P Diddy presents discrimination and promotes hate crimes

[BenjamanT]

On the April 6, 2007 episode of the HBO series P. Diddy Presents The Bad Boys of Comedy a comedian entitled Damn Fool was included. Among the bits Fool did in his routine was one about getting arrested for fighting with two gay men. After insulting the men with various words and ways Damn Fool stopping short (ever so shortly) of calling them "fags" -- this of course done to much laughter and applause by TBBOC audience.

The gist of the comedy bit was that Fool was arrested, taken before a judge and when he discovered the sentence (7 to 8 years) for his hate crime claimed he was gay and received 2 weeks for a domestic crime. The physical depiction of Fool's courtroom behavior to prove his gayness was of course as offensive and stereotypical as possible. Again, the audience reacted to Fool with much laughter, foot stomping and applause. After leaving the stage, Fool was shown with P. Diddy who told him how bright a future he had before him. Who knew hate crimes could be so hilarious perhaps P. Diddy or HBO could help the Shepherd family to find the humor?

There is just so much that could be said about this show ... this comedian ... P. Diddy for allowing such hate discrimination to go unchecked. If Don Imus is going to be held to a standard for his words (and believe me I am not defending him) then shouldn't all media?

 

[mark1111]

No, sorry, only white males can be labeled racist, sexist etc...

Way to many double standards allowed.

 

[jimrent66]

No, sorry, only white males can be labeled racist, sexist etc...

Way to many double standards allowed.

I completely agree with your statement.

 

[BlueLantern]

Double agree, If anyone did anything to him, even without any racist intention or method, the guy would be labeled as racist and probably go to jail.

 

[SimonSeven]

No, sorry, only white males can be labeled racist, sexist etc...

Way to many double standards allowed.

I completely agree with this statement. While its true everyone should be held accountable for racist, sexist, homophobic remarks and behaviors, I think white people in general have no right going there! After hundreds of years of slavery and many more years of segregation, humiliation and denial of basic human rights its the least they owe the minorities of this country. A formal apology or restitution has never and probably never will come from this government and racism and hate towards blacks continues to this very day! As a young black man who is intelligent, well dressed and overall a good person from a good family and a great neighborhood, I tend to get followed around in stores at the mall (except when I'm with my white friends..then its OK), I hear car doors locking whenever I try and cross the street or parking lot to get to my Audi, and worst of all dare I walk the same street at night as a white woman..you would think my only motive in life was to rape or murder them from the looks they give me and other black men. Oh and don't even get me started on being one of the handful of minorities growing up in my highschool...you defiantly see the difference in the way teachers treat students. Certain parts of this country I would never step foot in..unless I wanted to get lynched! Don Imus deserved to be fired and it should have happened a lot sooner! Racism in general gets me sick but in my personal experience I've only experienced it from white people.I'm sick and tired of hearing all this double standard crap from everyone on tv..yes there's a double standard and rightfully so! Racism from Caucasians is absolutely unacceptable under any circumstance! As for Diddy...well he's a douchebag and I've never liked him so whatever.

sorry if my remark rubs certain people the wrong way, but its my opinion and I'm entitled to it!

 

[mark1111]

Hey Simon,

With all this stuff going on, its easy for me to say that. I'm sorry, reading your post wants me to ask you to go have a beer and talk. I never liked Imus and only heard him once driving through NY and then only for a minute while looking to change the channel. Now if we can get rid of rush and his side kicks...

 

[SimonSeven]

No apology needed, I understand how you feel. Imus was jerk and he deserved to get canned! I'm ashamed to say that he is from my home state of Connecticut. The skit on Diddy's Comedy Show comes from the fact that the African American Community for the most part is really not accepting of homosexuals and can be downright hateful at times! I think it mostly comes from the fact that Religion and Spirituality plays a huge part in the African American Culture and Black Church's preach that homosexuality is sin. I think that attitude towards gays is changing now, but complete reform takes time.

 

[RobinGoodfellow]

SimonSeven:

1) Several formal apologies from the government have been rendered. I wouldn't hold my breath re: restitution, however. Not trying to be a jerk; just pointing out that it has happened.

2) If you really want to see discrimination end you need to realize that not only white attitudes need to change. Consider if Imus had been black; would his statements have carried the same weight? Can your white friends use the SAME terms as your blacks friends without any problems? Can I, as white person, call you "nigger" (meaning "friend") as a black person would without you getting mad?

This is a jerk point: You need to realize that there are a lot of black attitudes that rub a lot of people the wrong way. Shouting out at movies, swearing loudly into a cell phone in the middle of a store, disrespecting others, not greeting other people when greeted, even playing rap music loudly. I know that there are number of things non-blacks do that annoy blacks (or even other non-blacks), but you need to want to be part of the community in order to be part of it, and too many blacks act apart from the community rather than with others.

That you don't consider that non-whites can be racist is an interesting detail in and of itself. Especially after decades of being told how superior blacks are (they only have soul, bigger penises, blacks have better fashions, etc.), and then throw in that you don't see how blacks can possibly be racist, and it makes for an interesting issue. Now that affirmative action has been taken out of the equation in some areas, the complaints are even worse that blacks are being treated even worse and opportunities have been diminished, even as less than 1/3 of scholarship money specifically slotted for blacks goes unclaimed. Read: I'm hearing more complaints than solutions, even though the solutions are right there. What happens if black leaders stopped looking for problems, and started using those solutions?

Racism is still out there. No question of that. But...how one-sided is it, really?

3) As far as security goes: Here's the deal: I work as security myself. My job is to solve problems before they get bad enough to call the cops, and so I look for potential problems. Someone that comes in and is acting disrespectful to other people, are yelling in order to get attention, get angry if told no, get even angrier if helped before they ask for but obviously need it, and basically act if they rule the roost, usually get my attention. If you make it a point to stick out, I'm going to keep an eye on you.

On the other hand, someone that's there for actually business (ie, find it/grab it/buy it), acts respectfully, and basically is just part of the crowd, will get ignored by me. [Unfortunately, decent shop-lifters know this. Heh.]

Keep one other thing in mind: Just because I'm following you, doesn't mean that I'm following you. One night I was checking to see how long the line for the meat counter is (I work at a carniceria, and I love the carnitas and chicaronnes, and it was getting close to closing), but a black man had just joined the line. He nailed me for following him!

In other words: Act like you belong there and play nice, and I bet you'll see less of the following.

For what it's worth...
RG

 

[RobinGoodfellow]

And sorry if I'm coming off as a major jack-ass on this topic lately. It's just that I'm that I'm listening to a lot of black leaders, and I'm hearing a lot of the problems but no solutions. Worse, I keep hearing how it's always someone else's fault and that the black community needs to look to itself for answers.

In the meantime, blacks are so interested in making sure that they are respected that they forget that you need to respect others as well, or even that other people may have different tastes. It's easy to say that there haven't been a lot of black movies nominated for Oscars; at the same time, there have been few black movies that appeal to groups besides blacks. That is, it's easy to point out a problem; it's harder to recognize that the problem may come from the community itself.

In the 1990s, for example, the NAACP wanted more minority writers, and so threatened to cause advertisers to strike if they didn't enforce a "if you have a minority character, you need to have a writer of the same minority writing that character" policy. As there just weren't that many minority writers, the networks' solution was to start cutting minority characters. Bear in mind that most networks already had programs in place to look for and encourage minority writers to come forward, but there just wasn't a lot of interest in those programs. The NAACP itself didn't exactly encourage minority writers; if anything, it stressed independent movies as a way for minorities in order to get writing experience.

Had it had its own programs for writers, or encouraged minority writers to get into the major studios, the concept wouldn't have backfired as badly as it did.

It's interesting that blacks don't see education as an answer; less than a third of scholarship and grant money that has been specifically set up for blacks is actually used, or even applied for. And yet the major complaint is lack of funding; it just doesn't make any sense to me...

Sorry; it's just not making sense to me anymore...

RG

 

[SimonSeven]

SimonSeven:

1) Several formal apologies from the government have been rendered. I wouldn't hold my breath re: restitution, however. Not trying to be a jerk; just pointing out that it has happened.

2) If you really want to see discrimination end you need to realize that not only white attitudes need to change. Consider if Imus had been black; would his statements have carried the same weight? Can your white friends use the SAME terms as your blacks friends without any problems? Can I, as white person, call you "nigger" (meaning "friend") as a black person would without you getting mad?

This is a jerk point: You need to realize that there are a lot of black attitudes that rub a lot of people the wrong way. Shouting out at movies, swearing loudly into a cell phone in the middle of a store, disrespecting others, not greeting other people when greeted, even playing rap music loudly. I know that there are number of things non-blacks do that annoy blacks (or even other non-blacks), but you need to want to be part of the community in order to be part of it, and too many blacks act apart from the community rather than with others.

That you don't consider that non-whites can be racist is an interesting detail in and of itself. Especially after decades of being told how superior blacks are (they only have soul, bigger penises, blacks have better fashions, etc.), and then throw in that you don't see how blacks can possibly be racist, and it makes for an interesting issue. Now that affirmative action has been taken out of the equation in some areas, the complaints are even worse that blacks are being treated even worse and opportunities have been diminished, even as less than 1/3 of scholarship money specifically slotted for blacks goes unclaimed. Read: I'm hearing more complaints than solutions, even though the solutions are right there. What happens if black leaders stopped looking for problems, and started using those solutions?

Racism is still out there. No question of that. But...how one-sided is it, really?

3) As far as security goes: Here's the deal: I work as security myself. My job is to solve problems before they get bad enough to call the cops, and so I look for potential problems. Someone that comes in and is acting disrespectful to other people, are yelling in order to get attention, get angry if told no, get even angrier if helped before they ask for but obviously need it, and basically act if they rule the roost, usually get my attention. If you make it a point to stick out, I'm going to keep an eye on you.

On the other hand, someone that's there for actually business (ie, find it/grab it/buy it), acts respectfully, and basically is just part of the crowd, will get ignored by me. [Unfortunately, decent shop-lifters know this. Heh.]

Keep one other thing in mind: Just because I'm following you, doesn't mean that I'm following you. One night I was checking to see how long the line for the meat counter is (I work at a carniceria, and I love the carnitas and chicaronnes, and it was getting close to closing), but a black man had just joined the line. He nailed me for following him!

In other words: Act like you belong there and play nice, and I bet you'll see less of the following.

For what it's worth...
RG

Robin in response to your statements....

1. I'm 24 yrs old and in my entire life I've never heard or read of an apology from this government on slavery, and yes restitution should be given out to blacks of this country who are descendants of slaves. Why is it in high school the subject of slavery rarely exceeds more then two chapters in History class, when slavery played a huge part in American History and The United States was essentially built on the backs and sweat off enslaved and tortured Blacks.

2. My black friends and I don't use the N word in any form, whether its nigger or nigga or whatever. You will find that most people who are educated regardless of race will not use terms like that. Growing up in a family with values we weren't allowed to use derogatory words of any sort and I follow that rule to this day as an adult. Plain and simple its ignorant and has no place in the English vocabulary. You will also find that any black man who has any respect for the women in his family will NEVER use words like "Nappy Headed Hoe's" against a woman let alone a black woman.

As for as your statement on security I believe you have a preconceived stereotype on African Americans. You may not realize it but what you said comes off as racist and prejudice to me. I have never walked into a store being loud and boisterous as you have explained, nor have I walked into a store acting "like I own the place", I don't dress like I've just stepped off a Ying Yang Twins video shoot, yet somehow I still get followed around and get asked if I need assistance several times in a few minutes. The same can be said about my other black friends. Are we not allowed to just shop in peace? Magically somehow when I'm with a group of white people which happens often since I have friends of all races, we are just greeted once when we enter and are allowed to roam and browse all we want. How do you explain that?

Are you also insinuating that a black person who doesn't walk into a store and grab an item and purchase immediately isn't there for business and just wants to cause trouble? Rarely have I walked into a store and just grabbed something and purchased, I don't make impulse purchases on anything. I can't explain the countless times I've witnessed a white person in front of me pay for a purchase with a credit card and not get asked for a license, yet when I do the same minutes later I still get asked even though all my cards are clearly signed on the back. When that happens if I have the time I ask for a manager or supervisor immediately and ask them why is it the cashier wants my drivers license for verification, yet didn't ask the white person in front of me for one. I also explain to them that I will be calling their district office and asking for a copy of their merchant policy, and if my rights have been violated in any way I will be filing a complaint against the cashier and the stores management. Many merchant policies dictate that when a credit card is signed and the signature on the receipt or signature pad matches, that additional identification CANNOT be asked! Many times the cashier and the manager don't really know what to say and just stand there and apologize for any inconvenience.

Here's the point Robin, as a person who isn't African American you will never understand the daily struggles that many blacks in this country face on a daily basis. Racism isn't in your face like it used to be, rarely does anyone come out and call you a nigger anymore but believe me when I say that racism happens on a daily basis to blacks in this country, its just a lot more subtle. Sometimes your notice and fight for your rights, but many times you just ignore it because you can't fight every battle.

 

[RobinGoodfellow]

Robin in response to your statements....

1. I'm 24 yrs old and in my entire life I've never heard or read of an apology from this government on slavery, and yes restitution should be given out to blacks of this country who are descendants of slaves. Why is it in high school the subject of slavery rarely exceeds more then two chapters in History class, when slavery played a huge part in American History and The United States was essentially built on the backs and sweat off enslaved and tortured Blacks.

It's time to do research then...A number of states have given apologies, and there have a number of resolutions in Congress to do the same. And that's ignoring the various statements right after the Civil War.

Also, I'm not debating that slavery wasn't a big part, but you may be over-stating the situation (outside of some pop culture references (you could argue that most of US pop culture is due to blacks), the majority of slave contributions is pretty much limited to agriculture). Besides, two chapters is a lot...

2. My black friends and I don't use the N word in any form, whether its nigger or nigga or whatever. You will find that most people who are educated regardless of race will not use terms like that.

You'd like to think so, wouldn't you? I know too many exceptions, however.

Growing up in a family with values we weren't allowed to use derogatory words of any sort and I follow that rule to this day as an adult. Plain and simple its ignorant and has no place in the English vocabulary.

No question about that, and it definitely backs your point about being raised right.

As for as your statement on security I believe you have a preconceived stereotype on African Americans.

In any discussion it helps to listen to what is being said. Some things you need to realize:
a) Security is about being paranoid, not being optimistic. Even black security officers tend to be paranoid re: blacks, and it's based off experience. It's easy to say it's racist, but you need to realize that a security officer is looking at trends rather than individuals, and there's too many blacks out there that are more interested in doing stupid things.
b) Keep in mind the "trend concept". Meaning: I tend to ignore individuals that don't seem to pose a problem, regardless of race. I look for sore thumbs. Suffice to say, this drives my current employer nuts (she thinks that all blacks should be watched!).
3) You need to realize that if a members of a group with an easily identifiable characteristic tend to be a problem, then it's hard not to look at that group in general as a problem. I recognize that I'm a having a problem with it currently, BUT it has more to do with being beat by a group of blacks on the way to a friend's, as well as seeing a lot of stupidity in the black civil rights movement as a whole.

You may not realize it but what you said comes off as racist and prejudice to me.

Again, it helps to pay attention to what people say (I did realize it, and pointed out that I realized it in the post following this). I also realize that you may have a problem looking at the situation with a detached perspective. Something to consider...

I have never walked into a store being loud and boisterous as you have explained, nor have I walked into a store acting "like I own the place", I don't dress like I've just stepped off a Ying Yang Twins video shoot, yet somehow I still get followed around and get asked if I need assistance several times in a few minutes.

Actually, you have two separate things going on, and are seriously confusing the two. You need to realize that customer service is seriously amped-up lately; even us white boys are getting asked if we need help a lot.

Read: You're being given great customer service, and are complaining about it. Get a grip.

[My ex-room-mate complained of this a lot (she was older black woman). What clued me in that it wasn't race-related is the she mentioned that she did a lot of looking around in specific sections, rather than just going in and grabbing things; that made her target. Also, I tend to get the same greetings as she did. In other words, if she as a black woman and I as a white male got the same reactions, does that make it race-related?]

The same can be said about my other black friends. Are we not allowed to just shop in peace? Magically somehow when I'm with a group of white people which happens often since I have friends of all races, we are just greeted once when we enter and are allowed to roam and browse all we want. How do you explain that?

The two groups shop differently? Seriously: Next time, take note of how each group looks at things, what kind of things each one looks at, and how they do it. It just feels weird that two different groups would shop the EXACT same way (and it's not due to different races; it's just that each group has it's own dynamic).

Also, be aware that people that look like they have money (you did point out your better-than-lower class status) and anyone interested in fashion (or whatever the store is selling) tend to also get more attention than normal. In other words: There are a number of possible reasons you get more attention with your black friends than with your white friends, and they don't necessarily have anything to do with your color.

Read what you have typed closely:

I can't explain the countless times I've witnessed a white person in front of me pay for a purchase with a credit card and not get asked for a license, yet when I do the same minutes later I still get asked even though all my cards are clearly signed on the back. When that happens if I have the time I ask for a manager or supervisor immediately and ask them why is it the cashier wants my drivers license for verification, yet didn't ask the white person in front of me for one.

Weird. They ask for my ID all the time as well. And I'm white. My cards are signed, etc., and I'm a nice guy. Yet...they still ask for ID.

Oh: And you'll notice that you're watching what the person ahead of you is doing. At the same time, part of you is gearing up for yet another confrontation. The cashier is going to note those tells on some level (not necessarily a conscious one), and will tend to react to that.

I'm guessing you seriously suck at poker...

I also explain to them that I will be calling their district office and asking for a copy of their merchant policy, and if my rights have been violated in any way I will be filing a complaint against the cashier and the stores management. Many merchant policies dictate that when a credit card is signed and the signature on the receipt or signature pad matches, that additional identification CANNOT be asked! Many times the cashier and the manager don't really know what to say and just stand there and apologize for any inconvenience.

Here's the part to seriously read: Most people would just show the ID and get it over with. Yet YOU (already geared up, remember?) threaten to sue them over something that they didn't know. Not only did you precipitate the situation, but you then proceeded to make it worse.

And then the clerk is obviously going to be confused as to why he stopped you, as he wasn't reacting to something conscious (he was reacting to your interest in the other customer's card and you tensing up). At least, that would be my read on it...

Here's the point Robin, as a person who isn't African American you will never understand the daily struggles that many blacks in this country face on a daily basis. Racism isn't in your face like it used to be, rarely does anyone come out and call you a nigger anymore but believe me when I say that racism happens on a daily basis to blacks in this country, its just a lot more subtle. Sometimes your notice and fight for your rights, but many times you just ignore it because you can't fight every battle.

No offense, but I'm starting to notice big-time that a lot of black people look for racism, and that by looking for something that they claim is "subtle" can find something whether it exists or not. A local columnist even found racism in the awarding of the Super Bowl MVP to the white QB over two black running back (the honor is traditionally given to the QB of the winning team; the running backs would have been out of the running by default).

I agree that there is some racism out there; I'm just debating how much there is...

RG

 

[sunoftheskye]

Wow, I don't know what disgusts me more....the content of the original post...or some of the things said in this thread. What a sad, sad, world.

 

[luminum]

As a point of interest, why has no one fought for restitutions for Chinese immigrants? They worked on the vast railroads of the United States for pennies and many died being cheated along those tracks.

Do people apologize for all the abuse asians take, subtle and all in the present day? Or the offensive and stereotyped 'kung fu' films of the 70's? Even Blaxploitation ones.

I won't deny that you have a good amoutn of people int he country who range from subconsciously prejudiced to outright, unabashedly proud racists. But I think that everyone knows that the enslavement of Africans was wrong, and countless politicians and political figures have demonstrated their disapproval of America's history of slavery. If the status quo's obvious sentiment against slavery isn't apparent enough of the sentiment of the nation and its people, then asking fora formal apology almost seems petty. Formal apologies are important when ambiguity is about and the true sentiments of the individual or individuals in question must be made clear.

But can you honestly say that without a formal statement (by who, by the way) that one wouldn't know that the country disapproves of racism?

To tackle the later question, just who would give the apology? Would contemporary elected senators, such as Hilary Clinton, Edwards, or Obama be the right people to apologize for slavery? That doesn't seem right, since we all know they don't approve of it, and it isn't coming from people who have something to apologize for. Even President Bush doesn't seem like the right person, since he's a contemporary man. He might be sufficient for apologizing for the continuing sublte racism against African Americans (and other peopel of color for that matter).

But what exactly is a formal apology from the government? Bills passed by the legislative and judicial branches and passed by the executive?

I think it's well known and understood how deplorable slavery was, what more can be done?

As for reparations, how long can you chase after something? And will it work on an indiviudal basis? Will reparations make things better, say, if they're given by a white family that doesn't believe ins lavery or discrimination and cannot really afford to pay reparations? Will some decendents of slaves cut them slack? And to what degree does that throw the idea of reparations into perspective? Is it symbolic at that point?

It's gratifying to take reparation money from contemporary white citizens who still hold on to archaic ideas of enslavement and inequality, but is it gratifying to do so to allies?

 

[SimonSeven]

You know honestly Robin I could go on back and forth all day with you but it would just be a waste of my time and energy.You have your views and how you see the world and I guess in your world African American's essentially bring Racism and Hate upon themselves. I hope you also don't think that the Jew's deserved the Holocaust and the anti-Semitism they get to this very day.
You might think that your not racist or prejudice but a lot of the things you have wrote here say otherwise.

Like I said earlier you wouldn't understand the uphill struggles that blacks in this country face each and everyday, just like I wouldn't understand how a new immigrant to this country has to adapt to a new way of life or how an 18yr old black young woman in college might feel when some racist bigoted hick feels he has the right to call her and her peers "a bunch of nappy headed hoes!" There are some things in life that a person from the outside can never comprehend whether he chooses not to, doesn't care, or simply can't relate. I guess we can just agree to disagree and leave it at that.

 

[RobinGoodfellow]

Did you bother actually reading everything, or just the parts that were convenient to your mindset...

Had you bothered to read the entire thing, I freely admitted that there is racism, that there will always be racism, and there is nothing you can do to completely eliminate it. Read: We both agree that racism is a fact of life, and must be dealt with.

HOWEVER, I do believe that too many blacks look for racism in too many things. When my ex-room-mate was merely greeted, she took it as that she was being tagged, even when she received the same greeting anyone else would have received. When waitresses in a restaurant were just avoiding the manager, and happened to sit in the only area he couldn't see, she took it as them watching her.

Heck; I've seen black people not get jobs due to lack of experience, wearing seriously inappropriate clothes (strapless party dresses slit to the waist to a conservative office, for example), or just coming in with serious attitudes, and then complaining about racism being the reason that they lost the job. Is it racist if a person is hired due to skill, experience, and just the ability to wear appropriate dress? Or should I prioritize according to skin color over my office's needs?

You can tell me that I don't get the whole black experience. I'm really starting to not have a problem with that...

RG