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my deepest secret...

you can move away. try and if it doesn't work the way you want/expect then return. experiment.

not sure this will help, i'm sorta like you. but my catholic community is more accepting and my area is more diverse. but then i'm fine in the closet. i don't want to lose what i have/dreamed of. it's a choice.

lastly having too much girl friends will eventually raise a red flag.
 
>>>i am really confused about another thing my mind keeps running through... i can see me in relationships with both girls and guys. right now if i had a gay relationship it would be very privite due to the whole confused about my sexuality thing. -- but i dont consider myself as bi. or gay at all. of course i know thats not straight, is there something inbetween, maybe something thats not a label. okay, thats a little hard to understand, but im not sure how to word it. hopefully somebody will understand what im saying and maybe be able to orginize my words a little better.

LOE, you seem like a cool guy. And as such, I don't really want to take you down a road where you don't want to go. But I think it's best to say this anyway.

What you're describing. Being able to picture oneself in a relationship with another guy, even in private. And getting sexually excited while thinking about sex with other guys. There actually IS a standard label for that.

That label is "gay".

That's dictionary definition. Being attracted to the same gender. It's the one and only qualification. As I said above, being gay means you dig guys. And that's all. Everything else is optional.

I listen to rock music.
I dress like an utter slob.
I have season tickets to a full-contact sport.
But I'm still gay. :)

I have a vague hunch that you're not scared of your feelings all that much, but you're scared of the label that might be put on you because of them. I would urge you to at least give it some thought. I don't want to force a label on you - that's not my intent. I worry more that if it ends up that you ARE in fact gay, and you continually shun that as a possibility, that it'll keep you from liking yourself, and living a kick-ass life.

And I echo a lot of the above advice. Don't feel the need to rush. You won't wake up tomorrow with some magical "solution" to everything. Just keep an open mind, and let the chips fall where they may.

Good luck, my friend.

Lex
 
I'm from Calgary Alberta, believe me I know what it's like to live in a city that doesn't want a gay culture. I also grew up Catholic- I don't think anyone goes through life without having to question things at some point, and it's ok to do that.
You're probably very used to people telling you how evil it is to be gay, be sure your opinions are your own.
Hope everything turns out for the better. Lots of lovely chaps here to help along the way when you need it.
 
The hardest part of coming out for me was coming out to myself.

I had it easy many folks may think. I had two gay and out older siblings. I knew it wouldn't be news to anyone if I were gay. So I hid out in the open for many years. I was celibate from age 18-22, because I couldn't deal with my own sexuality. I wasn't out at work til after I was 30.

My point is that for me, the hardest part was coming out to myself. Until I did, I had trouble even making friends, because people felt like I was hiding something-and I was.

So good luck to you all. I don't really have any words of wisdom except this. Come out to yourself, and be honest with yourself. (Even if you aren't ready to be public with family or whatever) It will make you a happier person.
 
i just wish there was no gay, no straight. i wish people were just themselves. i know someday that will become the world, but i dont have time to wait that long. I want to consider myself as myself, not gay. maybe some other day ill deside what i am. I know what my friends will think, thats why im not going to go around telling people how i feel, ill keep to myself, but ill be honest with myself.

out of all your great advice, and i mean woah, it was such great advice!! this seems like the best idea, at least until i can move away.

if you have something to add, please do.

thank you all. every single word is helpful and it means a lot to me.
 
Just tell your friends that your new friends are these big hairy "bears":
IBR08-072.jpg

and they're going to come beat them up if they say anything negative about you being gay.
 
I'm going to give a two-part response.

I. You're not so alone as you think
___There are gay guys in rural Iowa; genetics and mutations don't chance because you live among the corn. The people around you have, as someone said, lots of secrets; the thing is that since you can't see those secrets, you feel alone.
___People in rural Iowa have gay relationships; they have incestuous relationships; they have adulterous relationships -- I'd give you good odds that if you were Iowa-omniscient, you'd discover that there's a serious number of guys doing sheep, even. Now look at that list, and think about it: You like other guys, which people call "gay". But you're not lusting after someone in your own family, you're not cheating on someone, and you're not doing animals. So, guess what? You're actually in the "normal" category!

II. Thinking as a Christian
___St. Paul writes, "Let a man examine himself". The rest of the verse isn't necessary at this point; the admonition is what's important. What does "examine himself" mean -- or, more to the point, examine yourself? Well, it means take a good look; furthermore, it means take an honest look. Now, it looks like you've done that pretty well; if I were your priest, and you came to me with that, I'd be impressed with the honesty in your statement: it doesn't look like you're hiding from yourself at all.
___That's where the future comes in: you aren't hiding from yourself now, so don't start! That means stay honest, and staying honest requires something important: no self-condemnation. I know; not easy when your whole tradition says a man liking men is bad. Well, think on this: your tradition used to say that freedom of religion is bad, but in time the Holy Spirit got it through a pope's head that that idea was wrong -- so don't worry about your tradition; don't condemn yourself.
___Here's some reinforcements on your side: Paul writes in another place that there is no condemnation now, for those who are in Christ. You're a Catholic, which means you're baptized, and since you're old enough to be on JUB you probably go to the Eucharist. Those are two things God has done and does do for you, which means you're in Christ, which means there's no condemnation. And since there's no condemnation, you can look at yourself honestly, and not see someone who's bad.
___That runs up against something you said, though -- you said, "I refuse to be gay". Well, sorry; as others have pointed out, you don't have much choice: if that's the way your genes or hormones or whatever aimed you, that's where you're aimed, and the history of guys successfully defying that and being happy is something that would fit on a candy bar wrapper. "Refusing" to be gay may make you feel good in some ways, but I and others here can tell you from experience that it will slowly kill you.
__Let me look at it another way: ancient Church Fathers spoke of a human as being spirit, soul, and body. Your spirit is the core of you, the part where the real Cody resides, where your true health/wellness/peace/shalom lives. Your soul is your mind, habits, dreams (and daydreams), all the stuff that is you but can change from day to day. Your body -- well, that's pretty obvious. But here's the deal: if you screw with any of those, it screws with the others, and when your spirit gets screwed up, you can start to lose track of who you really are -- and that way lies incredible misery.
___Obviously your body thinks enjoying other guys' bodies would be fun. If you try to deny that, if you try to crush it and pretend it isn't so, that puts your mind at war with your body. In order to make it work, you have to lie to yourself, and at that point it starts choking your spirit. Your path for wholeness lies in regarding what your body wants, and without either praise or condemnation saying, "Yep, that's what it wants."
___But from your later posts it sounds like your mind is interested in guys, too, like having a boyfriend even. That, also, you have to just look at -- examine yourself -- and say, "Yep, that's what I'm like." You accept it -- that doesn't mean approval, and it definitely doesn't mean condemnation, it just means acknowledging that "This is who I am" as being as much a fact as there are more stalks of corn in Iowa than there are people in the U.S.: not good, not bad, just is.

___Okay, not a cure, huh? But for peace in/with yourself, that's the path. And next time to go to the Sacrament, remember those of us here who are Catholic (or Orthodox, Episcopalian, Lutheran) and know that you're not alone there: as the Church Fathers taught, there's only one altar, and when we're there, we're there with all our fellows who gather at that altar.


Peace, and strength, bro! ..|
 
kulindahr, wow, you put a lot of thought into what you were saying, and it wasnt just your believes as my post have been, you were able to back up all your facts and i just want to thank you for that. you seem to know a lot about iowa. i liked the part about the sheep fuckers, and growing up from the corn. you totally understand my setting, which makes me believe everything you say about gays in iowa. compared to some of the hicks and rednecks, my thoughts ive been having are completly normal.

i felt obligated to respond to your post alone because of that. thank you so much.

and again, if you have more to add, please do so. i, and other people in my situaltion would love to hear more.
 
You sound like you're getting your head in the right place. Yeah, a world without labels would be nice, but I don't think it's the labels that are really the problem. It's the implications, the stereotypes, the baggage that comes along with them.

Take you, for instance. You live (and were presumably, were born) in Iowa. You're an Iowan. That means precisely one thing - you were born and/or live within the borders of the state of Iowa. That's it. But it might imply certain things to others who aren't from Iowa. People might think/assume you're a dumb hick, you're a NASCAR fan, and maybe even that you take liberty with sheep. Because, for those who don't know Iowa, that's some of the baggage that comes along with it. In addition, those who know nothing about homosexuals might assume that, since I'm gay, that I'm a Cher fan, I have a lisp, and I like to wear women's clothes. That's some of the baggage that comes with the gay "label".

You'll notice that the problem isn't the label. It's the baggage. Specifically, it's those that don't know any better who make crass assumptions about people who have that label. But you'll find that as you get to bigger cities, with more diverse populations, that you'll encounter less and less of this baggage. In general, people in bigger cities have dealt with homosexuals and Blacks and yes, even Iowans. :) And they've learned that the stereotypes that go along with labels are just that - stereotypes. They might hold true for THIS guy, but that doesn't mean it'll hold true for THAT guy. Folks in cities aren't more open-minded naturally, I don't think - they just become that way by experience. It's easy to say "all gays are flamers" if you never actually meet one. :)

You mention "moving away" in a previous post, and I think that's probably a good goal to work towards. Not just because of how people in your town might react, but because there may not be any options there. If you decide you are gay, or decide to try dating guys, who are you gonna go out with? :) You don't have to come out to your family and friends if you think they'll have a major problem with it, or you can push it back until after you move away and are "out of reach".

Until such time that you can move away, feel free to let us be your support network, and your supportive friends. Keep nosing around the forums. See what other issues and problems other guys have. Perhaps post a few times, chat a bit, get to know some people. And let us know if we can help any. :)

Lex
 
i know that i have mentioned to you guys already that i even think i might want a relationship with a guy. when i say that... right now i mean a certain guy.

have you ever had something you wanted so badly, but couldnt have? i have.

i know of a guy, matt. i dont think he is gay, but then again i dont think im gay. and i sort of liked him... a lot for a while. but i eventually gave up for two reasons... hes probably not gay. and i refuse to be gay.

recently...i really like this girl, megan. shes funny, smart, beautiful, and we get along great.

you guys have told me to try dating a nice guy, you know, experiment. i just dont think that even if i was even in the situation...maybe talking to matt and we deside to date (realize this is an example...i have not thought of this until now.) i would not allow myself to date a guy, i dont think. i would just say, sorry, i cant do this.

dare i date megan? would it be a lie to my self...or worse, hurt her?

answers are so hard to find, i know my good friends would help me out, but i think that i can get over this "gayness" and nobody would have to ever know. and again, maybe ill just hurt myself....................
 
If everybody had to wait until they were absolutely positively sure that the person they were about to date was "the one", then there wouldn't be much dating going on. That's what dating is all about - finding out if you're compatible with people.

Should you date Megan? I don't see why not. Provided you go in with the right frame of mind.

Don't assume that dating her will answer all your questions. You may or may not "click" with her. Doing so won't mean you won't ever have the urge to get with a guy again. Not doing so won't mean that you won't click with some other woman.

Date her for the reasons you give above - you like her, you love spending time with her. And enjoy it. :)

Lex
 
Hey man! From reading a couple of the posts in here it sounds like you've been given some awesome and very true advice. So I don't have much more to contribute.

But I did want to say hey from Nebraska (pretty much the same thing ha) and hang in there bud. We're all in this together.
 
L-O-E:

You're making all of this more complicated than it needs to be.

Find someone you like. Date them. Don't worry about the plumbing.

It's hard enough to find someone you like but if you don't date anyone, you're never going to make sense of any of this.

Trust me on this- once you start dating and spending time with girls and guys, all of these questions will be answered and you will look back and think, "What was the big deal?"
 
i really like this girl, megan. shes funny, smart, beautiful, and we get along great.

dare i date megan? would it be a lie to my self...or worse, hurt her?

...

i think that i can get over this "gayness" and nobody would have to ever know. and again, maybe ill just hurt myself....................
Megan sounds like a great... friend. Do you masturbate thinking about her... or thinking about Matt?

No, you're not going to get over your gayness. What's so horrible about dating a guy? Gay guys can be just as warm, loving, cuddly, and tender as any woman. Just find a nice guy, not an asshole. Even guys into leather & bondage can be warm & cuddly. You'd be surprised.
 
im so sorry i couldnt keep you guys updated. my computer had a virus and it was unfixable...so here i am again on my new computer...and i must say its pretty pimp!

a lot has happened. last time i was here, i was considering telling my best friend kate. I was very depressed and everybody was worried about me, they all thought i would kill myself, i assured them i wouldnt do that- i learned from my brother's mistake.

i did tell my friend kate. it was sooo nerve racking!! i didnt have any idea how to say it. i actually made her guess what it was. she had three guesses. #1. i like her as more than a friend... no. #2. I've started doing drugs... no. #3. (she said she couldnt say it cause i might be offended. so she texted me. even though she was sitting right next to me.) i opened the text. gay. yes. i told her everything as she seemed to like it. it was strange. i liked it.

it actually went so good that on my way home from the talk...i desided, im not going to try to change this. I love who i am. i am proud of myself. this is me. and im happy with that.

i told a couple more close friends. guess what. it brought us closer.

i told my mom. yeah. ouch! i was scared for that one. i just keep talking and she didnt move. she didnt say a word. i had to know what she was thinking so i asked her. she said she doesnt care, but shes worried about harrassment. i was sort of upset that thats all she had to say. she could tell. she said, "Cody, im proud of you. You have no idea how many times people say, "oh, are you Cody's mother? he is a good young man, and the hardest worker i've ever seen." Cody, i love you. forever and always." ... okay, get me some kleenexes!

My siblings know. i told my sister and one of my brothers. my other brother found out on his own. they all are helpful.

my deepest secret is out. its big news for small town iowa. good gossip!

my deepest secret... or is it, part of me?

hey, guys. I'm cody. im bi. :)

thanks for the push, its been so helpful. god bless you all!

-Cody
 
What a brave young man you are!

Congratulations on coming out to your family and friends!

I had forgotten about this thread, though I read it when you first posted. To be honest I thought it would be quite a while, years probably, before you'd come to terms with your sexual identity.

I hope many young men who feel they're in a hopeless situation read this and see what wonderful possibilities there are, if they're honest with themselves and others.

My best wishes to you for a great life.
 
Once you come out you start to realize that you, yourself were really the biggest hinderance in the entire process. Yes there are homophobes in Iowa, just like many place. But there are gay bars there too, and a thriving gay community in places like Des Moines, Cedar Rapids, Iowa City, etc. Or do as what many gay Iowans do.... move to Minneapolis.

Congrats!
 
I have never had lamb before. My mum says we don't like it. Does it taste like chicken??
 
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