How should most people become wealthy?

[TX-Beau]

M

I agree that the focus should be on eliminating poverty, and you know by now what the primary cause of poverty is. If I name it, this post will be deleted. The other major cause is welfare dependency, which is why your theory is fatally defective. You liberals are eager to implement the last part of the masters prescription, ".....to each according to his need." But you loath the first part, "From each according to his ability...". I.e. Able bodied people must work or contribute.
Again, inequality is irrelevant. The poor are not caused to be poor because the rich are rich. Oprah did not become rich by hurting the poor, nor did Bill Gates, or Warren Buffet, Zuckerberg of Facebook etc.
Our experience proves all too well that " safety nets" rapidly become a multi-generational way of life.

 

[Benvolio]

Are you trying to imply that the main reason Brazil has millions of poor people living in favellas is because of Mexicans immigrating to the US?

Of course not. The two economies are not comparable.

 

[bankside]

Do you agree with my above paraphrase^ of your original post?

Yes, I think so.

 

[opinterph]

Yes, I think so.

Cool. It is currently late in my location, but I'll try to offer some additional stimulation in short order.

 

[otters]

But they seem locked into an economic stasis where no investments are made to bring the majority of the population into the useful economy.

Hm, please define "useful economy". This term sounds awkward to my ears, and I doubt there would exist a definition that is generally accepted?

 

[Benvolio]

Are you trying to imply that the main reason Brazil has millions of poor people living in favellas is because of Mexicans immigrating to the US?

As I said, no. Let me expand. In prei-ndustrial times. economies were zero sum economies,i.e., most wealth was in land and proceeds of land. The land ends up in the hands of the most powerful. In a given year, the land produces so much. If the peasants want more, the landlord gets less. If the landlord wants more, the peasants get less. This is the economy of biblical times and feudal times, continuing up until the 1700s when England initiated the industrial revolution and the free enterprise economy. Democracy followed as the industrialists became a wealthy middle class. The industrial economy is not zero sum. A small factory or a small amount of capital can produce great wealth, and services, not manufacturing, produce much of the income. The amount of income produced depends on many factors and is not limited by weather.
The Hispanic countries, including for this purpose, Portugal and Brazil, have been slow to follow. Neither free enterprise nor democracy have strongly taken hold as in other countries, and their economies continue to be more like the zero sum economies before the industrial revolution. We are not allowed to discuss the reasons in this forum.

 

[bankside]

Hm, please define "useful economy". This term sounds awkward to my ears, and I doubt there would exist a definition that is generally accepted?

Probably anything above a "meagre subsistence" economy, but ideally one where people can be integrated in a high-performing economy that is as productive as anywhere else in the world.

 

[Benvolio]

Probably anything above a "meagre subsistence" economy, but ideally one where people can be integrated in a high-performing economy that is as productive as anywhere else in the world.

Clearly that is not possible without a requirement of work or self support by able bodied people.

 

[otters]

The Hispanic countries, including for this purpose, Portugal and Brazil, have been slow to follow. Neither free enterprise nor democracy have strongly taken hold as in other countries, and their economies continue to be more like the zero sum economies before the industrial revolution. We are not allowed to discuss the reasons in this forum.

One who has some insight knows the Portuguese aren't poor devils at all.

Obviously you're very sad that Portugal got rid of their — US-American supported — dictatorship, in 1974 already… but at least it remained a NATO country, or isn't that according to your plan, Benvolio?

 

[otters]

Clearly that is not possible without a requirement of work or self support by able bodied people.

LOL, Benvolio and the 1936 USSR constitution, article 12

 

[TX-Beau]

One who has some insight knows the Portuguese aren't poor devils at all.

Obviously you're very sad that Portugal got rid of their — US-American supported — dictatorship, in 1974 already… but at least it remained a NATO country, or isn't that according to your plan, Benvolio?

You're not in here much so this will be your first warning - do NOT toss facts at the Elephants!

 

[otters]

Remember though, inequality isn't my focus; it's that each person has an absolute amount of wealth, and that it continues to expand.

There is one massive problem… apart from sci-fi stories, one very important good cannot expand: the surface of our planet Earth.

Momentarily I don't have statistical details at hand, but there are some intriguing correlations between population density, criminality, education, social insurance policy, and last but not least wealth distribution that should be discussed in that context IMHO.

 

[bankside]

Clearly that is not possible without a requirement of work or self support by able bodied people.

Work, yes I agree. Although I would be happy to let robots do more than vacuum my carpet.

Self-support? Sure, why not? But I suspect mutual support will make us all wealthier faster.

 

[bankside]

There is one massive problem… apart from sci-fi stories, one very important good cannot expand: the surface of our planet Earth.

Momentarily I don't have statistical details at hand, but there are some intriguing correlations between population density, criminality, education, social insurance policy, and last but not least wealth distribution that should be discussed in that context IMHO.

I'd support population limits. That is certainly better than expecting each succeeding generation to live with less and less. In fact, I don't just support them, I insist on them.

 

[Benvolio]

I'd support population limits. That is certainly better than expecting each succeeding generation to live with less and less. In fact, I don't just support them, I insist on them.

I could not agree with you more. Let's slam the doors shut now.

 

[bankside]

I could not agree with you more. Let's slam the doors shut now.

No, I'm not talking about slamming the doors shut at all. I'm talking about a few more people slamming their legs shut. Or, you know, having access to a public health system that covers birth control and reproductive health at no direct cost to the patient.

Once people have been given birth to, and they're real live breathing humans, then ensuring their mobility is often the best way for everyone to prosper.

Just curious, do we still agree more than ever before?

 

[Benvolio]

I

No, I'm not talking about slamming the doors shut at all. I'm talking about a few more people slamming their legs shut. Or, you know, having access to a public health system that covers birth control and reproductive health at no direct cost to the patient.

Once people have been given birth to, and they're real live breathing humans, then ensuring their mobility is often the best way for everyone to prosper.

Just curious, do we still agree more than ever before?

Aborting Americans and substituting immigrants is the democrat plan. Alas, you are succeeding. You will die a poorer man for it.

 

[thewiz]

I'm still waiting for the Republican plan. Ooops, I guess that was insulting.

You do know that birth control is not abortion, Benvolio? Your party seems to think we need to preserve every life -- regardless of the woman's right to control her own body -- from the moment of conception to birth. After the birth -- well then she's just a welfare queen and should be embarrassed and thrown to the streets. The child? Let's deny them healthcare, childcare, pre-school, education, and college. And if they don't become Donald Trump -- it's their darn fault for not taking more advantage of the situation they were dealt. That about sums up your ideas?

Heck, even the Pope has realized Catholics shouldn't "breed like rabbits" and would espouse a far different position than what you profess.

 

[TX-Beau]

MODS!!! Ben is hijacking another thread with his stormfront stupidity!!!

STOP the madness!

 

[bankside]

I

Aborting Americans and substituting immigrants is the democrat plan. Alas, you are succeeding. You will die a poorer man for it.

No, actually the Americans are okay for birth rate. It's the first 127 countries on this chart that are causing the population to balloon.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...ndent_territories_by_fertility_rate#Countries