those straight-acting gay guys ...

[theblackajah]

I'm so straight-acting that when I poke a guy in the brown eye, I say "Wow, that feels just like a really tight vagina!"

 

[Soilwork]

OMG... this fuckin debate again???


Fine... take out "acting".......

Call us dudes "straight-gay guys"........

And flamers can be "gay-gay guys"

Is that PC enuff for everyone??

no. Actually, it's not.

Sorry, but I think you're being a wank. Why can't you just be gay? Why do you have to make sure that we all know that you're a big man and not like those "flamers?"

do you think we're impressed?

Do you think we care?

 

[DavieDukes]

no. Actually, it's not.

Sorry, but I think you're being a wank. Why can't you just be gay? Why do you have to make sure that we all know that you're a big man and not like those "flamers?"

do you think we're impressed?

Do you think we care?

Dude, I do believe if you're gay, you're gay.

I'm gay.

But when describing one's lifestyle and personality... there's a big difference between "stereotypical gay guys" and "straight-acting guys"......

But you gotta understand... "acting" for guys like me... doesn't mean were "pretending" ... this is who I am...

Other than liking dick, I can't think of one thing I have in common with the "gay stereotype".... so I consider myself straight acting, and for good reason: My experince in life is different than if I "gayed it up" and faced what the stereotypical gay guy faces in an average day....

So, labels are important.... But I believe to each his own and I'm very proud of the life I lead and my personality that goes with it... I aint acting, just living.... I just happen to be living the straight lifestyle, not the gay one....

 

[Jacobson]

no. Actually, it's not.

Sorry, but I think you're being a wank. Why can't you just be gay? Why do you have to make sure that we all know that you're a big man and not like those "flamers?"

do you think we're impressed?

Do you think we care?

Exactly! The only reason this whole "Straight acting" is used as means to describe one's self is only to state that they are somehow sitting on a higher level than someone who may be 'obviously' gay. Kinda like the metrosexual phenomenon. Metrosexuals can act as effeminate as they please and they are praised for it because at the end of the day that metrosexual is still nailing chicks. BUT... if a gay man acts like a metrosexual then he's a flamming queer that everyone should ostricize.

There's a double standard played in what is and isn't allowed from gays as opposed to straights.

 

[Soilwork]

I just happen to be living the straight lifestyle, not the gay one....

And I just happen to think you're a wank.

There *IS* no "gay lifestyle." don't you get it?

I'm gay too... people are often quite surprised that I'm gay. There's nothing straight about me at all.

I dont' expect someone who still lists their orientation as "curious" to get it, but if you're gay.. you're gay.

All this shit about how "I don't act like other gay guys" is just that - shit.

Gay guys don't act like ANYTHING.. most gay people are just regular people. There is no way that gay people are supposed to act, be or think. There's nothing that most gay people do.

The "gay lifestyle" is an invention of the people who wanna keep us down.. the ones who want to divide us.

Look.. I'm a biker. I listen to metal. I smoke cigars. I like baseball. Some people might think these things sound "straight" but they don't... They make me a guy. Just a guy.

Trying to separate yourself from "the flamers" just plays right into the hands of the people who dont' want us to have any power. They want us to figth amongst ourselves and divide us.

I'm not telling you that you have to have any flamer friends... I don't have many and I've got a LOT of friends (you can never have too many of those), but what I AM telling you is that nobody lives the "Gay lifestyle." It doesn't exist.

 

[Soilwork]

And I'll say again.. I've met a lot of gay men who called themselves "straight acting" and I've never met one who wasn't delusional.

The guys I've met that I wouldn't guess are gay never make a big issue about it.

Which kinda underscores my point that men who call themselves "straight acting" are really just trying to prove something to themselves.

 

[DavieDukes]

I dunno why yer gettin so angry about this....

I never said ALL gay people acted the same way.... but I still believe there are general differences between the lifestyle straight dudes choose and that of gays...

I just happen to share more in common with that straight lifestyle... I never said one was better than the other... in fact I said, to each his own....

which seems to be a problem for you....... but according to you, I'm "delusional" -- so why even bother....

 

[Soilwork]

I still believe there are general differences between the lifestyle straight dudes choose and that of gays...

And I say you're wrong.

In fact, I know you are.

Because a good deal of my friends are straight guys, and we tend to do a lot of the same stuff. And most of my gay friends too, because I tend to choose friends from common interests, not sexual orientation.

I just happen to share more in common with that straight lifestyle... I never said one was better than the other...

Except there IS no gay or straight lifestyle.

Tell me.. what are the things that those flamer gay men do that you don't? What is involved in this "straight lifestyle" that you lead?

Let me get a beer.

This should be interesting.

 

[Soilwork]

Richard Simmons doesn't give a shit about what others think. Is he cool?

Richard is a riot. Yes, he's quite cool. Funny as hell.

If he shoved his girly, little mantwat in your face, would you hit it?

Fuck no. But what does being cool have to do with being attractive?

Liking pussy is really the only prerequisite for being straight or bi. So the only true straight-acting gay guy is one who eats & fucks pussy and pretends to like it.

yup.

 

[Trolli]

Soilwork, I think you're forgetting that labels are very important. It's human nature. I mean, they're bad, but they have their purpose. If I were going to introduce to you my boyfriend and I told you he was Russian (or something) you would already have all of these ideas about him. We do this because it helps us.

Most people think: Gay = Madonna liking, teen pop, well dressed, coffee houses, groomed, won't touch sports, etc.

"Straight-acting" simply means that you don't 'fit' into the label that society has given gay males. As wrong as it may be.

I dislike some of the gay community because of this as well. I can be gay, be proud about it, but I dont' have to be flamboyant and tell the world about it. It's exactly these people that make a show about being gay that further this 'femme' stereotype that gay males have.
It goes hand in hand with the double standard of lesbians being 'hot' but gay guys being gross. Additionally, not even straight guys like the 'butch' lesbians.

I'm sure you deal with this a lot. When I let some people know I was gay (people have since forgotten me) they said, "BUT YOU DON'T ACT GAY!" It's because I like sports, I like to be gritty and etc.
Anyway, yes, there are closet cases that want to be 'straight' more than anything and refuse to accept themselves. And then there are us that don't like to be associated with the flamboyant broadcasting of our sexuality. I understand straight guys do it a lot ("THAT BITCH IS HOT!") but two wrongs don't make a right.

I hope my rant was coherent.

 

[Soilwork]

most people think gay=Madonna?

OK.. so instead of buying into that, why not just change their minds?

I mean, black men who aren't in gangs don't say "I'm white-acting" do they?

(do they? I sure hope not)

 

[Trolli]

Well.. actually... some do, sort of.
Those that are labeled "white-wash".
See? We're not the only group that faces something like this.
Do you think that there is division between the 'white-wash' and the 'gangstas'?
(I think I get your point too. I don't define myself as "straight acting" but the label "gay" does not bring the appropriate connotations to who I am, either.)

Oh, and Madonna is a huge, HUGE gay icon. Of course people associate queens with MADONNA! Come on now.

Anyway, I just think that those gays who do make a show of being gay are harming us more than helping. They have a hyper defensive stance. I'm also aware that not everyone would do this, but if anyone says anything too 'gay bashing' I simply physically harm them. Nothing more shameful than having your ass handed to you by some "faggot".

I just feel that my sexuality does not define me. A lot of gay men seem to have this stance. I like men, and that's it. It has no definitions of me as a person. I don't feel I have to wear certain underwear (2xIst), I don't feel I have to act certain ways, etc. Gay men make those lines in the sand. By letting our sexuality be our definition, we give them arsenal and weapons against us. If we act different it's BECAUSE we are different.

 

[Soilwork]

Yeah, right. Cool has nothing to do with being attractive? Yes, it does. Just admit it. Not only is Richard Simmons a fugly dweeb, but his screaming queen persona makes your dick go limp to the max. What about that blonde queen from "Queer Eye"? Would you tap that?

No, I wouldn't shag either one, and I woudln't shag my cloestest female friends, either, but I still think they're cool.

I also wouldn't fuck my brother, and he's one of the coolest guys I know. I've never met Carson Creevy and I never watched that show, but he's a friend of a friend of mine, and apparently, he's a blast to party with.

Sorry, but I dont' choose friends based on how hot or not they are.

Why can't you admit that you worship masculinity and butchhood like most other gay guys do?

Um.. because I don't? What ever gave you the impresssion that I "worship butchhood?"

Maybe the fact that I'm totally comfortable with being gay means I'm not so freaked out that I coudln't party with Bruce Vilance (and I have) or Stone Cold Steve Austin (dont' that too) and have just as much fun both times.

 

[Soilwork]

Oh, and Madonna is a huge, HUGE gay icon. Of course people associate queens with MADONNA! Come on now.

Yes. Queens maybe, but al gay men? Or are you one of those guys who thinks all gay men are "queens?"

Anyway, I just think that those gays who do make a show of being gay are harming us more than helping.

That's because they're the only ones with the balls to come out, it seems.

I mean, you can't whine about how "everyone thinks that gays are all queens into Madonna" when you're too chickenshit to prove them wrong. can you?

 

[Trolli]

Yes. Queens maybe, but al gay men? Or are you one of those guys who thinks all gay men are "queens?"



That's because they're the only ones with the balls to come out, it seems.

I mean, you can't whine about how "everyone thinks that gays are all queens into Madonna" when you're too chickenshit to prove them wrong. can you?

No, no. I just think that it's impossible for you to understand two things:
1. Society has labels. Everyone falls under one. Can't fight, can't help it.
2. I merely stated that, as a whole, the gay 'label' brings connotations that do not fit (such as me liking Madonna).

If you can't chat in a civilized manner, without personal attacks, I don't see how you are any better.
Additionally, those that are 'proving them wrong' are proving them 'right' with their
purses, perfume, 'style', makeup, dressing in drag, and all of that rubbish. I'll say I'm attracted to men, not femme shit. If I wanted a pussy I'd find a woman.
Now, I'm quite through chatting with you, unless you can speak to me like an adult (which we both are).

 

[Jacobson]

No, no. I just think that it's impossible for you to understand two things:
1. Society has labels. Everyone falls under one. Can't fight, can't help it.
2. I merely stated that, as a whole, the gay 'label' brings connotations that do not fit (such as me liking Madonna).

If you can't chat in a civilized manner, without personal attacks, I don't see how you are any better.
Additionally, those that are 'proving them wrong' are proving them 'right' with their
purses, perfume, 'style', makeup, dressing in drag, and all of that rubbish. I'll say I'm attracted to men, not femme shit. If I wanted a pussy I'd find a woman.
Now, I'm quite through chatting with you, unless you can speak to me like an adult (which we both are).

The roots of homophobia really lie in mysoginy and you're post is extremly mysoginistic. Basically you're saying that in order for a gay person to be accepted he should be butch. There was someone else here who has also been saying that effeminate gays give gay men as a whole a bad rep. Well why should gay men who are effeninate have to cater to heterosexist sensitivity?

And yeah the term Whitewashed is a pretty offensive term and I doubt any minoroty would take on such a term with triumphant jest. Who monopolized that to act 'civilized' as opposed to 'gangsta' was immediatly a white thing? That is actually even more offensive and racist. In the same way that to shun a person because they are effeminate is actually more mysoginistic.

A 'straight acting' queer is basically saying that there is a definition to being gay. I wonder if Plato was effeminate? I wonder if all mighty Zeus was effeminate. There was no terminology to describe him as 'straight acting' by Homer or Hesoid. I bring up the ancient world because homosexuality is not a brand new phenomena as current media would like us all to believe. It's been part of the HUMAN experience forever. The thing is, that with the rise of patriarchal institutions which showed disdain for the feminine homosexuality became a dirty thing which had to be prosecuted. In ancient times actually effemancy was a celebration of Goddess worship. Certainly to the Goddess Cybele of ancient Greece men would dress as women and perform her rites. It was a sacred act.
Also in many cultures like India and the First Nations peoples crossdressers and tranvestites had shanan status. And holy status. In come Patriarchal faiths and in their climb for ultimate power for the definition of what it means to have a dick new laws of morality were created by MAN.

I listen to Madonna. I hang out in coffeeshops and read the poetry of Emily Dickenson. If you saw me sitting there in my tank top and ripped jeans you wouldn't think anything of me. Come to think of it, if you saw a metrosexual you would think nothing of him. Because even though David Beckham uses nail polish and wears serongs it's alright since everyone knows that he reproduced with a spice girl. So there's no threat to his masculinity. But if David Beckham were a gay male, and out about it, then the tables would turn. He would no longer be sexy would he? But as long as David Beckham is nailing some chick there's an appeal that can be sold because his seed is sacred because it's 'straight'.

The term 'straight acting' is actually one of the most disrespectful things that gay men do to themselves. It's actually a very degrading thing, because it validates straight men as being holy.
And why should one be shamed of themselves for assimilating the feminine? Because it's not powerful? Because it's dirty? Because it's hysterical or sinful? A loud and about glitter queer has bigger balls than a 'straight acting' homosexual because at least he can walk amongst people being true to himself and brave a world that will beat him up and shun him. Even by his own people. 'Straight Acting' gays.

 

[DavieDukes]

Jacobson, if you actually read what I wrote. You'd see that I'm NOT "acting" or "pretending" - this is who I am. I also believe that there's general character traits shared amoungst gay people versus straight people - and I think most people agree on that - and thankfully, most people do not see one being morally superior to the other. I also live by these words: as long as no one gets hurt, to each his own.

But holy fuck dude. The gay community as whole is trying to make society less judgemental. But it seems to me, a shitload of gay people themselves can't even practice what they preach.

 

[Trolli]

I needed a good belly laugh, although i'm sick and - you guessed it - the pain is RIGHT in my stomach.



So if i like white guys at all, i'm a snow queen.

If i like metal music and not current rap, i'm white-acting.

And if i don't dress, talk, and act like a hard ass probably-done-time thug, i'm white-washed.

Now I got it now!

I'm too tired to rip you apart. I'm going to bed.

MY! You are quick on the defensive.
You're blaming me for all of society's views? Only because I point them out?
By the way, "snow queen" is a label reserved for women who are 'mean'.
No, you would not be a snow queen.
Additionally, I never said some black people call themselves "white-wash" but some are labeled AS white-wash. Are you going to argue with this?

You're all becoming upset because stereotypes exist and I'm merely pointing them out. We all use them (yes, even you!). Additionally, stereotypes are there because they are MOSTLY (and you'll never guess it) TRUE! A lot of gay guys DO have limp wrists, a lot of Asians DO like rice, and etc. Is that saying that all of them do? Of course not.

Additionally, I don't understand why gay = feminine. I thought being gay was about liking men, not men that act like women? Please clear this up for me if I'm wrong.

Any other complaints? Is the pointing out of facts from society that terrible? Please, "rip me apart" simply because I am stating the reality we live in.
There is no way you will get around stereotypes and this is what it all boils down to.
Some gay men don't want to be associated with the flaming, parading, flamboyant queens. It's not our thing. If you can't respect that, then surely the problem lies with you.
Just because I'm gay it does not put me in the same league as you showboats that LOVE nothing more than broadcasting and boasting about the fact that you are gay.

Grow up.

Or perhaps I should join your ranks:
"I'm so gay I'm hyper sensitive (and defensive) and I will stomp my little high heels and snip snap at you if you upset me! *flips hair with 'tude*".

It's not about 'straight' men being holy, it's about not acting like a deviant because you have to PROVE to everyone that you are comfortable with being gay. I'm quite comfortable with it, and I don't wear rainbows and stomp around screaming "I'm GAY!" at the top of my lungs.

Also, Jy, I love how you added nothing to the conversation other than your emotional baggage.
Let me be the first to say: I don't give a flying @#$^ about how you feel or if I've offended you.

 

[DavieDukes]

Some gay men don't want to be associated with the flaming, parading, flamboyant queens.

I sure as fuck dont.



Not that theres anything wrong with that....

Just not my cup of tea.

 

[Trolli]

I sure as fuck dont.



Not that theres anything wrong with that....

Just not my cup of tea.

Exactly. Even in a minority there are differences.
I guess we should conform though, because we don't act like women.
I'm going in for my mani/pedi combo tomorrow, right after my facial.
I'll then go to Express Men and sip lattes, so I can fit in with my 'brothers'.