Oregon's "Driver's Card" idea -- brilliant, or foolish?

[Kulindahr]

According to an article published by USA Today [SUP][August 2013][/SUP], 27 percent of households are occupied by a single person.

But the average is like two and a half. Immigrants from Mexico here frequently have six or eight people in a 400 - 500 sq. ft. apartment. There have been a few times where the state has stepped in and told them they can't have so many -- just down the street there were twelve guys sharing an apartment! They sort of lived in it by fours; each set of four worked a different shift, so they actually only used four beds.

 

[xbuzzerx]

That's how it seems to work at the office. The interesting thing is that if you're an illegal but have a child born here, you can get benefits for the kid:

So far as I know, it's always worked that way. Children born here are U.S. citizens. There have been various motions in states like California to try to bar children of immigrants from public education or other public services but they've always been struck down pretty rapidly in the courts as unconstitutional.

 

[bankside]

There aren't that many places that allow citizenship by location of birth.

 

[Kulindahr]

So far as I know, it's always worked that way. Children born here are U.S. citizens. There have been various motions in states like California to try to bar children of immigrants from public education or other public services but they've always been struck down pretty rapidly in the courts as unconstitutional.

That really needs to be tweaked so at least it applies only to residents.

 

[bankside]

That really needs to be tweaked so at least it applies only to residents.

I think a lot of countries are backing away from pure Jus Soli (right of citizenship "by soil," i.e. the land on which one is born) to a modified version where citizenship is granted to the children of anyone legally present in the country: existing citizen, permanent resident, registered refugee. The only exception would probably be UN requirements that a country cannot make a person stateless by its nationality laws, so if someone sneaks in and gives birth, it is fine to deny local citizenship as long as the kid will get citizenship from their parents. If the other country does not allow citizenship based on parental connection, then the kid is probably the problem of the country in which its born.

I think that's a good balance.

 

[xbuzzerx]

That really needs to be tweaked so at least it applies only to residents.

I'm a little confused, what non-resident citizens would be showing up to attend public schools or get food stamps?

 

[Telstra]

Its a brilliant idea because the idea is brilliant ...

 

[Benvolio]

The Obama administration has actually encouraged illegals to get food stamps
http://www.judicialwatch.org/press-...ing-u-s-food-stamp-program-for-illegal-aliens
http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/dgreenfield/obama-free-to-go-on-advertising-food-stamps-in-mexico/
This of course is part of the Obama administration plan to swamp the elections of the country with immigrants who strongly tend to vote democrat. Amnesty and fast track to citizenship. In the meantime, no IDs at the polls.

 

[xbuzzerx]

The Obama administration has actually encouraged illegals to get food stamps
http://www.judicialwatch.org/press-...ing-u-s-food-stamp-program-for-illegal-aliens
http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/dgreenfield/obama-free-to-go-on-advertising-food-stamps-in-mexico/
This of course is part of the Obama administration plan to swamp the elections of the country with immigrants who strongly tend to vote democrat. Amnesty and fast track to citizenship. In the meantime, no IDs at the polls.

The glorious thing is that the greed of Republicans eager to profit off immigrant labor allows us to carry out this insidious plot. Mwa ha ha ha! Are you learning Spanish yet, Ben?

 

[Kulindahr]

I'm a little confused, what non-resident citizens would be showing up to attend public schools or get food stamps?

??? I'm a little confused where you got that.

What I was referring to was a practice where people from Asian countries fly to the US, especially Hawaii, to have their kids born, so the kid automatically has US citizenship. Then they fly back home with the kid.

 

[xbuzzerx]

So far as I know, it's always worked that way. Children born here are U.S. citizens. There have been various motions in states like California to try to bar children of immigrants from public education or other public services but they've always been struck down pretty rapidly in the courts as unconstitutional.

That really needs to be tweaked so at least it applies only to residents.

??? I'm a little confused where you got that.

^ Had no idea if you were referring to children born on US soil attending public schools, receiving food aid or what.

What I was referring to was a practice where people from Asian countries fly to the US, especially Hawaii, to have their kids born, so the kid automatically has US citizenship. Then they fly back home with the kid.

I saw an article on this sometime in the last year and if I'm not mistaken the numbers of people doing this was in the low hundreds. Unless that information was incorrect, I can't possibly see the effects of this within the broader whole of immigration to be anything but negligible. I also don't know what citizen children living and residing overseas are eligible for in terms of benefits, but I'd have to imagine it's highly restricted, and many locally funded services (like education) are obviously not something they're using if they do not reside here.

 

[TX-Beau]

Re: Oregon's "Driver's Card" idea -- brilliant, or foolish?

I have no problem with kids who are born here being citizens.

- - - Updated - - -

AND getting the full benefit of whatever social services there are.

 

[Benvolio]

Re: Oregon's "Driver's Card" idea -- brilliant, or foolish?

I have no problem with kids who are born here being citizens.

- - - Updated - - -

AND getting the full benefit of whatever social services there are.

The real issue are parents coming here so the child will be born here so the parents can get all the freebies at the expense of American taxpayers.

 

[TX-Beau]

No, the real issue is that Americans hire the parents to get around American labor laws.

If it were up to me, I'd let them come here legally to work, and offer them the option of working towards citizenship. The biggest lie you tell yourself is the one about how they all want to stay here.

 

[cgymike]

There's a measure Oregon will be voting on, to give not driver's licenses, but driver's "cards", to people who need to drive but can't legally get a license. I assume it's to make illegal immigrants get official authorization to drive, meaning they'd have to pass the same tests as for a license. Here's a link: http://voteyeson88.com/about/?tab=overview

I can't decide if it's a good idea or not. The card would be recognized only for driving, not for anything else; it doesn't even mean you're legal to be here. It's not supposed to be for identification, but I don't see police, at any rate, not using it that way.

How would you vote? and why?

Insurance companies will penalize you if they find you have it.

 

[Benvolio]

Are they required to have insurance to obtain the card?

 

[mightbe]

Are they required to have insurance to obtain the card?

Um...Only if they own a vehicle (which isn't likely). Otherwise there's no point...

 

[Kulindahr]

Insurance companies will penalize you if they find you have it.

Source?

 

[Kulindahr]

Um...Only if they own a vehicle (which isn't likely). Otherwise there's no point...

Why isn't that likely? Last I knew, you didn't need a license or proof of citizenship to buy a car.

 

[mightbe]

Why isn't that likely? Last I knew, you didn't need a license or proof of citizenship to buy a car.

I was speaking about undocumented immigrants; not necessarily everyone that the law applies to. If you're undocumented (the part that Benvolio's most concerned about) then you'll likely need a license to legally operate an employer's vehicle. Thus, the employer pays for the insurance.

And you forget that in Ben's world all immigrants are illegal and brown (my post was mostly directed at him). And it's true that according to Ben that the brown horde will never make enough money to own a vehicle because they spend too much time getting food stamps and free healthcare...