Should've the gorilla been shot?

[Kahaih]

Are we all still pretending to care.

And on we go.

I think there are still quite a few 'undecided's here.

We already know what Harambe looked like.

Do us a favor, and scour the Internet to see if you can come up with a computer generated picture predicting what the boy will look like 10 to 15 years from now, how big they expect his adult penis will be, and what the odds are as to him turning out a pillow-biter.

Thanks, love

 

[zoltanspawn]

One of the presumptions that's been repeated several times in this thread goes like, 'a human life was in danger, thus the animal had to be shot.' However, I wonder if those who accept this principle would take some time to flesh out the rationale? What, in more detail, makes a human life more valuable than an animal life?

Do you hold a kind of christian belief that animals don't have souls, and are therefore of less importance? Do you believe that animals are less valuable because they lack a destiny, or are more primitive? Are animals merely our resources? I'm speculating, and would rather hear a version of the greater importance of human lives in your own words.

I don't, of course, share that presupposition about humans. Just to try and answer the opposite question--why are humans not more valuable than animals?--here are a few thoughts...though this isn't what my question is about.

• I don't accept that humans are something other than animals in the first place. So, starting there, I wouldn't accept by definition that one kind of animal is more valuable than any another kind. (Why isn't abundant mercy, abundant compassion and a profound sense of justice inclusive of other animals, rather than exclusive of non-human animals?)
• Some animals (and other non-animal species) are harmful to complex ecosystems. Insofar as we are weeds, which diminish a rich variety of life, we lose value. (I value complex ecosystems.)
• We also lose value in comparison to other species, like Bonobos, which have a greater capacity for altruism. We are a violent species by nature, capable of peace and self-sacrifice, but failing miserably. (I value altruism.)
• Another way in which we lose value is merely by economic principles. As a commodity, like beetles, we are abundant. Rhinoceroses, by comparison, are incredibly scarce. Scarce resources are worth more, and common resources are cheaper.

Those are just a couple of ideas that support my position.

But what makes human life more important than animal life?

 

[EddMarkStarr]

I agree with you zoltanspawn. The Cincinnati Zoo officials acted in haste for fear of the repercussions if the child was accidentally injured or killed. I'm convinced that everyone involved saw Harambe's life as equally valuable but time pressure led to a horrible course of action. An now the zoo is catching hell from around the world.

 

[pat grimshaw]

Do American Christians still believe that animals don't have souls?

The Christian churches I hear about in England and at home are somersaulting over each to change their beliefs because they know they're dying off and diminishing each decade.

 

[Cormac135]

I think there are still quite a few 'undecided's here.

We already know what Harambe looked like.

Do us a favor, and scour the Internet to see if you can come up with a computer generated picture predicting what the boy will look like 10 to 15 years from now, how big they expect his adult penis will be, and what the odds are as to him turning out a pillow-biter.

Thanks, love

As you can see the incident could leave it's mark on him.

Pretty ideal fuck all round tbaft.

 

[Alnitak]

Long ago humans became an invasive species. There are over 7 billion of us roaming the planet, today, and everyday our top priorities are food, shelter, and waste disposal.

Aren't you one of JUB's most vocal organ and tissue donation champions? If you want to save the world, you'll have to cut that out. You'll have to stop trying to save everyone.

I agree that we have reached some sort of Malthsian catastrophe. I'm not planning on ha I got kids though.

 

[MorrisseyX]

The parents of the child are disgusting I heard they want to sue to zoo despite being at fault. The Gorilla is a creature that did not deserve to die. There should of been a way to save the Gorilla life. The parents of the child should be charged. Couldn't they have used powerful tranquilizers like a double dosage or something?

 

[MorrisseyX]

Yeah, close the zoos and let the poachers win.

"Treating him as one of his own" endangered the life of the boy: humans are not as tough as gorillas. What would be perfectly safe for a gorilla child could kill a human child.

Hello there are sanctuaries for animals which are not zoos and in the wild. I believe in some African nations and Indonesia they have sanctuaries.

 

[eddielee]

I hope to go to the NC zoo in Asheboro sometimes in the next few months. I enjoy it. I promise not to climb over any fences or cross any moats. I am not anti-zoo, although I think we should take a close look at what animals they keep, and insure that all of the animals are well cared for. Still, I do not see the modern Zoo as a bad thing, and I think it will continue to exist long into the future.

 

[mikey3000]

They absolutely should have shot the gorilla. This child was being jerked around and was in water. He could have sustained a head injury or been drowned...in less than one minute.

And I find it funny that so many of you who have never had children are the experts in how a parent should raise and protect her children. Now that gay marriage is legal, get out there and have children and see what it is like. See how great you are when you are trying to manage multiple children in a zoo...or at a water park...or at the mall.

It is okay to say you don't like people or children, and that you prefer animals (or plants) over human children...just fucking come out and say it. Who do you think you are fooling?

Quoted for absolute truth! When all else fails, blame us "breeders" for everything under the sun. So typical of the gays.

 

[Kahaih]

One of the presumptions that's been repeated several times in this thread goes like, 'a human life was in danger, thus the animal had to be shot.' However, I wonder if those who accept this principle would take some time to flesh out the rationale? What, in more detail, makes a human life more valuable than an animal life?

. . .

But what makes human life more important than animal life?

Zoos are set up to be inviting to the public – its clientele. Usually this means setting up displays to view the creatures as close as possible with as few/little visual obstructions as possible. All the while making sure that the patrons feel safe. The public (humans) will always come first.

That aside, most mammals do everything they can to protect their young/offspring from harm including harm from other species. That is not just/only a 'human instinct', nor is it just/only a 'motherly instinct'. Surely you've witnessed other animals protecting their own.

 

[zoltanspawn]

....most mammals do everything they can to protect their young/offspring from harm including harm from other species. That is not just/only a 'human instinct', nor is it just/only a 'motherly instinct'. Surely you've witnessed other animals protecting their own.

Yes, it makes sense that to some extent it's instinctual to value one's own species over another. I agree we have protective feelings that make us think humans are more important.

Thanks for the reply, and curious about other responses.

 

[sixthson]

Quoted for absolute truth! When all else fails, blame us "breeders" for everything under the sun. So typical of the gays.

Well, I'm not a breeder like you guys, so I guess I can't have an opinion about children. So far we know nothing about the child and his family, so what more is there for anyone to say.

 

[MakeDigitalLove]

They absolutely should have shot the gorilla. This child was being jerked around and was in water. He could have sustained a head injury or been drowned...in less than one minute.

And I find it funny that so many of you who have never had children are the experts in how a parent should raise and protect her children. Now that gay marriage is legal, get out there and have children and see what it is like. See how great you are when you are trying to manage multiple children in a zoo...or at a water park...or at the mall.

It is okay to say you don't like people or children, and that you prefer animals (or plants) over human children...just fucking come out and say it. Who do you think you are fooling?

I missed this snarky little post but I will address this here. No one said Parenting was easy, but at the same time one doesn't need to be a Parent to understand that you should be keeping an eye on your kid in a crowded place such as a Zoo. I worked in retail enough to see plenty of times where Parents just let their kid roam the store without supervision, running around, knocking things off shelves, yelling and screaming. I guess I need to be a Parent to understand this struggle of just letting your kid do this in public.

One doesn't need to be a Parent to know that there are unavoidable situations with kids and situations where you really should be on top of your child in public places, especially in a crowded place. Your child could easily get lost in places like this or worse. If you have multiple kids, have trouble keeping an eye all of them and then take them to places like this, then I question your Parenthood. Get more Parents/Guardians/Friends to come in this situation.

There was a reason why when in school we took school trips and the Teachers asked for a few extra Parents to come along on the trip. It was to help keep an eye on multiple children.

Quoted for absolute truth! When all else fails, blame us "breeders" for everything under the sun. So typical of the gays.

There are times where I question why you are here considering you tend take the opportunity here to talk down gay people time and time again. If you believe this simpleton notion that people are completely blaming "breeders", then you need to do a better job at reading peoples post.

 

[gsdx]

Wild animals are unpredictable, but so are people. People do stupid things all the time. Sometimes the stupid things they do result in their deaths. They know better, but they do them anyway. Children are even more unpredictable. The stupid things they do are 'adventures'. They go where they shouldn't. They do things they shouldn't. That is part of growing up and discovering their world. Some learn from their adventures. Some don't. I don't know what the boy did which caused him to fall into the exhibit, but it's my guess that he will never do it again.

 

[mikey3000]

I missed this snarky little post but I will address this here. No one said Parenting was easy, but at the same time one doesn't need to be a Parent to understand that you should be keeping an eye on your kid in a crowded place such as a Zoo. I worked in retail enough to see plenty of times where Parents just let their kid roam the store without supervision, running around, knocking things off shelves, yelling and screaming. I guess I need to be a Parent to understand this struggle of just letting your kid do this in public.

One doesn't need to be a Parent to know that there are unavoidable situations with kids and situations where you really should be on top of your child in public places, especially in a crowded place. Your child could easily get lost in places like this or worse. If you have multiple kids, have trouble keeping an eye all of them and then take them to places like this, then I question your Parenthood. Get more Parents/Guardians/Friends to come in this situation.

There was a reason why when in school we took school trips and the Teachers asked for a few extra Parents to come along on the trip. It was to help keep an eye on multiple children.


There are times where I question why you are here considering you tend take the opportunity here to talk down gay people time and time again. If you believe this simpleton notion that people are completely blaming "breeders", then you need to do a better job at reading peoples post.

Oh really?...

Shoot the mother..save the gorilla...

PERFECTLY STATED! ITA...except I also blame the mother.....

Dan, I think this is an opportunity for you to re-think the position of your adversaries on the issue of human reproduction.

I know your love for your kids makes it heartfelt.

But those of us who you might think of as "children haters" mostly don't hate children.

As anti-natalists, we think it's preferable not to come into existence.

As child-free, we enjoy the pleasures of a life without dependents.

As environmentalists, we recognize that the single most damaging act a human can do is make more of us.

It's a cartoon, a stereotype, a bias, to render us all as "children haters."

I think you would be pleasantly surprised to see me, e.g., interact with kids. Like most of us, we don't object to kids, but to breeding.

And these are just from the first page. Ya know, if humans are that dangerous to Earth's existence, then please, feel free to not partake in any man's contributions, or better yet, get off the planet. Dude, you are a perfect example of, "a little education is a dangerous thing.

 

[MakeDigitalLove]

2 of those people out of the 3 are not completely blaming the Mother. Which was my point. Again, maybe you should read more posts instead of cherry picking to try and prove your point.

You started this thread and all you seem to be doing is trashing some of the replies that you don't like and again, taking the opportunity to talk down gay people. How about you take your own advice, if gay people are so terrible how about not coming to a dominately gay message board?

 

[NotHardUp1]

The presumption that human life is worth saving over animal life is a given. If the equality of all life is a tenet, then by all means give way to the roaches that would overtake you and your larder.

If it only recognizes animals, mammals, primates, or whatever, then there really isn't room to talk about selective preferences, is there?

There seems to be a need to blame or accuse or somehow resolve the death of the gorilla by impugning the zoo or the parents. As gsdx already stated, accidents happen. Fatal accidents happen. The idea that this tragedy was much more than a freak occurrence is fallacious.

 

[eddielee]

NotHardUp1, again, as always you have made a very good point. Human life will ( I hope ) always be valued over animal life in such situations. There is no hidden agenda, bad parenting, or a bad zoo. An accident happened and the zoo resolved it in the best manner they knew how. End of story.

 

[eastofeden]

And these are just from the first page. Ya know, if humans are that dangerous to Earth's existence, then please, feel free to not partake in any man's contributions, or better yet, get off the planet. Dude, you are a perfect example of, "a little education is a dangerous thing.

I stand by everything I said...period.

If you don't like it.....I am kinda happy about that....