The World without the US on Climate Change

[Kulindahr]

Oh, and for the record:

http://insider.foxnews.com/2017/06/...reen-fund-america-paid-billion-united-nations

The U.S. isn't even in the top ten donors to that, per taxpayer.

And donating is good economics; it's effectively a subsidy for poorer countries to be able to buy equipment from the U.S. and its allies. In other words, Trump just cost American jobs.

 

[rareboy]

Perhaps one of the most egregious lies that Trump trumpeted in his rose garden speech was that the US “will continue to be the cleanest and most environmentally friendly country on Earth”

Oops. the facts don't lie.

Data shows that the U.S. is among the dirtiest countries when it comes to heat-trapping carbon pollution. One nation that has cleaner air in nearly every way is Sweden.

“The U.S. is well behind other countries in having the cleanest and most sustainable environment,” University of Michigan environmental scientist Rosina Bierbaum said in an email.

http://globalnews.ca/news/3500144/donald-trump-climate-change-facts/

 

[rareboy]

The U.S. isn't even in the top ten donors to that, per taxpayer.

And donating is good economics; it's effectively a subsidy for poorer countries to be able to buy equipment from the U.S. and its allies. In other words, Trump just cost American jobs.

A lot of people just don't get this. They think that the US just cuts a cheque to Somefuckistan.

But the aid is actually spent almost dollar for dollar in contracts to US manufacturers and suppliers.

It is like much of US aid that goes directly the military industrial complex.

As you say. It just cost some Americans jobs.

 

[Benvolio]

Greater purity can only come at the cost of freedom I.e., the result of more and more, ever increasing regulation. Does any one doubt that Sweden has more regulation and higher taxes than the US? Totalitarianism will come soon enough, but we can delay it awhile.

 

[rareboy]

Sweden = Totalitarianism?

 

[mikey3000]

The U.S. isn't even in the top ten donors to that, per taxpayer.

And donating is good economics; it's effectively a subsidy for poorer countries to be able to buy equipment from the U.S. and its allies. In other words, Trump just cost American jobs.

Look harder. The article says pledged monies. How many countries actually did contribute to the Paris Green fund?

 

[Stardreamer]

We are no longer “global warming” but are now “climate changing”.

“Global Warming” only works if the planet is actually warming while “Climate Change” conveniently covers all situations.

So if it rains too much, or snows too much, or is too hot, or is too cold, or is not cold enough, or is not hot enough, or doesn’t rain enough, or it doesn’t snow, it is all down to climate change.
*
And not only “Climate Change” but “Man Made Climate Change”. So all of this catastrophe is caused by us so it is only fair that we are forced to pay for it in some way.

All clear now? Good. Do try to keep up.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-...ing-agenda-really-about-destroying-capitalism

Actually, its both; the planet is slowly warming which is driving changes in climate, climate change. Heat is the engine that drives climate, variations in temperature cause the winds to blow and storms to form, heat causes the oceans to evaporate to feed the storms.

The problems are the more heat the more 'active' the climate which as folks in tornado alley can tell you can be a bad thing. Global warming is still a valid term for what is happening but people have a hard time understanding that warming causes record snow storms so yes they shifted the focus to climate as its less confusing.

The change is simple enough to understand when you are trying to educate people but that doesn't stop idiots with agendas from trying to make some kind of nonsense conspiracy theory out of it.

 

[rareboy]

102 cities and 6 states have rejected Trump's rejection.

Mayor Bill de Blasio
New York City, NY

Mayor Eric Garcetti
City of Los Angeles, CA

Mayor Martin J Walsh
City of Boston, MA

Mayor Sylvester Turner
City of Houston, TX

Mayor Betsy Hodges
City of Minneapolis, MN

Mayor Madeline Rogero
City of Knoxville, TN

Mayor Rahm Emanuel
City of Chicago, IL

Mayor Ed Murray
City of Seattle, WA

Mayor Jim Kenney
City of Philadelphia, PA

Mayor Kasim Reed
City of Atlanta, GA

Mayor Lioneld Jordan
City of Fayetteville, AR

Mayor Kathy Sheehan
City of Albany, NY

Mayor Christopher Taylor
City of Ann Arbor, MI

Mayor Van W Johnson
City of Apalachicola, FL

Mayor Susan Ornelas
City of Arcata, CA

Mayor Esther Manheimer
City of Asheville, NC

Mayor Steve Skadron
City of Aspen, CO

Mayor Steve Adler
City of Austin, TX

Mayor Jesse Arreguin
City of Berkeley, CA

Mayor John Hamilton
City of Bloomington, IN

Mayor Suzanne Jones
City of Boulder, CO

Mayor Miro Weinberger
City of Burlington, VT

Mayor Pam Hemminger
City of Chapel Hill, NC

Mayor Jennifer Roberts
City of Charlotte, NC

Mayor Mary Casillas Salas
City of Chula Vista, CA

Mayor Stephen K Benjamin
City of Columbia, SC

Mayor Jeffrey Cooper
Culver City, CA

Mayor Michael Hancock
City of Denver, CO

Mayor Josh Maxwell
City of Downingtown, PA

Mayor Roy D Buol
City of Dubuque, IA

Mayor William V Bell
City of Durham, NC

Mayor David Kaptain
City of Elgin, IL

Mayor Lucy Vinis
City of Eugene, OR

Mayor Karen Freeman-Wilson
City of Gary, IN

Mayor Steven M Fulop
Jersey City, NJ

Mayor Sly James
Kansas City, MO

Mayor Adam Paul
City of Lakewood, CO

Mayor Mark Stodola
City of Little Rock, AR

Mayor Robert Garcia
City of Long Beach, CA

Mayor Dennis Coombs
City of Longmont, CO

Mayor Philip Levine
City of Miami Beach, FL

Mayor Tom Barrett
City of Milwaukee, WI

Mayor Mark Gamba
City of Milwaukie, OR

Mayor Jon Mitchell
City of New Bedford, MA

Mayor Mitch Landrieu
City of New Orleans, LA

Mayor Libby Schaaf
City of Oakland, CA

Mayor Buddy Dyer
City of Orlando, FL

Mayor Greg Scharff
City of Palo Alto, CA

Mayor Jack Thomas
Park City, UT

Mayor Greg Stanton
City of Phoenix, AZ

Mayor William Peduto
City of Pittsburgh, PA

Mayor Ted Wheeler
City of Portland, OR

Mayor Jorge O Elorza
City of Providence, RI

Mayor Hillary Schieve
City of Reno, NV

Mayor Darrell Steinberg
City of Sacramento, CA

Mayor Christopher Coleman
City of Saint Paul, MN

Mayor Jackie Biskupski
Salt Lake City, UT

Mayor Ed Lee
City of San Francisco, CA

Mayor Sam Liccardo
City of San Jose, CA

Mayor Pauline Russo Cutter
City of San Leandro, CA

Mayor Helene Schneider
City of Santa Barbara, CA

Mayor Javier M Gonzales
City of Santa Fe, NM

Mayor Ted Winterer
City of Santa Monica, CA

Mayor Joe Curtatone
City of Somerville, MA

Mayor Scott A Saunders
City of Smithville, TX

Mayor Rick Kriseman
City of St Petersburg, FL

Mayor Stephanie A Miner
City of Syracuse, NY

Mayor Kate Stewart
City of Takoma Park, MD

Mayor Andrew Gillum
City of Tallahassee, FL

Mayor Jim Carruthers
Traverse City, MI

Mayor Jonathan Rothschild
City of Tucson, AZ

Mayor Muriel Bowser
City of Washington, D.C.

Mayor Oscar Rios
City of Watsonville, CA

Mayor Jeri Muoio
City of West Palm Beach, FL

 

[Benvolio]

Sweden = Totalitarianism?

Not yet but far more regulated and taxed than the US.

 

[Benvolio]

102 cities and 6 states have rejected Trump's rejection.

Mayor Bill de Blasio
New York City, NY

Mayor Eric Garcetti
City of Los Angeles, CA

Mayor Martin J Walsh
City of Boston, MA

Mayor Sylvester Turner
City of Houston, TX

Mayor Betsy Hodges
City of Minneapolis, MN

Mayor Madeline Rogero
City of Knoxville, TN

Mayor Rahm Emanuel
City of Chicago, IL

Mayor Ed Murray
City of Seattle, WA

Mayor Jim Kenney
City of Philadelphia, PA

Mayor Kasim Reed
City of Atlanta, GA

Mayor Lioneld Jordan
City of Fayetteville, AR

Mayor Kathy Sheehan
City of Albany, NY

Mayor Christopher Taylor
City of Ann Arbor, MI

Mayor Van W Johnson
City of Apalachicola, FL

Mayor Susan Ornelas
City of Arcata, CA

Mayor Esther Manheimer
City of Asheville, NC

Mayor Steve Skadron
City of Aspen, CO

Mayor Steve Adler
City of Austin, TX

Mayor Jesse Arreguin
City of Berkeley, CA

Mayor John Hamilton
City of Bloomington, IN

Mayor Suzanne Jones
City of Boulder, CO

Mayor Miro Weinberger
City of Burlington, VT

Mayor Pam Hemminger
City of Chapel Hill, NC

Mayor Jennifer Roberts
City of Charlotte, NC

Mayor Mary Casillas Salas
City of Chula Vista, CA

Mayor Stephen K Benjamin
City of Columbia, SC

Mayor Jeffrey Cooper
Culver City, CA

Mayor Michael Hancock
City of Denver, CO

Mayor Josh Maxwell
City of Downingtown, PA

Mayor Roy D Buol
City of Dubuque, IA

Mayor William V Bell
City of Durham, NC

Mayor David Kaptain
City of Elgin, IL

Mayor Lucy Vinis
City of Eugene, OR

Mayor Karen Freeman-Wilson
City of Gary, IN

Mayor Steven M Fulop
Jersey City, NJ

Mayor Sly James
Kansas City, MO

Mayor Adam Paul
City of Lakewood, CO

Mayor Mark Stodola
City of Little Rock, AR

Mayor Robert Garcia
City of Long Beach, CA

Mayor Dennis Coombs
City of Longmont, CO

Mayor Philip Levine
City of Miami Beach, FL

Mayor Tom Barrett
City of Milwaukee, WI

Mayor Mark Gamba
City of Milwaukie, OR

Mayor Jon Mitchell
City of New Bedford, MA

Mayor Mitch Landrieu
City of New Orleans, LA

Mayor Libby Schaaf
City of Oakland, CA

Mayor Buddy Dyer
City of Orlando, FL

Mayor Greg Scharff
City of Palo Alto, CA

Mayor Jack Thomas
Park City, UT

Mayor Greg Stanton
City of Phoenix, AZ

Mayor William Peduto
City of Pittsburgh, PA

Mayor Ted Wheeler
City of Portland, OR

Mayor Jorge O Elorza
City of Providence, RI

Mayor Hillary Schieve
City of Reno, NV

Mayor Darrell Steinberg
City of Sacramento, CA

Mayor Christopher Coleman
City of Saint Paul, MN

Mayor Jackie Biskupski
Salt Lake City, UT

Mayor Ed Lee
City of San Francisco, CA

Mayor Sam Liccardo
City of San Jose, CA

Mayor Pauline Russo Cutter
City of San Leandro, CA

Mayor Helene Schneider
City of Santa Barbara, CA

Mayor Javier M Gonzales
City of Santa Fe, NM

Mayor Ted Winterer
City of Santa Monica, CA

Mayor Joe Curtatone
City of Somerville, MA

Mayor Scott A Saunders
City of Smithville, TX

Mayor Rick Kriseman
City of St Petersburg, FL

Mayor Stephanie A Miner
City of Syracuse, NY

Mayor Kate Stewart
City of Takoma Park, MD

Mayor Andrew Gillum
City of Tallahassee, FL

Mayor Jim Carruthers
Traverse City, MI

Mayor Jonathan Rothschild
City of Tucson, AZ

Mayor Muriel Bowser
City of Washington, D.C.

Mayor Oscar Rios
City of Watsonville, CA

Mayor Jeri Muoio
City of West Palm Beach, FL

What, if anything does it mean on the local level? Can a mayor force people or businesses to conserve? What can he coerce anyone to do? If he tries, how long will he last? Or a governor?

 

[Vitamin]

What, if anything does it mean on the local level? Can a mayor force people or businesses to conserve? What can he coerce anyone to do? If he tries, how long will he last? Or a governor?

You seem to be stuck on the idea that Paris actually forced anyone to do anything.

 

[luckynumbah7]

102 cities and 6 states have rejected Trump's rejection.

Not surprising Philly is on there, we already have a decent recycling program. Could be better with the damnable teenagers in their own neighborhoods with the junk food wrappers but on the whole it's pretty good in most spots. I particularly enjoy the recyclable bins on the streets in the main thoroughfairs.

We could use more buses but that's a long argument with Septa right there.

 

[rareboy]

What, if anything does it mean on the local level? Can a mayor force people or businesses to conserve? What can he coerce anyone to do? If he tries, how long will he last? Or a governor?

Apparently you have no concept of City Planning policies that can have an incredibly profound impact on energy use. I'm not going to even bother listing them because it is all wasted on you.

And you seem to also have no clue that mayors aren't dictators. They are at the head of councils elected by the residents of their cities and the citizens of cities want livable, environmentally sound cities...because it is quite literally where they live.

In fact, the good news in all of this is that communities and states actually do have a huge amount of power that they can and do exert on this...and as long as the citizens elect councillors, mayors and representatives who are committed to environmental responsibility, citizens can ignore the Koch Bros. and their lap dog Trump.

Get educated for a change and stop seeing everything through the narrow lens you have selected.

 

[Benvolio]

Apparently you have no concept of City Planning policies that can have an incredibly profound impact on energy use. I'm not going to even bother listing them because it is all wasted on you.

And you seem to also have no clue that mayors aren't dictators. They are at the head of councils elected by the residents of their cities and the citizens of cities want livable, environmentally sound cities...because it is quite literally where they live.

In fact, the good news in all of this is that communities and states actually do have a huge amount of power that they can and do exert on this...and as long as the citizens elect councillors, mayors and representatives who are committed to environmental responsibility, citizens can ignore the Koch Bros. and their lap dog Trump.

Get educated for a change and stop seeing everything through the narrow lens you have selected.

No, it is because all those mayors are not dictators that their announcements don't mean much. The councils, taxpayers and consumers are not as eager to submit to more laws and taxes as you think. Nothing all those mayors do will have one iota's effect on the emissions issue.

 

[Kulindahr]

Greater purity can only come at the cost of freedom I.e., the result of more and more, ever increasing regulation. Does any one doubt that Sweden has more regulation and higher taxes than the US? Totalitarianism will come soon enough, but we can delay it awhile.

The way to delay it is to buckle down and fight global warming now while it isn't causing famines and plagues and wars. Once the real effects start to hit, governments will either turn authoritarian or fall.

 

[Kulindahr]

Look harder. The article says pledged monies. How many countries actually did contribute to the Paris Green fund?

I read the article, then I looked up reality.

And if you don't know the answer to your question here, you shouldn't have made your claim in the first place. As the poster on the study room wall back in college said, engage brain BEFORE opening mouth -- or in your case, typing.

 

[Kulindahr]

No, it is because all those mayors are not dictators that their announcements don't mean much. The councils, taxpayers and consumers are not as eager to submit to more laws and taxes as you think. Nothing all those mayors do will have one iota's effect on the emissions issue.

Odd, then, that the voters in California seem to have no problem submitting to the things you despise... and that California is driving the nation's economy.



BTW, odds are those mayors wouldn't have spoken up if their councils weren't with them. After all, most challenges to sitting mayors at election time come from city council members.

 

[rareboy]

No, it is because all those mayors are not dictators that their announcements don't mean much. The councils, taxpayers and consumers are not as eager to submit to more laws and taxes as you think. Nothing all those mayors do will have one iota's effect on the emissions issue.

They already do control all of this. Many cities have made huge gains in this area. With the full support of the citizens and taxpayers. You just have no clue.

 

[Benvolio]

They already do control all of this. Many cities have made huge gains in this area. With the full support of the citizens and taxpayers. You just have no clue.

Any evidence of effect on emissions?

 

[rareboy]

Duh. Yes.

But vehicle emissions are only one part of it. Reducing overall energy consumption through planning and building code requirements, sourcing clean energy to run the city, establishing and enforcing pollution controls have turned the filthy cities of America in the 70's into the cleaner more livable cities of today.

Smart cities are not going to go backward and create filthy and unhealthy inner cities...particularly when the rich and the middle class have learned to like blue skies and clean air.

You question though, betrays your utter lack of intellectual curiousity and knowledge about the topic.

For you, it is purely ideological...something that only communist hippies are interested in.

What a shame.