Op-Ed IF ONLY POLICE HAD GUNS, this never would have happened...

[Zeno Lorea]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36745862


Cue the orchestra, here we go again! So will it matter one bit of difference that the people mass murdered were armed cops?

Or will the apologia remain the same, it's kind of hard to argue that this wouldn't have happened if, you know, they were armed....

Brother makes a good point! But I wish Trevor Noah came up with it first. He would make it even more hilarious. Or maybe Colbert.

 

[Kulindahr]

Even currently they could just brand it a terrorist group.

That said, it's like having the AAA membership override the mandates of elected representatives under the popular vote.

Haven't you figured out that the popular vote is irrelevant, when the only choices are supplied by the folks with the money? Elections these days are just a circus with the performers selected ahead of time by elites.

 

[TX-Beau]

Paranoia at its best: you sound like Alex Jones, with the "the Fed [will] just drop a bomb on your head".

What you advocate is the freedom to be a victim, like the 31 killed in Orlando in a restroom because they were required to be defenseless.

Bull-fucking-shit. You are the one who needs his guns to protect him from everything. This is just yet more silly crap you tell yourself so you don't have to acknowledge that we have a fucking problem.

 

[xbuzzerx]

The Air Force did a study and concluded that the best remedy against bad guys with guns is good guys with guns.

Did they also do a study on how many bad guys there are with guns if you work to stop bad guys from getting guns?

 

[Kulindahr]

Brother makes a good point! But I wish Trevor Noah came up with it first. He would make it even more hilarious. Or maybe Colbert.

How does using a straw man argument possibly make a "good point"?

 

[Kulindahr]

Bull-fucking-shit. You are the one who needs his guns to protect him from everything. This is just yet more silly crap you tell yourself so you don't have to acknowledge that we have a fucking problem.

I choose a gun to protect me from the evident danger. That's rational. Choosing to have no viable response to violence from killers is insane.

BTW, you keep demonstrating a reliance on lies, or a deliberate refusal to pay attention to what others say.

 

[Kulindahr]

Did they also do a study on how many bad guys there are with guns if you work to stop bad guys from getting guns?

No politician has yet made a proposal that would "stop bad guys from getting guns", nor is it even possible. I presume they recognized that reality and went from there.

 

[Zeno Lorea]

He wasn't that black, he was a mixed race

Americans don't understand the concept of 'mixed'. They see people in black and white. Literally. America is different from the rest of the world.

 

[xbuzzerx]

No politician has yet made a proposal that would "stop bad guys from getting guns", nor is it even possible. I presume they recognized that reality and went from there.

It is my overwhelming impression that the garden variety gun nut explains the "things that work in other societies would NEVER work here, America is totally different" base it on racism and xenophobia. The idea that no matter what you do, certain people (nudge, wink) are always going to be dangerous and prone to crime, and the law abiding white majority needs guns to protect themselves.

What is your basis for claiming nothing that works in other societies will ever work here?

 

[Kulindahr]

Americans don't understand the concept of 'mixed'. They see people in black and white. Literally. America is different from the rest of the world.

That binary sort of thinking is why comparisons to other countries are a bad idea. I bet if Americans could come to a mindset that saw how unions and management, for example, should work together instead of being antagonists, our violence of all sorts would drop. It isn't just "black and white"; that's just a symptom of the pervasive "us v. them" thinking that can't grasp degrees of difference and thus degrees of sameness.

 

[Kulindahr]

It is my overwhelming impression that the garden variety gun nut explains the "things that work in other societies would NEVER work here, America is totally different" base it on racism and xenophobia. The idea that no matter what you do, certain people (nudge, wink) are always going to be dangerous and prone to crime, and the law abiding white majority needs guns to protect themselves.

What is your basis for claiming nothing that works in other societies will ever work here?

What is your reason for putting words in my mouth?

I'm becoming convinced that the anti-gun position can't function without putting up false targets.


BTW, it's the position of not just me but the NRA and JPFO and others that blacks need guns to protect themselves more than whites.

 

[Zeno Lorea]

He wasn't that black, he was a mixed race

Americans are not like the rest of the world. They won't consider you 'mixed' if the mixture includes black. They see people as black and white. Literally. One-drop theory.

In many parts of northern Africa he would have been considered more white than black. And no, not in a racist 'not one of us' way, since they are even whiter than him. In Europe, he'd be light brown to most people.

 

[Zeno Lorea]

interesting analysis

http://qz.com/727462/in-dallas-the-...nd-pro-gun-advocates-was-completely-debunked/

Great article! If I may quote a few sentences:

"All the evidence suggests that, in most cases, guns do not defuse violent situations, but exacerbate them. It’s very likely that Alton Sterling and Philando Castille would both still be alive today if the police officers who stopped them had not been armed. Guns make it easier for everyone to kill, whether they are “bad guys” or “good guys,” whether deliberately or by accident, or whether they are aiming the gun at themselves or at others. There are far, far fewer gun-toting heroes than there are gun victims."

 

[xbuzzerx]

What is your reason for putting words in my mouth?

I'm becoming convinced that the anti-gun position can't function without putting up false targets.


BTW, it's the position of not just me but the NRA and JPFO and others that blacks need guns to protect themselves more than whites.

I'm not putting words in your mouth. You rattled off all the things that "don't/won't work", even though we can point to societies like Australia, Japan, England and elsewhere and show that they do.

The entire gun lobby argument boils down to saying: but it won't here.

 

[TX-Beau]

I choose a gun to protect me from the evident danger. That's rational. Choosing to have no viable response to violence from killers is insane.

BTW, you keep demonstrating a reliance on lies, or a deliberate refusal to pay attention to what others say.

What you choose to do is pretend that crap you toss at us is anything but shit you made up to justify your paranoia. All people armed all the time will just lead to more murders not less, but you are so infatuated with your fantasy universe that you refuse to admit that.

 

[opinterph]

The Air Force did a study and concluded that the best remedy against bad guys with guns is good guys with guns.

What you are citing was not really a study, but a review of current military base policies in combination with information available from other sources. The review appears to have been inspired by the attack on a recruiting station in Chattanooga last summer.

We looked at active-shooter incidents across the country and there are statistics out there that show where many ended without police intervention because there was somebody there who had a concealed carry permit or somebody interdicted the active shooter,” said Maj. Keith Quick, the Air Force Security Forces Integrated Defense action officer.

Air Force implements additional security measures (USAF News and Information; January 20, 2016)

The Air Force also did not release the data showing how many active-shooter incidents were stopped by someone on the scene carrying a weapon. A spokeswoman said the data came from the FBI, and cannot be released by the Air Force.

AF Reminds Commanders: Authorized Conceal-Carry, Open-Carry OK on Base (Military.com; January 21, 2016)

 

[Rolyo85]

The Air Force did a study and concluded that the best remedy against bad guys with guns is good guys with guns.

But rather than apply reason, others resort to name-calling with emotional terms such as "dementia". This is why the problem won't get solved: antis rely on emotion, La Pierre relies on emotion, so the folks who listen to reason are few and far between (which is why I like Colion Noir: he sticks to reason).

Oh well if the AIR FORCE said so...

TX is right - we shouldn't have to be armed if we don't want to. Europe isn't and they're happier, more advanced and safer than us. If we don't want to own or carry tools of murder, we shouldn't be forced to. You're conveniently ignoring this every time you make one of your delusional gunsturbation points.

 

[Rolyo85]

What is your reason for putting words in my mouth?

I'm becoming convinced that the anti-gun position can't function without putting up false targets.


BTW, it's the position of not just me but the NRA and JPFO and others that blacks need guns to protect themselves more than whites.

Notice how in your indignation at having words put in your mouth, you thoroughly didn't address the actual question.

 

[Kabluey]

What is your reason for putting words in my mouth?

I'm becoming convinced that the anti-gun position can't function without putting up false targets.

BTW, it's the position of not just me but the NRA and JPFO and others that blacks need guns to protect themselves more than whites.

If there was widespread disarmament across the population, no particular groups would need to have guns.
The comparatively low gun death rates among white Americans are still higher than the average for all citizens within other developed countries.

 

[Kulindahr]

What you choose to do is pretend that crap you toss at us is anything but shit you made up to justify your paranoia. All people armed all the time will just lead to more murders not less, but you are so infatuated with your fantasy universe that you refuse to admit that.

I go armed because of reality: I choose not to be like the 31 slaughtered in a restroom in Orlando, who liberals required to be unarmed and thus defenseless. Or are you going to tell me they didn't really die, so there's nothing to be concerned about?

No one but emotion-based liberals talk about "all people armed all the time", primarily because those who support the basic human right of choosing their own means of self-defense are not advocates of coercion -- it's our opponents who advocate coercion of law-abiding citizens in some vague hope that criminals will suddenly decide to reform and start obeying laws.