Senate GOP pledges to block all bills

[BostonPirate]

He makes a good point about how investors move their money around to avoid paying taxes. Similarly, I expect lots of people cash-in on investments (e.g. recognize capital gains) during periods immediately prior to an increase in tax rates. If rates were constant, investment capital might be more-so as well.

yes

the panel to balance the budget has suggested a radical move to get rid of ALL, and brother I mean all, tax deductions, and then lower all tax rates across the board. Its an interesting move and the only reason I can see for it is to stop people from engaging in the shell games the uber wealthy engage in to not pay taxes.

wall street journal... http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100...568643889337142.html?mod=WSJ_hp_LEFTopStories

Sacrosanct tax breaks, including deductions on mortgage interest, remain on the table just weeks before the deficit commission issues recommendations on policies to pare back with the aim of balancing the budget by 2015.

The tax benefits are hugely popular with the public but they have drawn the panel's focus, in part because the White House has said these and other breaks cost the government about $1 trillion a year.

I am hearing they are going farther than anyone expected... everything is on the chopping block. it's interesting that this would undo much of Obama's tax breaks for students etc... I assume this is a carrot for the republicans.

The move projects a huge windfall for the government in taxes from corporations and the wealthy. IT WONT HAPPEN...LOL.

Capital gains should be taxed much higher as well, IMO.

 

[Supersix]

Sowell is a sweet heart of the conservative political movement, but he is NOT considered an economic conservative, nor are his views considered mainstream OR correct.

Don't say anything about what he wrote, just imply that he's an unreliable source. I'd trust a doctorate of economics who has published numerous books, than the feelings of someone who refuses to consider the opposing viewpoint.

 

[Supersix]

Capital gains should be taxed much higher as well, IMO.

WHY??? Why punish anyone trying to earn money by investing? More regular people these days have money in the market, in stocks, mutual funds, buying and selling real estate, REITs, why should it be taxed higher? I don't think it should be taxed AT ALL. Otherwise, where is the incentive to invest, which provides money for companies to expand, and among other things, hire more people? Again, it's the entitlement mentality, I deserve what someone else earns because I feel I need the money more than they do! Class envy is so tiresome.

 

[BostonPirate]

Don't say anything about what he wrote, just imply that he's an unreliable source. I'd trust a doctorate of economics who has published numerous books, than the feelings of someone who refuses to consider the opposing viewpoint.

you are ignoring all the hundreds of people who have projected the opposite, cherry p[ick someone with an opinion that validates yours and then say that crap?

get real.

 

[BostonPirate]

Capital gains should be taxed much higher as well, IMO.

WHY??? Why punish anyone trying to earn money by investing? More regular people these days have money in the market, in stocks, mutual funds, buying and selling real estate, REITs, why should it be taxed higher? I don't think it should be taxed AT ALL. Otherwise, where is the incentive to invest, which provides money for companies to expand, and among other things, hire more people? Again, it's the entitlement mentality, I deserve what someone else earns because I feel I need the money more than they do! Class envy is so tiresome.

I do a heavy ammount of investing and it IS an income. My incentive to invest is to make money, and having a higher tax on it wont stop me.

Only the most greedy of the wealthy and the uneducated argue against capital gains taxation.

 

[Supersix]

That is not an answer. Who are these hundreds of people? Left wing news media staff? Politicians? Read what they say, then read what Sowell has written. I have. Try and argue with what he has written, instead of just knee-jerk rejection of it. In his columns are reason and factual information, not wishes, dreams, feelings, emotions, fantasies from the Communist Manifesto, distortions or spin. He speaks plainly.

 

[Supersix]

Only the most greedy of the wealthy and the uneducated argue against capital gains taxation.


Ah, NO, I'm not greedy, wealthy, or uneducated, and I hate seeing more and more taken from me by force by politicians who piss it away. Again, God Forbid people keep some of what they earn!! Noooooo, it has to be given to the ultraarrogant elite who know muuuuch better than I how to live.

 

[Supersix]

And if you want to pay more, you are at liberty to do so. They'll take it.

 

[BostonPirate]

That is not an answer. Who are these hundreds of people? Left wing news media staff? Politicians? Read what they say, then read what Sowell has written. I have. Try and argue with what he has written, instead of just knee-jerk rejection of it. In his columns are reason and factual information, not wishes, dreams, feelings, emotions, fantasies from the Communist Manifesto, distortions or spin. He speaks plainly.

I answered in the way your post deserved to be answered. Sowell does NOT rely on established formulae. He never really has. He is a dinosaur and considered silly within the ranks of many MANY economists. he is like the one scientist that still swears that global warming isn't happening... and then he's quoted over and over again by the republican movement that finds his positions useful.

http://chronicle.com/article/Skewering-Intellectuals/64113/

Sowell is more eager to skewer intellectuals than quibble over definitions. His position is straightforward. Intellectuals do not understand the genius of the market. They ignore empirical evidence. They are elitists. They operate with ideological blinders. Ultimately, they are "unaccountable to the external world." They judge ideas by how clever or complex they are, not whether they work. "But no one judged Vince Lombardi's ideas about how to play football" by their complexity or novelty, writes Sowell, but by "what happened when his ideas were put to the test on the football field." Mr. Sowell champions what might be called the Vince Lombardi Interpretation of Ideas, or VLII. Test ideas in the field.

VLII might be a tad simplistic. After all, Nazism "worked" and yielded a bustling economy, until it was militarily defeated. Would Sowell say all was well with Nazi ideas until 1945? The Soviet Union lasted many decades. Did Stalinism "work" until it did not?

Putting aside those bigger issues, Sowell slams Western intellectuals for their misconceptions about society. Activist judges, teenage pregnancy, gun control, city planning, the war in Vietnam, income distribution, and crime all get brief hearings. Everywhere intellectuals miss the boat. They do not understand the facts and their consequences. For instance, intellectuals agitate over the "widening income gap." While that gap exists—and has grown—intellectuals do not understand the difference between statistical categories and real people. Studies of income mobility show that individuals move between economic strata, Sowell claims.

thats just a taste of what his peers think of him.

you honestly dont know what you are talking about.

 

[CowboyBob]

Call their bluff.

They've filibustered everything in the past 4 years...... EVERYTHING!

This is nothing new. They're professional obstructionists and they're threatening to "start" filibustering things now....... c'mon.

HA!

It's an empty threat with this silly letter threatening filibustering. Republicans aren't in power and they can't dictate terms. They're drama queens.

 

[BostonPirate]

Call their bluff.

They've filibustered everything in the past 4 years...... EVERYTHING!

This is nothing new. They're professional obstructionists and they're threatening to "start" filibustering things now....... c'mon.

HA!

It's an empty threat with this silly letter threatening filibustering.

they should have been called to the floor to filibuster in person everytime.

But they were NOT.

and lets not forget.... all the millions of people that lost their unemployment benefits today... and for what? a political ploy to get the richest 2 percent of americans a larger tax break than the poor get.

sadly, the democrats are not as ruthless as the republicans.

 

[CowboyBob]

That's true. The Democrats need to give these Republicans a taste of their own medicine.

 

[Supersix]

I don't see anything wrong in that quote. You're still not answering anything Sowell wrote, just looking around google for criticism of him. Sooner or later, you'll find someone to disagree with anyone. Just look at us. That said, I don't agree with everything Sowell says, but about economics, he knows a hell of a lot more than you or I do, and his plain explanations make it very clear. If not, there'd be no market for his column, which is syndicated. And no one would publish his books, of which there are many. Dismissing him doesn't change what he has said, concluded from research, and taught for many years.

 

[BostonPirate]

Never mind that we (the US) have bills to pay.

Hell! Why don't we just get it over with, and let the rich keep all of their money!
Let the poor and middle class pay the taxes. They've had a free ride all these years anyway!

hey Johann.. long time no see!

I agree dead on.....

The wealthy have been ducking out and not paying taxes for a LONG LONG time. There are shelters and deductions for everything. When Carly Fiorino ran H-P she took farm subsidies for NOT growing vegetables on the front lawn of the business headquarters.

And the filth just rolls on and on... as the republicans filibuster for this lot, there are troops that need to be armed, unemployed that need unemployment payments, treaties that need to be passed...

all are less important than that tax break for the top 2 percent of america

 

[Supersix]

If you want to reduce incentives to help the economy, then by all means raise taxes. And, if you can't wait, feel free to give more to Uncle Sam at tax time. No one's stopping you.

 

[Supersix]

Don't forget John Kerry and his wife who are filthy rich, and I'd guess pay little because it's all invested in tax free municipal bonds. There are many rich democrats, too. Sam Donaldson, a while back, took a $1million subsidy for some farm of his, the greedy bastard. Al Gore is a slum lord, no one complains about him and all his enormous wealth, and that HE sho0uld pay more.

 

[BostonPirate]

The worst thing is that capital gains don't represent any real wealth being created, in terms of jobs, or goods and services. They're all on paper that is being transferred from person to person.

I think capital gains are badly undertaxed. I'd want to go for a 50% rate.

Remember: it was the pursuit of capital gains that got us into this mess in the first place. We overspeculated.

precisely

the ten percent of wealth that the american economy lost came primarily from the financial sectors and the housing market... and that was because there were exotic instruments being traded back and forth between banking institutions.

that sector will never recover because that was a correction of a bloated market, so until america learns to MAKE things again and sell things, we are doomed. There will be no new jobs until america learns to make its own products and get off the teat of chinese labor.

Taxation of capital gains stops people from putting the entire value of the american economy in a place that can devalue overnight.

 

[jackoroe]

hey Johann.. long time no see!

I agree dead on.....

The wealthy have been ducking out and not paying taxes for a LONG LONG time. There are shelters and deductions for everything. When Carly Fiorino ran H-P she took farm subsidies for NOT growing vegetables on the front lawn of the business headquarters.

And the filth just rolls on and on... as the republicans filibuster for this lot, there are troops that need to be armed, unemployed that need unemployment payments, treaties that need to be passed...

all are less important than that tax break for the top 2 percent of america

Gee whiz! That's not what the facts show.

The latest data show that a big portion of the federal income tax burden is shoul­dered by a small group of the very richest Americans. The wealthiest 1 percent of the population earn 19 per­cent of the income but pay 37 percent of the income tax. The top 10 percent pay 68 percent of the tab. Meanwhile, the bottom 50 percent—those below the median income level—now earn 13 percent of the income but pay just 3 percent of the taxes. These are proportions of the income tax alone and don’t include payroll taxes for Social Security and Medicare.

http://www.american.com/archive/2007/november-december-magazine-contents/guess-who-really-pays-the-taxes

 

[BostonPirate]

that would be before deductions...lol

that is not actual payed dollars, that is tax debt carried on the books before deductions and payment.
'
this is where the rubber hits the road.

is this worth holding up the entire government???

 

[jackoroe]

that would be before deductions...lol

that is not actual payed dollars, that is tax debt carried on the books before deductions and payment.
'
this is where the rubber hits the road.

is this worth holding up the entire government???

That isn't what the citation I've provided says. It says that the top 1% actually pays 37% of all the income taxes. Perhaps you have a citation that proves me wrong?