The World without the US on Climate Change

[Benvolio]

^Yep. Also the house is on fire! Please continue to argue over the arson. I'm going to save the children because they don't care who did what. I'm going to do what I can. You know, for the children.

e climate
No. If there is no man made change, we cannot cure even it by sacrificing our freedoms and democracy.

 

[gsdx]

If there is no man made change, we cannot cure even it by sacrificing our freedoms and democracy.

Where is your proof that there is no man-made change? We have ample proof that there is, but simple denial is not proof.

 

[Kulindahr]

Interesting little video. The Weather Channel vs. CNN on global warming...

He's seriously out of touch. At universities all over, students are given raw data and allowed t make their own judgments, and almost invariably they see the pattern that human activities are warming the globe.

Frak, we did it as a problem in physics: totally ignore greenhouse gases, and calculate the extra heat humans pump into the atmosphere and the warming from changing the albedo by cutting forests and paving millions of acres, and that alone is enough to show that humans are significantly warming the planet!

Every computer has a cooling fan, every refrigerator and other appliance generates heat, every automobile churns out heat from its engines and lights and brakes... the ways mankind pumps heat into the atmosphere are myriad and immense. To deny that humans are warming the planet is to pretend we're still in the iron age.

 

[Kulindahr]

e climate
No. If there is no man made change, we cannot cure even it by sacrificing our freedoms and democracy.

You're warming the planet, I'm warming the planet, as we read and type messages.

The only way there could be no man-made change is if we turned off all our machines, every last little bit of technology, and planted forests to restore the condition of the planet to what it was three thousand years ago.

 

[mikey3000]

Hmmm. Who to believe. One man or thousands of scientists around the world or decades of rising temperatures and increasing CO2 levels or more powerful and deadly storms every year?

Hmmm.

Did you say scientists around the world? Oh, you said thousands of scientists around the world. Good. About time you see the truth.

 

[Benvolio]

He's seriously out of touch. At universities all over, students are given raw data and allowed t make their own judgments, and almost invariably they see the pattern that human activities are warming the globe.

Frak, we did it as a problem in physics: totally ignore greenhouse gases, and calculate the extra heat humans pump into the atmosphere and the warming from changing the albedo by cutting forests and paving millions of acres, and that alone is enough to show that humans are significantly warming the planet!

Every computer has a cooling fan, every refrigerator and other appliance generates heat, every automobile churns out heat from its engines and lights and brakes... the ways mankind pumps heat into the atmosphere are myriad and immense. To deny that humans are warming the planet is to pretend we're still in the iron age.

Remind me of that next February and I will ask you what happened to all that heat. The heat you are talking about is insignificant compared with the seasonal cold each year. CO2 is a separate problem, and a question there is the extent tampering with the evidence by the liberals has distorted the picture. http://www.foxnews.com/science/2017...bama-presentation-whistle-blower-charges.html

 

[rareboy]

So an organization "We are Still In It" has coalesced around the resistance to Trump's rejection of the Paris Accord.

A coalition of US economic, education, and local government leaders announced on Monday they will continue to abide by the Paris agreement regardless of America's withdrawal, forming the We Are Still In movement. The coalition represents 120 million Americans and $6.2 trillion of the US economy.

It is expected that more cities, states and companies will sign on.

How humiliating for Trump, to have the people lead such a strong movement against him.

http://www.businessinsider.com/we-a...nt-2017-6?mc_cid=8cb464a501&mc_eid=1e957cdc8b

 

[Benvolio]

So an organization "We are Still In It" has coalesced around the resistance to Trump's rejection of the Paris Accord.



It is expected that more cities, states and companies will sign on.

How humiliating for Trump, to have the people lead such a strong movement against him.

http://www.businessinsider.com/we-a...nt-2017-6?mc_cid=8cb464a501&mc_eid=1e957cdc8b

No. It is far better for any measures be taken on a voluntary basis than to allow this to become a basis for massive laws, regulations and bureaucratic dictates.
Republicans are pro-business and free enterprise. From the beginning they have instinctively resisted the global warming ideology because it is a tool of the anti-capitalist forces.

 

[eastofeden]

No. It is far better for any measures be taken on a voluntary basis than to allow this to become a basis for massive laws, regulations and bureaucratic dictates.
Republicans are pro-business and free enterprise. From the beginning they have instinctively resisted the global warming ideology because it is a tool of the anti-capitalist forces.

In other words...Republicans are led by greed and a lack of conscience.... and regulations and responsibility for the environment that we ALL share cut into their profits.

 

[gsdx]

Did you say scientists around the world? Oh, you said thousands of scientists around the world. Good. About time you see the truth.

And, of course, you go for the mockery and attack without providing ANY evidence to your argument whatsoever.

Denials and nonsensical petitions are NOT proof.

 

[Benvolio]

In other words...Republicans are led by greed and a lack of conscience.... and regulations and responsibility for the environment that we ALL share cut into their profits.

[Text: Removed]
Capitalism/free enterprise has done more to benefit mankind than all other other factors, by far. Without it we would all be living disparate lives of poverty in one room hovels. Trump's solution is a great compromise: allow the environmental protections to remain in private hands while avoiding the totalitarianism implicit in the environmental movement.

 

[eastofeden]

[Text: Removed]
Capitalism/free enterprise has done more to benefit mankind than all other other factors, by far. Without it we would all be living disparate lives of poverty in one room hovels. Trump's solution is a great compromise: allow the environmental protections to remain in private hands while avoiding the totalitarianism implicit in the environmental movement.

It wasn't Trump's solution.

It was the solution of the entities and individuals who have a conscience.

 

[opinterph]

From the beginning [Republicans] have instinctively resisted the global warming ideology

Instinct ignores reason.

 

[mikey3000]

And, of course, you go for the mockery and attack without providing ANY evidence to your argument whatsoever.

Denials and nonsensical petitions are NOT proof.

It is when they come from renowned global scientists with PhD. [Text: Removed]

 

[opinterph]

California:

Odd, then, that the voters in California seem to have no problem submitting to the things you despise... and that California is driving the nation's economy.

Transportation is the largest source of CO[SUB]2[/SUB] emissions in California. Fuel usage increases with population growth, lower fuel prices, and a higher employment rate.

Meanwhile, emissions from electricity generation in California continue to decrease, due to the rapid growth of solar facilities.

California’s greenhouse gas emissions fall by less than 1% (SF Gate; June 9, 2017)​

United States:

Carbon dioxide (CO2) emissions from electricity generation totaled 1,925 million metric tons in 2015, the lowest since 1993 and 21% below their 2005 level. A shift on the electricity generation mix, with generation from natural gas and renewables displacing coal-fired power, drove the reductions in emissions.

Carbon dioxide emissions from electricity generation in 2015 were lowest since 1993 (US Energy Information Administration; May 2016)

In 2016, emissions of carbon dioxide (CO2) by the U.S. electric power sector were 1,821 million metric tons, or about 35% of the total U.S. energy-related CO2 emissions of 5,171 million metric tons.

How much of U.S. carbon dioxide emissions are associated with electricity generation? (US Energy Information Administration; percentage of total based upon preliminary data for 2016)

Worldwide:

Emissions from electricity and heat production account for about half of all CO[SUB]2[/SUB] emissions worldwide. (The World Bank)

 

[Benvolio]

Instinct ignores reason.

Free enterprise needs freedom. You can't have the golden eggs if you kill the goose.

 

[opinterph]

Free enterprise needs freedom. You can't have the golden eggs if you kill the goose.

And in this case our planet Earth is the goose.

 

[rareboy]

mic drop

 

[Benvolio]

And in this case our planet Earth is the goose.

Fanaticism is not the solution. Your failure to recognize the importance of economic freedom presages disaster.

 

[Kulindahr]

Remind me of that next February and I will ask you what happened to all that heat. The heat you are talking about is insignificant compared with the seasonal cold each year. CO2 is a separate problem, and a question there is the extent tampering with the evidence by the liberals has distorted the picture. http://www.foxnews.com/science/2017...bama-presentation-whistle-blower-charges.html

F on understanding weather. "Seasonal cold" is not relevant to the heat produced by human beings and added to the planet, because it does not and cannot have any effect on the total.

The waste heat alone produced by all human technology in the U.S. is the equivalent of a three trillion watt heater running day in, day out. That isn't "insignificant" by any means, it's heat the planet didn't have before, and essentially none of it gets radiated back to space.