Attention Where did the Mesa cop shooting thread go?

[NotHardUp1]

You remind me so, so much of another jubber who has the habit of deleting only to come back again, just to stir that pot a little.

The victim may have been 26, but anyone could see he was so terrified of getting conflicting orders shouted at him he was in tears.
In my opinion this was a brutal murder, carried out by an excited cop. It was plain that the man presented no threat at all.

Just throwing this in here, why did the cop not Tazer him instead?

Tragically, the paramilitary mentality of some of these teams seems to preclude all mid-range measures.

The options seem to be all at the extreme ends of the scale. The arrest can either be completely peaceful with no means of mitigation or containment used, or deadly force.

There are myriad methods of intervention containment possible, from sonic methods, to stun guns, to sticky goo, to nets, to bullet-proof shields, and so forth. Yet, despite the cop witnessing no threatening actions or behaviors or attitudes, he declared the situation to be constantly escalating. Every single physical motion was interpreted as a legally defensible basis for using deadly force, not merely containing or appropriate force. And sadly, his fallacy is indeed the law's fallacy, and therefore, his slaughter of the innocent became sanctioned by the State, a deadly error and one that will ultimately result in change. The Citizenry will not forever accept the abuses of the State. This is not Russia.

 

[Telstra]

I have never posted any beheading video.
Do the post history search if you want.

I remember the Jordanian pilot burning alive thread ... but cannot remember the details.

 

[MakeDigitalLove]

I want to add to the topic of Police Brutality that I never thought "Resisting Arrest" was a good excuse as to why Police Officers get excessive. In this point in time I cannot actually blame anyone for actually resisting arrest when lives are actually on the line and you don't know what's going to happen if one does unfortunately encounter an aggressive Officer.

 

[KaraBulut]

Well then I hope someone will post a link to an external site with the video, because frankly, this video did not advocate violence at all. Rather, it is evidence that this cop was 100% at fault and I dare say he'd be in jail if this had happened in a European country.

It's not difficult to find reporting about the story and the verdict:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/mesa-p...er-seen-crawling-begging-in-disturbing-video/

The video that was actually posted was a Young Turks editorial video that featured a portion of the Mesa video. The title of the 12 minute video should give one an idea of their bias, "Cop Murders Man Begging For His Life (GRAPHIC VIDEO)".

 

[peeonme]

I want to add to the topic of Police Brutality that I never thought "Resisting Arrest" was a good excuse as to why Police Officers get excessive. In this point in time I cannot actually blame anyone for actually resisting arrest when lives are actually on the line and you don't know what's going to happen if one does unfortunately encounter an aggressive Officer.

Many times people are resisting assault, not arrest. It is a normal, responsive action to stiffen your body or pull away from pain. Cops know this and can use arrest methods that will induce a a person to resist thereby escalating the situation and the charges brought against the suspect.

 

[Zeno Lorea]

Many times people are resisting assault, not arrest.

Those are the words I was looking for.

 

[NotHardUp1]

And, in fairness to the cops, many MORE times those resisting arrest are drunk, already involved in violence and have a history of violence, and are complete scofflaws.

Police brutality is real, but the conditions that lead to it developing are also real. Cops who go bad often do so after many, many events in which the dregs of society do disgusting and gratuitous actions, and do them to police as well as other citizens.

The officers in the video were wrong, but it is just as wrong to purport that most cops behave that way. Statistics prove that police brutality is indeed the exception in the U.S., not the rule.

Resisting arrest is a sure way to endanger yourself needlessly. It is the sole reason why the killing cop in the video was wrong. At no time was there any indication of actual threat by the victim. If he had either verbally or physically suggested animus or threat, then the handling of the arrest might have been justified.

If you want to sacrifice your life by attacking a fully armed policeman, that seems a poor way to seek reform, and nothing short of suicidal, regardless of race.

 

[peeonme]

If you want to sacrifice your life by attacking a fully armed policeman, that seems a poor way to seek reform, and nothing short of suicidal, regardless of race.

I have witnessed the button pushing that leads to an escalation of a situation. Many times it begins with verbal abuse.
I would never suggest that one attack a police officer, but, it is against human nature to ignore pain. If you are on the ground and have a few hundred pounds of cop on your back it's hard to breath. Then the cop starts yelling "quit resisting" as you squirm to take a breath.
That is not to say that all cops do this, but in the scenarios where an unarmed, out numbered citizen get the hell beat out of him by 2 or 3 cops and they claim that he "resisted" I would question just exactly what he was resisting.

 

[sixthson]

It's a known fact that even in righteous killings, either by cops or someone in self defense or during war, the person who pulls the trigger suffers emotionally and psychologically because they took a life. It doesn't matter that they had no choice. The person that worries me is the person with no conscience about it. After a shooting, cops are required to see mental health professionals. Hopefully, part of that is to help the cop and the other part is to root out psychos.
I have cops in my family, so I know there are good cops in the world.
Two of the most effective tools for subduing suspects are tazers and canine cops. The should be the first line of defense, but that is just the opinion of a citizen. Cops, like soldiers, are trained to shoot to kill.
I'm glad the video was removed. Even though the title said murder, I assumed wrongly that it would be edited before we would see the actual death.

 

[HoodedRat]

I saw that video elsewhere. It was very sad and deeply disturbing.

Are American cops so trigger-happy because they expect everyone else to be armed to the teeth?

I expect the UK will end up like that too once arming cops becomes routine here due to the terrorist threats.

 

[KaraBulut]

Are American cops so trigger-happy because they expect everyone else to be armed to the teeth

In urban areas, yes. Law enforcement in rural areas, less so.

 

[sixthson]

In urban areas, yes. Law enforcement in rural areas, less so.

Oddly enough, probably more people in rural areas have guns than urban areas.

 

[KaraBulut]

Oddly enough, probably more people in rural areas have guns than urban areas.

Hmm... then I wonder why the difference in how urban and rural gunowners are viewed?

 

[eastofeden]

Hmm... then I wonder why the difference in how urban and rural gunowners are viewed?

I think that the urban gun owners rarely tell anyone about their guns or brag about them or (gag) take photos with them as though they are their "kin"..or join the NRA...nor do they talk about the 2nd Amendment.

Country folks seem proud of guns and like to be part of a club that is actually very political and has little to do with guns IMO....

Guns aren't as political to urban gun owners....

 

[Benvolio]

I think that the urban gun owners rarely tell anyone about their guns or brag about them or (gag) take photos with them as though they are their "kin"..or join the NRA...nor do they talk about the 2nd Amendment.

Country folks seem proud of guns and like to be part of a club that is actually very political and has little to do with guns IMO....

Guns aren't as political to urban gun owners....

No. Country people have shotguns and fewer rifles for hunting. Urban people are more likely to have hand guns..

 

[sixthson]

Hmm... then I wonder why the difference in how urban and rural gunowners are viewed?

Maybe urban guns are more often used for crime? Urban non-gun owners are generally suspicious of those who own guns. Rural people think you are odd if you don't.

 

[NotHardUp1]

The NRA's membership only numbers around 5 million in a nation of over 350 million.

Their unseemly influence in national law and policy is similar to the Episcopal Church historically, e.g., although a small percentage of the population, unduly represented in government.

In the case of the NRA, it is likely several factors:

1) many more gun owners (likely over 70 million) feel represented by the NRA but do not actually join and pay the annual dues
2) gun manufacturers use the NRA as a lobby for their interests, and money talks
3) the low numbers of activists who contact Congress means that the NRA only has to get its members to be more active than the apathetic majority in order to keep the Congress afraid to ban automatic weapons, etc.
4) rural people have always kept guns for hunting, and protection of property, and indeed hear fearmongering from hard right radio and believe they are threatened. With 20% of the nation rural, only a small fraction of around 10-20% would need to join to comprise the NRA's bulk.

 

[JohnnyAnger]

I think that the urban gun owners rarely tell anyone about their guns or brag about them or (gag) take photos with them as though they are their "kin"..or join the NRA...nor do they talk about the 2nd Amendment.

Country folks seem proud of guns and like to be part of a club that is actually very political and has little to do with guns IMO....

Guns aren't as political to urban gun owners....

I don't know, the left right now are arming themselves pretty heavily in a lot of areas (I know they always have done, but it feels like the past year its really growing). Groups like Redneck Revolt and the John Brown Gun Club are doing it against the growth of the far right, and now a lot of queer groups like Trigger Warning and Pink Pistol are growing loads as well. Gun Clubs for the left are a big thing in urban areas right now.

 

[Alistair]

 

[Alistair]