagines how things might be better, whereas the regressive person looks to the past convinced that things were always better... while ignoring the inconvenience of fact....that sick people should also receive a helping hand from those of us able to.
 
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