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Obamacare is crashing...

Jack Springer said:
Nothing new about the opposition party wanting the sitting President to fail.
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Please cite details concerning majority of Democrats.* I can only speak for myself. I wanted Bush to succeed, but I knew he wouldn't.

*Are you the official spokesman for the DNC?
 
^ (sorry, arrow was pointed at Benvolio, but chrisrobin posted in the meanwhile before I could finish my post. Chris, you INTRUDER you, haha!!!)

Yes, a monthly deduction...which is far, FAR less than any insurance premium that I have had in decades, even including my Medigap insurance and prescription part which I both pay manually. (You're right, B, it's not strictly single-payer because I do have to have those two ancillary plans - Medigap is with Mutual of Omaha - if I want my Medicare to be complete.)

And in the 18 months I've had Medicare, the plan has paid more of my medical costs than has ever been paid any time previously in my lifetime OTHER THAN in 1975 (adjusted for inflation) and 2004.

And, on a whole, Medicare has still "made money" off me.
 
frankfrank said:
^ (sorry, arrow was pointed at Benvolio, but chrisrobin posted in the meanwhile before I could finish my post. Chris, you INTRUDER you, haha!!!)

Yes, a monthly deduction...which is far, FAR less than any insurance premium that I have had in decades, even including my Medigap insurance and prescription part which I both pay manually. (You're right, B, it's not strictly single-payer because I do have to have those two ancillary plans - Medigap is with Mutual of Omaha - if I want my Medicare to be complete.)

And in the 18 months I've had Medicare, the plan has paid more of my medical costs than has ever been paid any time previously in my lifetime OTHER THAN in 1975 (adjusted for inflation) and 2004.

And, on a whole, Medicare has still "made money" off me.
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Gotta love those Chinese, loaning us the money to pay your bills. What happens when they stop?
 
Further proof Obamacare is failing ....

Colorado had of Obamacare Exchange is indicted for stealing ...

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_25126542/colo-health-exchange-officials-say-indicted-director-was

Oregon's Obamacare Exchange has not sold one person . . wasting over $300 million of US Taxpayers money so far with no results ...

http://www.cnbc.com/id/101415808

Massachuetts Obamacare Exchange gets 3 months reprieve to save itself ... leader cries ... Exchange breaks down ...

http://www.boston.com/news/local/ma...ly-with-aca/hdSeh6zKNuOSj3ysVex98H/story.html
 
Benvolio said:
If you actually are in Medicare and AARP supplemental, you know that they are not a single payer system. They work by taking large monthly premiums from your Social Security payment. The system cannot be expanded to the general population because they do not receive SS payments to be diverted.
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It's close enough to single payer for me right now. If we could get rid of the grubby mitts of the private insurance companies we could have real single payer.
 
palbert said:
It's close enough to single payer for me right now. If we could get rid of the grubby mitts of the private insurance companies we could have real single payer.
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IMHO, single payer was the plan to begin with. Pres. Obama was pragmatic enough to realize that passing single payer was unrealistic. ACA would only be a first step, something no other president has achieved. Note: In many European countries, it is against the law to profiteer from illness. The U.S. used to be a world leader, not a follower. :mad:
 
chrisrobin said:
IMHO, single payer was the plan to begin with. Pres. Obama was pragmatic enough to realize that passing single payer was unrealistic. ACA would only be a first step, something no other president has achieved. Note: In many European countries, it is against the law to profiteer from illness. The U.S. used to be a world leader, not a follower. :mad:
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We are the world leaders in research, development and health care. Lets hope we never become the " leaders" down into socialism.
 
Benvolio said:
We are the world leaders in research, development and health care. Lets hope we never become the " leaders" down into socialism.
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You're among the bottom of the chart for first world healthcare actually.

And no need to worry - smarter countries have long since become the leaders into socialism, and prospered massively for it.
 
chrisrobin said:
Health care? :rotflmao:
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We have the best health care available. For those without insurance it may less but even then, Medicaid is available. As with anything else, some can afford the best, some cannot.
 
Benvolio said:
We have the best health care available. For those without insurance it may less but even then, Medicaid is available. As with anything else, some can afford the best, some cannot.
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Yer boy has it down: "the makers v the takers."
 
Rolyo85 said:
You're among the bottom of the [STRIKE]chart[/STRIKE] ocean for first world healthcare actually.

And no need to worry - smarter countries have long since become the leaders into socialism, and prospered massively for it.
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New perjorative: socialist = motherfucker.
Hey Benny, tell us all about socialism. Inquiring minds want to know! (!)
 
Benvolio said:
We have the best health care available. For those without insurance it may less but even then, Medicaid is available. As with anything else, some can afford the best, some cannot.
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You are speaking only of the exclusive, prohibitively expensive top end of elite care that for all intents and purposes is completely inaccessible to the overwhelming majority of ordinary Americans anyway. You're talking about John Hopkins or similar. The overwhelming majority of Americans pay more for their healthcare than Canadians, while receiving less healthcare than Canadians, and reporting less satisfaction with their treatments and outcomes than Canadians-- and than many western Europeans.

This is like saying Americans are obvious better off than other people because look how many diamonds costing more than $100,000 are purchased here. It tells us absolutely nothing about the average realistic experience.
 
xbuzzerx said:
You are speaking only of the exclusive, prohibitively expensive top end of elite care that for all intents and purposes is completely inaccessible to the overwhelming majority of ordinary Americans anyway. You're talking about John Hopkins or similar. The overwhelming majority of Americans pay more for their healthcare than Canadians, while receiving less healthcare than Canadians, and reporting less satisfaction with their treatments and outcomes than Canadians-- and than many western Europeans.

This is like saying Americans are obvious better off than other people because look how many diamonds costing more than $100,000 are purchased here. It tells us absolutely nothing about the average realistic experience.
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Furthermore, Saudi oil barons have the same access to superb healthcare...
 
Benvolio said:
We have the best health care available. For those without insurance it may less but even then, Medicaid is available. As with anything else, some can afford the best, some cannot.
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Medicaid, yes, in states where *REPUBLICANS* haven't gone and TAKEN IT AWAY so that the poor can't get shit for healthcare.
 
No person withdraws their labour from the market because taxes got just a bit too high. No one says "Damn it, my withholdings increased by 4%. I quit."

People will say "I get too many tax deductions for my spouse to bother working. He/she would have to earn X to make it break even so no point them returning to work." That is a problem with the incentive structure of ridiculous deductions, not with the tax rate.

And people will say "Thank fuck I no longer have to work to pay for my chemo." Again, not a problem with tax rates. That's a problem with too much basic humanity dragging down the labour market.
 
Benvolio said:
We have the best health care available. For those without insurance it may less but even then, Medicaid is available. As with anything else, some can afford the best, some cannot.
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NO, "we" do not -- a few percent do, and that's not the same thing at all. What Americans mostly have is the overworked emergency room.
 
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