Saying No to Dating a Bi Guy ?

[altlover85]

Google translate: From now on I will address all my points to you because you seem to agree with me in principle.

-d-

I actually don't agree with him in principle. Perhaps you should reread my posts.

 

[bankside]

You're losing me, because I thought I was being general. Johann's theory is that the middle of any argument is where the truth lies. I don't see it that way, because of the multitudes of arguments that exist in the world. The middle of every argument can't be where you want to be.

Person A: Lets kill all fags
Person B: No. They're people like the rest of us
Person A: Lets meet in the middle.

No. How 'bout let's not meet in the middle. How 'bout person A go fuck themself instead. It's often the intolerant folks, after a failing argument, wanting to meet in the middle, because meeting in the middle means compromising tolerance.

I am going to be quoting this line of reasoning often, in many different threads, because it illustrates such a compelling point. It is a problem in so many areas of public discourse. Sometimes "compromise" is not the answer. But some people insist on it, aggressively. They think the mid-point in any conflict is right. Previously I've termed it the "militant middle," but you can't beat your analogy for laying out the problem with that kind of mindset towards debate..

 

[altlover85]

bankside, people don't usually change their minds overnight. It usually takes time. You aren't going to convince everyone. In matters of violence, I do agree with advocating against it.

 

[Lube]

Wait, what?

Is this a "bisexuality doesn't exist" rant on the horizon?

Well no because I said "straight" too and I do think there are straight people!

I just thought it odd that he mentioned straight guys, so I was just pointing out that some gay guys apply the "straight" or "bi" labels to themselves falsely.

 

[blackbeltninja]

I actually don't agree with him in principle. Perhaps you should reread my posts.

Gimme a sec to go back a couple pages...

Okay. Um... in principle he doesn't really like the idea of dating a bi guy.

But... In principle, neither do you.

I understand why people don't like fat people, or older people, or body builders, but to me being attracted to women is just not as relatable and therefore it is a negative in my book.

I suppose another part of my discomfort with dating bisexuals stems from not having a lot of experience with them and also the fact that some gay guys usual bisexuality as a cover for their own instability and thus there is the image of the bisexual person as not as stable even though this is not the case for people that are truly bisexual.

That about right?

-d-

 

[altlover85]

Gimme a sec to go back a couple pages...

Okay. Um... in principle he doesn't really like the idea of dating a bi guy.

But... In principle, neither do you.



That about right?

-d-

Right, but what I mean is, I'm not saying bi guys are untrustworthy or that they could never have relationships with a gay man. I'm saying I would rather not date them because I don't like the idea of them being with women and I don't relate to them liking women. To me that's a big difference. I'm also saying I don't like all the complications with people that could ensue with bi guys due to issues of defining bisexuality. This has less to do with guys who I would consider bi and more to do with people who I don't think are bi, pretending to be, or people that aren't able to be with a man the way they are with a woman (can be sexual, but not emotional) who would also fall under the heading of being bisexual. It's too nebulous of a term for my tastes and complicates things too much.

 

[Purplebic]

I don't think anyone is telling anyone to ignore their personal experiences. They're saying not to base those experiences on a whole group of people. And I'm sure Bi-sexuals get their fair of shit flinged at them. As shown in this thread.

It's not insulting because they didn't choose to be attracted to both genders just like we didn't choose to be attracted to the same gender.

Well when you've suffered through those stories, and you know friends who have gone through the same thing, it becomes hard to ignore, and you reach a point where you are done experimenting with bi-guys because you know overwhelmingly what the results usually are. And yes, they get their fair share of shit, for whatever percentage they consider themselves to be gay, but if they get sick of that then they can always go for a more hetero-normative relationship, which is what all of us homos are tired of getting ditched for.

From what I've learned about bisexuality so far, it is very complex and can mean various things.

And im not the one who's gonna sit there trying to guess if what they want today is still what they'll want 3 months from now.

Some bi guys are emotionally attracted to one gender and sexually attracted to another.

That's called denial.

Some are equally attracted to both. Some are more attracted to one gender than the other. It's hard to put all of these people in one group, but we do it because society sees sexuality as binary because I think it's easier for most people to conceptualize that.

Maybe we should consult mathematicians before dating bi guys, just to make sure our chances are better than 49%.

 

[altlover85]

And yes, they get their fair share of shit, for whatever percentage they consider themselves to be gay, but if they get sick of that then they can always go for a more hetero-normative relationship, which is what all of us homos are tired of getting ditched for.

Except that some of them can't.

And im not the one who's gonna sit there trying to guess if what they want today is still what they'll want 3 months from now.

I can understand that.

That's called denial.

I would argue many straight close-minded people think gay people are not actually gay, but that they haven't tried hard enough with women and that at some point they will turn straight with the right woman. I don't see that as very much different than you decrying that someone is in denial simply because you say it is so.

Maybe we should consult mathematicians before dating bi guys, just to make sure our chances are better than 49%.

I'm not saying you should date bi guys. You don't have to. But I am saying that they aren't all the same.

 

[Purplebic]

^ Now, it's going to be your turn to be burnt at the stake, no matter how nice you are about the topic.

Im not trying to be nice im just being honest, if im going to be damned then i'll be damned for who i am.

Bottom line if theres one thing straight and gay people can agree on, its that their relationships have a common physical and emotional component. It's only bisexuals who manage to split emotion and attraction among the two genders and apply varying percentages to each. But for the rest of us it's not a numbers game, and its our hearts they're playing with.

 

[altlover85]

Im not trying to be nice im just being honest, if im going to be damned then i'll be damned for who i am.

Bottom line if theres one thing straight and gay people can agree on, its that their relationships have a common physical and emotional component. It's only bisexuals who manage to split emotion and attraction among the two genders and applying varying percentages to each. But for the rest of us it's not a numbers game, and its our hearts they're playing with.

I would say that there are bisexual people out there that aren't trying to "play with your heart".

 

[Purplebic]

if they get sick of that then they can always go for a more hetero-normative relationship, which is what all of us homos are tired of getting ditched for.

Except that some of them can't.

If they can't maintain a heterosexual relationship then what are they left with? the gay side? That would make them 100% homosexual wouldn't it?

That's called denial.

I would argue many straight close-minded people think gay people are not actually gay, but that they haven't tried hard enough with women and that at some point they will turn straight with the right woman. I don't see that as very much different than you decrying that someone is in denial simply because you say it is so.

No. You argued that some bisexuals are emotionally attracted to one gender, while being physically attracted to the other. But I dont believe in that kind of bisexuality. If you're truly bisexual you can love and fuck both genders. You cant claim to love one gender, and fuck the other. That makes no sense, if you love someone, it follows that you're physically attracted to them. And if you can fuck someone, emotional attachment may come of that too. Anything else is self-delusion.

 

[fetaby]

Bottom line if theres one thing straight and gay people can agree on, its that their relationships have a common physical and emotional component. It's only bisexuals who manage to split emotion and attraction among the two genders and apply varying percentages to each.

Yeah, cause every instance of physical intimacy is brought about by weeks or months of emotional bonding...

You seriously gonna try to pretend that hookups and booty calls don't happen between straight people or gay people on a regular basis?

 

[altlover85]

If they can't maintain a heterosexual relationship then what are they left with? the gay side? That would make them 100% homosexual wouldn't it?

If they have sex with women, but can't have a relationship with them, I would still consider that bi, but I could see how someone could consider that gay.

No. You argued that some bisexuals are emotionally attracted to one gender, while being physically attracted to the other. But I dont believe in that kind of bisexuality. If you're truly bisexual you can love and fuck both genders. You cant claim to love one gender, and fuck the other. That makes no sense, if you love someone, it follows that you're physically attracted to them. And if you can fuck someone, emotional attachment may come of that too. Anything else is self-delusion.

Just because you don't believe something doesn't mean you are correct. You have your own definition of bisexual that I don't feel is true. Any type of debate we have about this is going to be difficult because we won't see eye to eye on the definition of bisexuality.

You can love people without being sexually attracted to them. It's called platonic love. If you fuck someone, emotional attachment may follow, but doesn't necessarily.

I think what you would say is you are gay if you can have relationships with someone of the same gender and straight if you can have relationships with someone of the opposite gender and bisexual if you can do both.

 

[jasoncrew03]

Well when you've suffered through those stories, and you know friends who have gone through the same thing, it becomes hard to ignore, and you reach a point where you are done experimenting with bi-guys because you know overwhelmingly what the results usually are. And yes, they get their fair share of shit, for whatever percentage they consider themselves to be gay, but if they get sick of that then they can always go for a more hetero-normative relationship, which is what all of us homos are tired of getting ditched for.

Ok, so let me get this straight. You distrust us and dislike us because of the possibility of us leaving you for a woman, but then knowingly drive us to women with the shit you put us through? It seems you're trying to create a situation for the express purpose of being able to mock and hate us.

Originally Posted by altlover85
Some bi guys are emotionally attracted to one gender and sexually attracted to another.

That's called denial.

And you got your degree in human Sexology from where?

 

[bankside]

bankside, people don't usually change their minds overnight. It usually takes time. You aren't going to convince everyone. In matters of violence, I do agree with advocating against it.

You're right. They can have a week.

All of you need to stop debating this and just get naked and have sex, dammit!

For pete's sake...

I'm keen on that. Great plan Just one question first. Who is this Pete guy, and is he bisexual? ...and if so, has his actual penis been in a man-eating-ikky-nasti-poo-poo-ax-gash-snatch in say...the last 8 weeks....

 

[altlover85]

bankside, even though I don't always agree with you, you are funny.

 

[Purplebic]

You seriously gonna try to pretend that hookups and booty calls don't happen between straight people or gay people on a regular basis?

Of course not. I just dont believe in a bisexual concept where physical and emotional attraction can be mutually exclusive along gender lines. (Which usually translates to, date women, fuck men) which can further be reduced to "denial".

Just because you don't believe something doesn't mean you are correct. You have your own definition of bisexual that I don't feel is true. Any type of debate we have about this is going to be difficult because we won't see eye to eye on the definition of bisexuality.

I guess it goes to show you can never know for sure where you stand with bisexuals.

You can love people without being sexually attracted to them. It's called platonic love. If you fuck someone, emotional attachment may follow, but doesn't necessarily.

Platonic love is friendship. You cant seriously expect a relationship with someone by telling them "im emotionally attracted to your gender, but sexually attracted to the other". Who would accept that?

Ok, so let me get this straight. You distrust us and dislike us because of the possibility of us leaving you for a woman, but then knowingly drive us to women with the shit you put us through? It seems you're trying to create a situation for the express purpose of being able to mock and hate us.

I dont put you through jack since i don't date bisexuals. And it's not about being left for a women. Its about same-sex relationships being viewed as inferior to hetero relationships, (not true for all bi's, but most that ive met)

And you got your degree in human Sexology from where?

It doesn't take a degree to figure out that claiming to "love" one gender while wanting to fuck the other is a clear case of denial. Go read the Coming Out forums, there are plenty of such closet cases.

Ok, I get it.

It's ok to use stereotypes as excuses when you're not part of that group. Makes sense.

A stereotype is when you've never been there and done that, and have no fucking clue what you're talking about. Many of the people in this thread have been there and done that, and despite the number and similarity of the stories, you would still have us believe our experiences are just a minority of cases and the logical conclusions drawn from them are stereotypes. (Any statement that can be made about more than one person can be labelled a stereotype, having such a loose definition, im not surprised at the number of times the term has cropped up in this thread to dismiss people's experiences as inconsequential).

 

[Purplebic]

Purplebic I see you have no idea what a stereotype is

Maybe this will help some people out. Understand that this is just an example and not how I feel:

Every fem guy I've ever met is a bitchy whiney queen. There's no point dating any of them in my view.
Ive got a ton of friends and they agree. Every fem guy they have met is bitchy and annoying.

Therefore bc I've experienced this and bc my friends have experienced this it's alright to tell others that fems are bitchy whiny annoying queens.

I agree with you on that score. I usually have to ram my cock down their throats to get them to shut up other wise i can't fuck with a headache. I love my hairdressing friends but jesus christ they can't keep their mouths shut about anything, so i treat them like reporters and never reveal any sensitive information

 

[Purplebic]

Guys, I've had bad experiences with gays. I guess I should swear off gays now?

Thats your prerogative. God knows ive dashed many hopes and broken many hearts this year, 90% of men aren't worth the effort. Then again i dont date just anyone for the sake of being in a relationship.

 

[altlover85]

Of course not. I just dont believe in a bisexual concept where physical and emotional attraction can be mutually exclusive along gender lines. (Which usually translates to, date women, fuck men) which can further be reduced to "denial".

It's only denial if it's false.

Platonic love is friendship. You cant seriously expect a relationship with someone by telling them "im emotionally attracted to your gender, but sexually attracted to the other". Who would accept that?

I don't think people that think that way should be in relationships with anyone unless they can be emotionally and sexually attracted to either men, women, or both.

I dont put you through jack since i don't date bisexuals. And it's not about being left for a women. Its about same-sex relationships being viewed as inferior to hetero relationships, (not true for all bi's, but most that ive met)

You say it's not ture for all bisexuals, just the one's you've met. You can't take it father than that then.

It doesn't take a degree to figure out that claiming to "love" one gender while wanting to fuck the other is a clear case of denial. Go read the Coming Out forums, there are plenty of such closet cases.

I would think many of the people we are talking about have gone through the coming out process to get to where they are. There could be overlap. Again, I see no reason to believe you simply because you think you are correct.

A stereotype is when you've never been there and done that, and have no fucking clue what you're talking about. Many of the people in this thread have been there and done that, and despite the number and similarity of the stories, you would still have us believe our experiences are just a minority of cases and the logical conclusions drawn from them are stereotypes. (Any statement that can be made about more than one person can be labelled a stereotype, having such a loose definition, im not surprised at the number of times the term has cropped up in this thread to dismiss people's experiences as inconsequential).

I'm not dismissing your experiences or saying that they are a minority, I believe quite the opposite actually. However, I still think there are decent bi guys out there.