Occupy Wall Street

[jackoroe]

Reports coming out tonight that OWS protestors have vandalized the 911 memorial.

NYPD gets tough on OWS protestors

While a good number of the protestors are trying to keep the protests peaceful and lawful, even working to clean up the messes made by the anarchists in their midst. I've been hearing more and more commentary on the radio and TV saying the police in NY and other cities are reaching the end of their patience.

I didn't see that anyone from the protest was charged with the 9/11 memorial damage, so it isn't fair that we blame them for that. They do plenty of fucked up things to hold them accountable for, this does not appear to be one of them.

Their message is being lost in favor of the party. The OWS crowd is becoming the dinner guest who won't leave despite the host yawning and turning the lights off. They've had ample time to make their point. Now it's time for them to move on to lobby the people who can actually make change.

 

[jackoroe]

What a rotten sentiment. Seriously.

I don't know how the closure will go.

I hope no one is hurt.

I hope no one is hurt, either. But that's completely in the hands of the protesters. If they vacate the park as they've been instructed, there won't be any issues.

 

[White Eagle]

buovLQ9qyWQ#!
Oh yeah, the police do not get violent. What the fuck do you call this, attacking students in a peaceful protest. Even though they are the Berkeley police.

http://www.alternet.org/newsandview...otesters_shut_out_of_harvard_yard/#paragraph3

Occupy Updates: Extreme Police Violence in Berkeley, With Calls for a Strike; Harvard Protesters Shut Out of Harvard Yard

A few Occupy stories for today:

--The big news is the violent police clash that took place yesterday at Occupy Berkeley. In the below video, you can clearly see police officers in riot gear (Salon's Justin Elliot identifies them as UC Berkeley police) hitting the protesters with batons and bean bag guns. The violence started after Berkeley students tried to set up tents on the school's campus following a 3,000-person rally at the school. Police tore down the tents and arrested seven occupiers during the clash.

 

[White Eagle]

I forgot the video of it.

 

[Kulindahr]

I didn't see that anyone from the protest was charged with the 9/11 memorial damage, so it isn't fair that we blame them for that. They do plenty of fucked up things to hold them accountable for, this does not appear to be one of them.

Their message is being lost in favor of the party. The OWS crowd is becoming the dinner guest who won't leave despite the host yawning and turning the lights off. They've had ample time to make their point. Now it's time for them to move on to lobby the people who can actually make change.

If they were policing the morons who have moved in among them, there would be no problem. But even then, it would soon enough be a change in tactics, anyway: camp out tidily in one place long enough and people stop noticing you.

The only thing I can think of for them to do is to have 'flash mobs' coalesce at various places related to the issue and stage one- or two-day events.
And shoot for not a million-man mass in D.C., but at least twice that.

 

[Kulindahr]

I hope no one is hurt, either. But that's completely in the hands of the protesters. If they vacate the park as they've been instructed, there won't be any issues.

Your faith in the police is touching.






It's also naive.

 

[JayHawk]

Yeah. I heard the same about the 20k being deposited to Wells Fargo.

If anything that move illustrates the point rather succintly. And the point is a question, what now?

All these problems have come to the forefront of the world's consciousness but little or no solutions have sprung forth behind them.

BTW, the tiny protest in my home town has disbanded. They've packed up and gone home. The fervor was never really there. Doesn't mean the problems have lessened though.

It is time for the people who actually have ideas in the OWS movement to step up and offer a way forward. Some leadership.

I was beaten and told I didn't get it earlier when I suggested that the people who have real issues and real solutions step up to the plate. They did so in Occupy Cincinnati but it does not appear that outside of one town in America the OS folks are interested in actually using our system to make change.

What the video above demonstrates is that even in uber-liberal parts of this nation there will be no standing and burning it till it changes protest. They will be squashed. I know beat me up because I say that. Whatever. In many places the authorities have allowed this crap to go on and then there is continuing unacceptable damage to personal and public property and felonious activities. I mean in fuckin Berkeley? Really?

Something I don't get from the Berkeley video is why about nine to 20 officers appear surrounded by thousands of students? It has to be just the angle of the shoot. If I was surrounded by a mob and they wouldn't let me pass and were screaming in my face i might react. But then again those kids either need to choose. Leave or disarm those cops. Just standing there getting swacked is ignorant.

 

[White Eagle]

I didn't see that anyone from the protest was charged with the 9/11 memorial damage, so it isn't fair that we blame them for that. They do plenty of fucked up things to hold them accountable for, this does not appear to be one of them.

Their message is being lost in favor of the party. The OWS crowd is becoming the dinner guest who won't leave despite the host yawning and turning the lights off. They've had ample time to make their point. Now it's time for them to move on to lobby the people who can actually make change.

This is one of the times you look at the source. In this case the Post. Owner Murdoch.
I found the rest of stardreamers article. Here:

http://www.salon.com/2011/11/11/ny_post_blames_occupy_for_911_memorial_vandalism/

But it’s not until 11 paragraphs later, by which time most people have probably stopped reading, that the Post offers the full reveal:

The detectives, who began working cases at the park two weeks ago, are also investigating two acts of vandalism on the 9/11 Memorial.

In the first, a heart was etched near a name on the bronze memorial. Cops suspect the perpetrator may have been a family member of a victim.

And last week, a drawing of a skull was found on the memorial. Both marks were removed.

And this from a google.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x2285839

Quick update on the New York Post’s total war on Occupy Wall Street: The Murdoch tabloid is now claiming that Occupy Wall Street demonstrators defaced the new 9/11 memorial, despite absolutely no evidence that anything of the sort happened.

Here’s how the story, which was written by Philip Messing and Bob Fredericks and ran under the headline “NYPD sends elite detectives to Wall St. protests,” begins:

The NYPD has moved three elite Manhattan homicide detectives and a deputy chief to the raucous Occupy Wall Street protest in response to a rash of sex attacks, thefts and vandalism — including graffiti scrawled on the nearby 9/11 Memorial, The Post has learned.


The 9/11 memorial is just a few blocks from Zuccotti Park, the heart of the Occupy Wall Street, and this latest outrage is certainly in keeping with the Post’s description of the park as “a sliver of madness, rife with sex attacks, robberies and vigilante justice.”

comment
2. Knowing how Murdoch operates (thanks to UK investigations), he probably hired the vandals.

 

[Stardreamer]

The problem being this is not an isolated incident which makes people more willing to believe it. The good news is the OWS protestors themselves have tried to stop and clean up the actions of a few.

I suspect you are right that this is the Post which is not exactly the most reserved news source out there drawing conclusions. But when combined with what has happened in Oakland and other places it make ready grist for the media.

 

[White Eagle]

The Partnership for Civil Justice Fund, PCJF, has requested New York City District Attorney Cyrus R. Vance, Jr., to dismiss the arrests of the 700+ protesters at the Brooklyn Bridge. Citing the cost of the trials, funded by taxpayers,, it is an obvious answer to the problem. The titles of the article follows but the main letter is in PDF form and you can get it at the last URL below.

http://www.justiceonline.org/

Breaking News: PCJF files class action lawsuit for Oct. 1 Brooklyn Bridge Mass Arrest
Read the complaint filed for the Brooklyn Bridge mass arrest of Oct. 1, 2011. more >>

Click here to download a PDF of the class-action complaint.

http://www2.justiceonline.org/site/...ss_Action_Complaint.pdf?docID=1742#navpanes=0

 

[White Eagle]

The problem being this is not an isolated incident which makes people more willing to believe it. The good news is the OWS protestors themselves have tried to stop and clean up the actions of a few.

I suspect you are right that this is the Post which is not exactly the most reserved news source out there drawing conclusions. But when combined with what has happened in Oakland and other places it make ready grist for the media.

I wasn't trying to dismiss your post, I'm just leery of The Post and Murdoch. I googled to see what else I could find and most of the links were right winged. But, finally found the article I posted.

 

[HenryReardon]

I didn't see that anyone from the protest was charged with the 9/11 memorial damage, so it isn't fair that we blame them for that. They do plenty of fucked up things to hold them accountable for, this does not appear to be one of them.

Their message is being lost in favor of the party. The OWS crowd is becoming the dinner guest who won't leave despite the host yawning and turning the lights off. They've had ample time to make their point. Now it's time for them to move on to lobby the people who can actually make change.

The Occupy Wall Street crowd remind me of something in the comic strip Lil Abner - S.W.I.N.E. Students wildy indignant about nearly everything.

I searched for SWINE and found a blogger who had written much the same thing, and said it quite eloquently.

http://lubbockonline.com/interact/b...nts-wildly-indignant-about-nearly-everything”

 

[White Eagle]

I believe you are looking at the situation backwards. Capp didn't hate the dissenters, he hated the ones that caused trouble. The 99% are the ones that are Occupy Wall Street. What your link states as the 4% being the ones destroying things.

Capp became a popular public speaker on college campuses, where he reportedly relished hecklers. He attacked militant antiwar demonstrators, both in his personal appearances and in his strip. He also satirized student political groups. The Youth International Party (YIP) and Students for a Democratic Society (SDS) emerged in Li'l Abner as "Students Wildly Indignant about Nearly Everything!" (SWINE). In an April 1969 letter to Time, Capp insisted, "The students I blast are not the dissenters, but the destroyers—the less than 4% who lock up deans in washrooms, who burn manuscripts of unpublished books, who make combination pigpens and playpens of their universities. The remaining 96% detest them as heartily as I do."

 

[HenryReardon]

I believe you are looking at the situation backwards. Capp didn't hate the dissenters, he hated the ones that caused trouble. The 99% are the ones that are Occupy Wall Street. What your link states as the 4% being the ones destroying things.

1% 4% 99% It's all the same--mindless goons celebrating Obama's class warfare.

 

[JayHawk]

I looked up some OWS news today just to get my fix and I was interested in two stories in particular. The first one is just plain ODD. Say this with me out loud.... "Occupy Harvard" .... how exactly does the nations wealthiest children get into tents in Harvard commons and camp out to profess support for that which would eat them? Very odd to me indeed.

Have a read if you have an inclination:

Occupy Harvard: Nation's most exclusive tent city

The second story has the same kinda lead in that Occupy Oakland had where they announced ahead of time a set place and time for the anarchist to converge and make the story about violence instead of civil redress. In Portland they have announced that the camp must disband and be taken down. The response has been rather alarming. IF you believe the news reports. The protesters are using pallets to make shields and nails drive into planks for weapons. Along with taking precautions to get gas mask along with the normal planned protest use of coke and lemon to clear the gas and wet rags....

SO I will go ahead and predict that if they come back at authorities with intent to fight back then the armed insurrection will get bloody at that point. Beyond anything you have seen in American streets to include the Civil rights marches and all of the sixties. This one is brewing.

Police: Occupy Portland calling for reinforcements

 

[JayHawk]

I believe you are looking at the situation backwards. Capp didn't hate the dissenters, he hated the ones that caused trouble. The 99% are the ones that are Occupy Wall Street. What your link states as the 4% being the ones destroying things.

White Eagle the problem is that the violent or radical folks amongst a movement become the movement unless the movement extracts that from their midst. OWS across the nation have demonstrated that they don't have the desire to do that... meanwhile posters in here have insinuated that the cops should be in the camps doing the peace keeping. Yet you have seen the video. How likely are one or two police officers to go patrolling through a group of people who randomly shout shit at them like they are an occupying army. I would feel safe doing so and I cant imagine any of those cops do either. SO the environment does not support allowing the police to do their job.

The movement will be characterized by the loudest part. The squeaky wheel and all that bunk.

 

[White Eagle]

Just saying

 

[jackoroe]

I looked up some OWS news today just to get my fix and I was interested in two stories in particular. The first one is just plain ODD. Say this with me out loud.... "Occupy Harvard" .... how exactly does the nations wealthiest children get into tents in Harvard commons and camp out to profess support for that which would eat them? Very odd to me indeed.

Have a read if you have an inclination:

Occupy Harvard: Nation's most exclusive tent city

The second story has the same kinda lead in that Occupy Oakland had where they announced ahead of time a set place and time for the anarchist to converge and make the story about violence instead of civil redress. In Portland they have announced that the camp must disband and be taken down. The response has been rather alarming. IF you believe the news reports. The protesters are using pallets to make shields and nails drive into planks for weapons. Along with taking precautions to get gas mask along with the normal planned protest use of coke and lemon to clear the gas and wet rags....

SO I will go ahead and predict that if they come back at authorities with intent to fight back then the armed insurrection will get bloody at that point. Beyond anything you have seen in American streets to include the Civil rights marches and all of the sixties. This one is brewing.

Police: Occupy Portland calling for reinforcements

I sincerely hope that the protestors do not engage in this foolish course of action. Boards with nails used as a weapon will get you dead in very short order. Guaranteed.

Just leave peacefully. You've had almost two months to make your point. Move on.

 

[JayHawk]

I love me some Maxine but don't get the inference.....

 

[White Eagle]

I love me some Maxine but don't get the inference.....

No inference intended, just the first one I came up on.
Some reason I only got 4 left.