Survivor 21: Nicaragua

[TaggedGalaxy]

But Na'onka hasn't made quite as many moves as Russell did and Na'onka never said she was a mastermind either.

The main difference between Na Onka and Russell is that Russell was edited as an underdog on both of his seasons, which is one of the reasons why the general public was rooting for him.

 

[Sgt Pepper]

The main difference between Na Onka and Russell is that Russell was edited as an underdog on both of his seasons, which is one of the reasons why the general public was rooting for him.

I know that's what the producers intended but I so did NOT look at Russell and see "underdog." Though admittedly dealing with him requires a vaccine and a liver treat.

 

[slipintothefog]

I don't know what the hell the producers wanted with Russell. At the start and end he was some OTTNN supervillain who sabotaged his own tribe and talked down to Natalie and Mick for being useless, but in the middle he was supposed to be an "underdog" against the Galus.

That sloppy storytelling is why Samoa just didn't work for me. They hid Natalie completely when she was supposed to be the hero of the season, and Russell's edit pulled double duty in a contradictory role as a villainous underdog. And there wasn't any gray area complexity in it; he went from one extreme to the total opposite and then back again.

 

[Aratron]

About Sash's reaction, don't forget the producers can pretty much do everything so it could have been edited

 

[Ekim23]

THat was ridiculous !!

Alina, Jeff, Naonka, Kelly, Benry pschh that was supposed to be the best episode of this season, well not for me !

I guess I think fabio is going to win this !


Sandra is and will be the best winner for me too

 

[slipintothefog]

Holly winning would be the best outcome in my eyes, so that probably means she'll go out just before FTC like all of my other favorites (Teresa, Kathy, Helen, Cirie, Cirie again, Crystal, Taj, Jerri, BB Amy, Nakomis, Janelle, Dr. Will and Janelle again, BB Michele, BB Britney... yeah, the track record of my Survivor/BB favorites other than Sandra and Jun isn't so good).

I'm sorry that I've cursed you from winning, Queen Hoho.

 

[joesman]

Holly winning would be the best outcome in my eyes, so that probably means she'll go out just before FTC like all of my other favorites (Teresa, Kathy, Helen, Cirie, Cirie again, Crystal, Taj, Jerri, BB Amy, Nakomis, Janelle, Dr. Will and Janelle again, BB Michele, BB Britney... yeah, the track record of my Survivor/BB favorites other than Sandra and Jun isn't so good).

I'm sorry that I've cursed you from winning, Queen Hoho.

You have a few of my favs in your list but some I really hated. I loved Cirie and loved Sandra winning. But I hated Jerri, Nakomis and Jun. Didn't Dr. Will win his initial season.

Who doesn't love Janelle? Is the Michelle you mentioned the one who had the hots for Jessie? If so I loved her too and envied her. I remember Amy and I liked her a lot.

Rarely do the people I like win BB or Survivor ever win. I so wanted Colby to win one of the seasons he was on. BB has a long line of winners I was not greatly fond of, save Dan.

On a more personal note, are you the one who did those videos of Marcus Patrick? Now that is a man. First saw him in a Vista Video vid a few years back and loved his bod and eventually his face when one could get past that big bulge always coming at you.

 

[altlover85]

joesman, Dr. Will won his first season, but lost on All-Stars. I definitely disliked Jun, but TBH I didn't watch that season as closely as others and missed quite a few episodes. I'm not feeling the Nakomis love either.

 

[Sgt Pepper]

Holly winning would be the best outcome in my eyes, so that probably means she'll go out just before FTC like all of my other favorites (Teresa, Kathy, Helen, Cirie, Cirie again, Crystal, Taj, Jerri, BB Amy, Nakomis, Janelle, Dr. Will and Janelle again, BB Michele, BB Britney... yeah, the track record of my Survivor/BB favorites other than Sandra and Jun isn't so good).

You and I are clearly the same person. Has anyone ever seen us in the same place at the same time?

 

[slipintothefog]

joesman: the Michele I was talking about was BB11 Michele Noonan, a.k.a. Neurodork a.k.a. Lab Lady/Velma in the BB11 thread on this forum.

And no, I didn't make any videos... I don't even know who you're talking about, sorry!

---


RazorzEdge, most of BB3 cast was seriously amazing to me back then. They were all such colorful and interesting personalities, so I would have been happy with just about anybody in the final six winning. Still, Amy was my personal favorite, so I included her in my list, though Danielle was entertainment gold too.

---

Pepper: great minds think alike?

---

In Survivor characters I tend to value a blend of complexity, personality and entertainment. Not all of my favorites have all three. (Jerri, for example, didn't have any complexity in her original season, but she did have personality and provided entertainment. When I rewatched Australia last year, I realized how much I HATED the show after they voted Jerri out. It was SO BORING without her to provide conflict because the other people on her tribe hated her with the passion of a thousand fiery suns.)

I saw all three of those factors in Holly within the first two episodes, and that's why she quickly became my favorite. I was drawn to her because she's fit for an older woman as a swim coach and she usually expresses her thoughts candidly in confessionals, which is something any great Survivor character needs to do. She is FULL of personality with her crazy facial expressions and motherly ways, and she provided laffoz with her sinking Dan's shoes and being on the verge of breaking down and quitting in episode two.

But if she continued on her episode two psycho edit for her entire stay like Na'onka did, I probably would gotten over her at some point. By complexity, I mean that the character isn't stuck in one mode that never changes. For example, I'm a bit tired of Jane at this point because the editing is bending over backwards to make her look like some amazing super woman who is incredible at everything she does.

But Holly hasn't been one note like Jane or Na'onka. After her early insanity, she laid back for awhile as an underdog until she emerged as a power player at the merge, and her story arc came full circle with her talking Dan out of quitting and TRYING to talk Na and Kelly out of it too. She was credited as the driving force behind getting Brenda out, and she succeeded despite her earlier failures such as making an alliance with Wendy and then immediately breaking it. That's the kind of storytelling and natural character development that I love to see from Survivor.

However, Kathy V-O from Marquesas was exactly like Holly from an editing standpoint: crazy annoying older woman in the first couple of episodes who gradually morphs into a complex power player at the merge and dominates the game. And that's why I've always been afraid that Holly's edit was going to be a redemption edit rather than a winner edit, as Kathy ended up in third place too. And that sucks because I think Holly is one of the best characters Survivor has had in awhile.

 

[falconfan]

You and I are clearly the same person. Has anyone ever seen us in the same place at the same time?

Crazy talk. No one would be psychotic enough to have in depth conversations with themselves on online forums.

 

[joesman]

Slip,
Your avatar resembles B Scott who is in several marcus Patrick vids - see link. Sorry for the mis identity

http://www.justusboys.com/forum/showthread.php?t=212921&highlight=Marcus+Patrick&page=5http://www.justusboys.com/forum/showthread.php?t=212921&highlight=Marcus+Patrick&page=5

 

[slipintothefog]

Joesman, my avatar is Sandra flipping Russell the bird from Heroes vs. Villains... lol! Sorry about that.

 

[joesman]

Joesman, my avatar is Sandra flipping Russell the bird from Heroes vs. Villains... lol! Sorry about that.

Sorry Slip, I didn't mean to be persistent and I didn't recognize the avatar as Sandra, but now that I look closely I can see that. However she does look like the person I meant. I apologize.

 

[slipintothefog]

No problems!

So if they made Survivor 24 another All-Stars season, in the tradition of Seasons 8 and 16 having returning people, which players from Nicaragua would you guys like to see come back for it, if any?

I ask because Nicaragua's biggest character was clearly Na'onka, but they don't ask back quitters. Personally, I could see them asking back Jane, Hoho, probably Fabio and maybe even Brenda and Marty again.

 

[altlover85]

No problems!

So if they made Survivor 24 another All-Stars season, in the tradition of Seasons 8 and 16 having returning people, which players from Nicaragua would you guys like to see come back for it, if any?

I ask because Nicaragua's biggest character was clearly Na'onka, but they don't ask back quitters. Personally, I could see them asking back Jane, Hoho, probably Fabio and maybe even Brenda and Marty again.

You named everyone I could think of them asking. Perhaps Sash, depending on how well he does in the next few weeks. Fabio to a lesser extent as well.

 

[joesman]

I can see them bring back Brenda, no Sash, Marty, Jud, definitely Jane and Holly.

 

[slipintothefog]

Not only that, but I DESPISED Tina and Colby. They were such hypocritical shits.

Apparently, Jerri was the worst person in the world for criticizing the way people cooked rice , but it was okay for them to say really hideously demeaning things about Keith on national television after they voted him out.

Oh, I know. I stopped watching Australia between Jeff and Rodger's boots, so I always assumed Jerri got really, really evil during my hiatus and that's why American was celebrating that the "Wicked Witch was dead" ... then I rewatched the season all the way last year and her worst moment was accusing Kel of having beef jerky, which was something I saw but didn't even think much about in 2001!

It amazes me that people still intensely hate Jerri. As a villainess, she is such a pussycat compared to some of the legitimately vile people Survivor and BB have had over the years. At worst she was a bit immature and annoying, but that was really only ten years ago. Jerri's story arc across her three seasons is kind of amazing, really. In Australia her self-righteous tribemates hated her so much that they prevented a Pagonging just to eliminate her. Then in ASS she tried to act nice to redeem her Australia edit and it completely blew up in her face with her being booed off the stage at the reunion. Six years later she comes back more mature, plays really well and gets voted out at F4 for being too big of a jury threat.

Oh, it would have been so awesome if she won that last immunity challenge. It would have been close between her and Sandra, but I think Jerri might have won. Sandra is forever my queen but Jerri winning Heroes vs. Villains for being viewed as a hero compared to Russell, Parvati and/or Sandra would have been one of those things that you just can't make up.

That's one of the reasons she's one of my top faves now, along with Boston Rob. The two of them have changed so much across their three seasons, and again, I like to see stuff like that!

As for Holly, I think you have some good points. True that she doesn't have the charisma of Kathy, but Kathy was amazing, so I can't knock Holly for not being as incredible as one of my favorite Survivors ever!

 

[Ohiospeedo]

Awww...my boytoy Benry is gone. I really wanted to punch out Sash tonight, he was just so smug and annoying. "What are you going to do for me? Are you going to take me to the Final 2 or 3?"

I am surprised more wasn't said at tribal council about the quitters. I still think that it is bullshit that they are on the jury.

 

[Sgt Pepper]

Initially I thought he was kind of creepy, but damn I'm not immune to an underdog narrative: I am rooting for Sash so hard now (Chase is my #2).