why don't all blacks support gays?

[CupCake]

^When I wouldn't get too excited about a black president. There was a perfect storm of opportunity that got him over. When his one term is over, we may never see his like for the rest of the century.

And you'll still have to deal with your personal issues that have the highest visibility.

When you're sitting in the boardroom, your race is more likely to be a flashpoint for conflict and opposition than your gender or sexual orientation.

I agree on that part I admit... I understand that your race has to deal with issues more completely! But All I am saying is I will defend them both the same if I had to...

 

[MystikWizard]

Well, I've already explained to you that similar indiviudals clump together and form cultures, collective identities, and groupthink that often leads to misunderstanding and conflict with other factions.

This is all very basic stuff. Yes, you insist it "doesn't exist." You are still in denial because, at some level, I don't think you want to see our respective communities working through our issues.

Babi, with all due respect, you keep avoiding my question ... which I think I've asked for 4 times now.

I know you described to me what it's "like" to be "Black First and Gay Second" from your Board Room example. If one is in the Board Room, people see Color first, before sexual orientation. I get that part.

What I am not seeing you elaborate on is what exactly are the consequences of you putting "Race before Orientation". If you can provide me a hypothetical example of where YOU would put Race before Orientation first in the context of speaking up and fighting for Gay Rights, what would you do? All I am looking for an example is a case where you would be conflicted between Race and Orientation (any example you can think of) and to define how you would handle the situation.

This could be in the frame of speaking up for Gay Rights.
Educating other members of the Black Community on Gay Rights.
Whether to speak to the Church about your views on Gay Rights.
Whether to vote on Gay Rights or not.

I basically would like to see an example of how you would put Race before Orientation, if you had to make a choice.


And speaking of denial, I also think this is very basic stuff, too. We don't have Gay Community Leaders, as has been pointed out. Not like Blacks have Church Leaders like Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson. Meetup groups are very, very few and far between. And using your example, you say that Color comes before Orientation. I just want to know with where your thought process comes from in thinking that we have a "White Gay Community" based on your own example, that is not reaching out to a Black Gay Community? We have no more of a White Gay Community than you have a Black Gay Community.

Whites, as a whole, don't have the same sense of Community that Blacks do. And that is something you keep wanting to deny, because you can't seem to come to grips with it. However, it is so basically obvious. Whites are 74% of the population. Where as Blacks are around 13% of the population and are therefore more united being a Minority. The higher the percentage of any one race, the less united one is going to be by that factor, and hence, we've become more individualized. Quite frankly, I am puzzled why this isn't registering with you.

 

[Zeno Lorea]

This may have been asked before but...

WHY DON'T ALL GAYS SUPPORT BLACKS?

 

[MystikWizard]

This may have been asked before but...

WHY DON'T ALL GAYS SUPPORT BLACKS?

I think it's damn near impossible to get all members of any particular community to support or be against any one thing in particular, hence the wording of the thread title by Tyler was poor. I think we're long past that part now, if you couldn't tell from actually reading the posts.

Also, I think we could have deep-dived a little more on what in particular about Gays should be supported. Marriage, Rights, DADT ... there are a variety of issues to support or not. Same with Blacks, as well.

 

[CupCake]

This may have been asked before but...

WHY DON'T ALL GAYS SUPPORT BLACKS?

Yeah that question is out the window! We have moved passed like 5,6,7,8,9 different topics lol

 

[Apollo]

Again, you still haven't deep dived, like I requested of you 3 times now, to explain to me "Black First, Gay Second" ... in terms of your attitudes towards Gay Rights and in terms of how you address your approach to it within the Black Community.

What does what color your skin is, like you mentioned in the Board Room example above, have to do with your beliefs on Gay Rights, your secondary community?

Please elaborate if you would ....

I thought this was already explained in this thread?

 

[MystikWizard]

I thought this was already explained in this thread?

I have to agree with Master of Splatter in that NO, I haven't seen it explained.

I've seen "I'm Black first, Gay second" explained from the standpoint of "people see Race before they see Orientation" and like I said, I understand that ... but that wasn't what I was asking.

I'm asking specifically what that means in terms of the actions amongst Black Gays who view themselves as "Black first, and Gay second", as it relates to your positions on Gay Rights issues. In other words, if you were approached with a conflict as it pertains to Gay Rights vs what the position of the overall Black Community is as it pertains to their stance on Gays ... what would you do? I guess what I am getting at is how far are you willing to go in the name of loyalty to one's skin color vs the other side of you ... that being a Gay man?

This could be in terms of having a religious parent who preaches that Homosexuality is an Abomination before God. You say you are "Black First, Gay Second". Does that mean there is less chance of a Black Gay coming out of the closet for fear of disappointing one's parents or peers, since the Community as a whole is against it, and you feel the need to put "being Black, first?"

Or when it comes to standing up and challenging the Church, since the overwhelming majority of Blacks according to various polls are the most religious racial group and with that, truly believe that homosexuality is an abomination before God, does putting "Black first and Gay second" mean that one is less likely to challenge the Church because there is a fear of being alienated from the Black Community if you do?

What I am trying to do is get a better understanding as it pertains to one's philosophies, and more importantly, one's actions on what you will physically do or not do, with respect to your viewpoint of "I'm Black first, Gay second". And what happens when those two things come into conflict with each other?




Also, on a side note, I have heard several Black posters in this thread say that "the Gay Community doesn't reach out to me" and "I don't feel necessarily welcomed by the Gay Community". And what I gather from this is that Blacks who say this are truly looking for some sort of physical reach-out from a physical Gay Community.

I just want to ask if you know who reached out to me from the Gay Community (who you seemingly want to refer to as the White Gay Community)? Absolutely nobody. Not a single person.

And I would encourage Gay Blacks who feel this way to ask any number of other White Gays "Who specifically reached out to them from the Gay Community?" and I am sure that the answers will be very similar .... "nobody." And again, this leads me to believe there is a misunderstanding amongst Blacks on how they define "Communities" and how Whites view "Communities". There is no more of a White Gay Community that reaches out to people, no more than there is a Black Gay Community that reaches out to people. We have no Jesse Jackson. We have no Al Sharpton. And frankly, I don't want any Community leader speaking out for all Gays and speaking for me. We are all individuals and we are all uniquely different. However, we simply share the same ideologies as each other and thus refer to this as a "Community". It's a community only in the sense that we share the same ideals and ideologies, and want the same things for each other.

I keep hearing Blacks say that "the (White) Gay Community needs to reach out to Black Church Leaders". What if I reversed that and say that the "Black Gay Community needs to reach out to White Church leaders"? Who would you send? Who is the leader of the "Black Gay Community" and where is this "Community" based out of?

 

[Apollo]

I have to agree with Master of Splatter in that NO, I haven't seen it explained.

I've seen "I'm Black first, Gay second" explained from the standpoint of "people see Race before they see Orientation" and like I said, I understand that ... but that wasn't what I was asking.

I'm asking specifically what that means in terms of the actions amongst Black Gays who view themselves as "Black first, and Gay second", as it relates to your positions on Gay Rights issues. In other words, if you were approached with a conflict as it pertains to Gay Rights vs what the position of the overall Black Community is as it pertains to their stance on Gays ... what would you do? I guess what I am getting at is how far are you willing to go in the name of loyalty to one's skin color vs the other side of you ... that being a Gay man?

To me at least, being black and gay doesn't mean I have to choose sides. Yes the black community is strong, and like to support our community the best we can, but I am also gay. I am not going to vote agains't gay rights because my community doesn't agree with it.

It isn't all group think, we are still individuals and we think for ourselves. Not all straight blacks are agaisnt gay rights and some will fight for them with us.

This could be in terms of having a religious parent who preaches that Homosexuality is an Abomination before God. You say you are "Black First, Gay Second". Does that mean there is less chance of a Black Gay coming out of the closet for fear of disappointing one's parents or peers, since the Community as a whole is against it, and you feel the need to put "being Black, first?"

Or when it comes to standing up and challenging the Church, since the overwhelming majority of Blacks according to various polls are the most religious racial group and with that, truly believe that homosexuality is an abomination before God, does putting "Black first and Gay second" mean that one is less likely to challenge the Church because there is a fear of being alienated from the Black Community if you do?

I can't answer either of these points as my family is accepting, and we aren't super religious. I do imagine for some black gay guys, like any other community, fear of being alienated or thrown out for being gay is a fear that keeps them in the closet. I think this point is more universal, than a real big black issue.

What I am trying to do is get a better understanding as it pertains to one's philosophies, and more importantly, one's actions on what you will physically do or not do, with respect to your viewpoint of "I'm Black first, Gay second". And what happens when those two things come into conflict with each other?

Your stuck on this "black first, gay second thing" When people say that, they are saying (unless your visibly feminine) people see a black person before they ever see that your gay. When you walk down a street, they see your skin color, and thats usually all they see. I mean, unless your kissing your boyfriend in public or sucking someones dick in the middle of the street, people could seemingly never know you were gay. People are by default straight until told otherwise.

No black person is, by default, white or some other race. We are black by default and it is shown all day, everyday, unless you bleach your skin or are never seen in person.

Also, on a side note, I have heard several Black posters in this thread say that "the Gay Community doesn't reach out to me" and "I don't feel necessarily welcomed by the Gay Community". And what I gather from this is that Blacks who say this are truly looking for some sort of physical reach-out from a physical Gay Community.

I just want to ask if you know who reached out to me from the Gay Community (who you seemingly want to refer to as the White Gay Community)? Absolutely nobody. Not a single person.

Well in the black community, along with other communities, there is a sense of helping your neighbor and making sure they can get some help.

For the gay community, because of the media, really all new gays think about is a gay bar. And a gay bar is usually no place to go to seek help on personal issues, and because of that, some men can become to feel dejected from the gay community and will always have support from the black community.

Then there is the racism in the gay community. And that is something black guys aren't prepared for. I mean, if your gay and you see how gays are treated in the world, you would imagine the gay community would be the last place to find racism and predujice. Yet in the gay community, racism is more seen and prevalent than the straight community in some cases, and that's a bad thing. One need only look on this site for racism. And the majority don't even see what's wrong with what they are saying.

And I would encourage Gay Blacks who feel this way to ask any number of other White Gays "Who specifically reached out to them from the Gay Community?" and I am sure that the answers will be very similar .... "nobody." And again, this leads me to believe there is a misunderstanding amongst Blacks on how they define "Communities" and how Whites view "Communities". There is no more of a White Gay Community that reaches out to people, no more than there is a Black Gay Community that reaches out to people. We have no Jesse Jackson. We have no Al Sharpton. And frankly, I don't want any Community leader speaking out for all Gays and speaking for me. We are all individuals and we are all uniquely different. However, we simply share the same ideologies as each other and thus refer to this as a "Community". It's a community only in the sense that we share the same ideals and ideologies, and want the same things for each other.

See and this is a problem that a lot of minority groups may feel about the gay community. There is no real community where their should be. Most minority groups have a strong sense of family, and community anongst common bonds and traits. We are all gay, yet even you say that you feel a strong, together community isn't necessarily a great thing.

A strong community centralizes all the issues, it makes it easy to get information out, and to organize for a fight against oppression. That is something black people, and other ethnic communities have always known, and that's why we try to stick together and help each other.

Where does a gay black man go to seek help, and guidance on issues of his sexuality and talking to his parents? A gay bar?

I keep hearing Blacks say that "the (White) Gay Community needs to reach out to Black Church Leaders". What if I reversed that and say that the "Black Gay Community needs to reach out to White Church leaders"? Who would you send? Who is the leader of the "Black Gay Community" and where is this "Community" based out of?

No, the gay community needs to reach out to the black church leaders. The black church leaders aren't gay, they don't care about gay people. That's something you need to understand. They don't need to care about you, they don't rely the white gay community for anything. They don't need to reach out to the gay community, you need to reach out to them.

If you don't reach out to them, then they will go on with their lives, and not give half a shit. If you reach out to the black community, educate them on the issues, and convince them, suddenly you have someone who is thinking of you when they talk to their representatives, or are talking to their friends, or go to the polls to vote.

It was similarly the same for the black community in the day. White people didn't need to care about us or are rights. The black community had to educate and convince them that they should support blacks in our fight for equality. If we had done nothing and expected them to come to us, we probably still wouldn't have our full rights.

I don't get this thinking that the black community needs to reach out to us? It's a stupid idea, and it is never going to happen. Why should they reach out to us? They have no need to, they have no reason to. It isn't their job to get our rights, it is our job. We are the gay people, not them.

 

[MystikWizard]

To me at least, being black and gay doesn't mean I have to choose sides. Yes the black community is strong, and like to support our community the best we can, but I am also gay. I am not going to vote agains't gay rights because my community doesn't agree with it.

It isn't all group think, we are still individuals and we think for ourselves. Not all straight blacks are agaisnt gay rights and some will fight for them with us.

I can't answer either of these points as my family is accepting, and we aren't super religious. I do imagine for some black gay guys, like any other community, fear of being alienated or thrown out for being gay is a fear that keeps them in the closet. I think this point is more universal, than a real big black issue.

Your stuck on this "black first, gay second thing" When people say that, they are saying (unless your visibly feminine) people see a black person before they ever see that your gay. When you walk down a street, they see your skin color, and thats usually all they see. I mean, unless your kissing your boyfriend in public or sucking someones dick in the middle of the street, people could seemingly never know you were gay. People are by default straight until told otherwise.

No black person is, by default, white or some other race. We are black by default and it is shown all day, everyday, unless you bleach your skin or are never seen in person.




Well in the black community, along with other communities, there is a sense of helping your neighbor and making sure they can get some help.

For the gay community, because of the media, really all new gays think about is a gay bar. And a gay bar is usually no place to go to seek help on personal issues, and because of that, some men can become to feel dejected from the gay community and will always have support from the black community.

Then there is the racism in the gay community. And that is something black guys aren't prepared for. I mean, if your gay and you see how gays are treated in the world, you would imagine the gay community would be the last place to find racism and predujice. Yet in the gay community, racism is more seen and prevalent than the straight community in some cases, and that's a bad thing. One need only look on this site for racism. And the majority don't even see what's wrong with what they are saying.

See and this is a problem that a lot of minority groups may feel about the gay community. There is no real community where their should be. Most minority groups have a strong sense of family, and community anongst common bonds and traits. We are all gay, yet even you say that you feel a strong, together community isn't necessarily a great thing.

A strong community centralizes all the issues, it makes it easy to get information out, and to organize for a fight against oppression. That is something black people, and other ethnic communities have always known, and that's why we try to stick together and help each other.

Where does a gay black man go to seek help, and guidance on issues of his sexuality and talking to his parents? A gay bar?


No, the gay community needs to reach out to the black church leaders. The black church leaders aren't gay, they don't care about gay people. That's something you need to understand. They don't need to care about you, they don't rely the white gay community for anything. They don't need to reach out to the gay community, you need to reach out to them.

If you don't reach out to them, then they will go on with their lives, and not give half a shit. If you reach out to the black community, educate them on the issues, and convince them, suddenly you have someone who is thinking of you when they talk to their representatives, or are talking to their friends, or go to the polls to vote.

It was similarly the same for the black community in the day. White people didn't need to care about us or are rights. The black community had to educate and convince them that they should support blacks in our fight for equality. If we had done nothing and expected them to come to us, we probably still wouldn't have our full rights.

I don't get this thinking that the black community needs to reach out to us? It's a stupid idea, and it is never going to happen. Why should they reach out to us? They have no need to, they have no reason to. It isn't their job to get our rights, it is our job. We are the gay people, not them.

First, I appreciate your response, and this is the type of open dialogue I am really seeking with Gay Black members on this forum.

I was initially going to go point by point, in my response throughout your post, and I still have intention of doing so .... but before I do so, I wanted to focus on one thing.

This:

No, the gay community needs to reach out to the black church leaders. The black church leaders aren't gay, they don't care about gay people. That's something you need to understand. They don't need to care about you, they don't rely the white gay community for anything. They don't need to reach out to the gay community, you need to reach out to them.

I couldn't even tell you which Gay Leaders reached out to our churches. And to be frank, I don't think it necessarily happened to any real degree. Rather, a lot of Whites seemed to cease being religious on their own, because their eyes opened up. And thus, the concept of Free Individual Thought was demonstrated.

What I am wondering is why the Black Community propels your Church Leaders to be the Leaders and Masters of your Community? Essentially, you telling me that Gays need to reach out to "the Black Church leaders", you are all but admitting that the Church Leaders control your entire thought process and that you are essentially under their control. And that's just the way these Church Leaders want it, too, since they profit off of you and earn their living that way. And as long as you give them that control and power, they have it, and they will keep it.

You say that "White Gay Community needs to reach out to Black Church Leaders. But, I'd also like to know which Black Gay leaders have reached out to or are planning to reach out to Black Churches, as well?




The Awakening process pertaining to Organized religion seemed to have simply occurred a little faster amongst Whites than it has amongst Blacks. If Whites can stand up to these Churches on their own, without a Gay Community coming in and intercepting ... and basically say ... "You know what, you don't speak for God. You Father, are just a man that claims to speak for God" .... if Whites can do that on their own without a Gay Community coming in .... than what is preventing Blacks from doing the same thing?

 

[Apollo]

First, I appreciate your response, and this is the type of open dialogue I am really seeking with Gay Black members on this forum.

I was initially going to go point by point, in my response throughout your post, and I still have intention of doing so .... but before I do so, I wanted to focus on one thing.

This:




I couldn't even tell you which Gay Leaders reached out to our churches. And to be frank, I don't think it necessarily happened to any real degree. Rather, a lot of Whites seemed to cease being religious on their own, because their eyes opened up. And thus, the concept of Free Individual Thought was demonstrated.

What I am wondering is why the Black Community propels your Church Leaders to be the Leaders and Masters of your Community? Essentially, you telling me that Gays need to reach out to "the Black Church leaders", you are all but admitting that the Church Leaders control your entire thought process and that you are essentially under their control. And that's just the way these Church Leaders want it, too, since they profit off of you and earn their living that way. And as long as you give them that control and power, they have it, and they will keep it.

You say that "White Gay Community needs to reach out to Black Church Leaders. But, I'd also like to know which Black Gay leaders have reached out to or are planning to reach out to Black Churches, as well?




The Awakening process pertaining to Organized religion seemed to have simply occurred a little faster amongst Whites than it has amongst Blacks. If Whites can stand up to these Churches on their own, without a Gay Community coming in and intercepting ... and basically say ... "You know what, you don't speak for God. You Father, are just a man that claims to speak for God" .... if Whites can do that on their own without a Gay Community coming in .... than what is preventing Blacks from doing the same thing?

Well your opinion on religion is your opinion. Not the thread to discuss that but to say I disagree.

Now to the church leaders. Usually you get the largest majority of black people in churches, and churches usually help to keep kids out of trouble, and going on the right path. Churches really help certain black communities, and it is sometimes the place to get access to a large group of black people.

Also, and I hate to say this, most of the times church leaders the best educated and best spoken to convince black people of anything. Now you can completely skip black church leaders and just leave information with regular black folks anyway.

It is your choice how you convince, or educate people on issues. It would probably be better to just supercede a church and just go into black communities and go door to door, or leave pamphlets or just information on peoples doors and cars.

And yes, a lot of white people got away from religion. But in recent history, they didn't have to deal with living as slaves, or under oppressive segregation laws. Therefor they didn't need God or someone to keep them sane and from killing themselves as they wondered how people could treat us like that.

And back in times of slavery, sunday was pretty much their only day off and church was always on Sunday.

 

[MystikWizard]

Well your opinion on religion is your opinion. Not the thread to discuss that but to say I disagree.

See, this is part of the problem I think there is. Because the bounds of religion are so strong in the Black Community, I am not even convinced that Gay Blacks themselves have broken those bonds. And that only leads to speculation on how many of you view yourselves, in the context of religion. And because of this, what I am gathering is that a lot of Black Gays are apathetic to the cause. At least, publicly, anyway. They don't want to be seen by other Blacks as doing anything that rocks the boat in the Black Community for fear of rejection of their fellow peers. Then, there would be no "community" to be a part of, in their eyes.

Now to the church leaders. Usually you get the largest majority of black people in churches, and churches usually help to keep kids out of trouble, and going on the right path. Churches really help certain black communities, and it is sometimes the place to get access to a large group of black people.

Also, and I hate to say this, most of the times church leaders the best educated and best spoken to convince black people of anything. Now you can completely skip black church leaders and just leave information with regular black folks anyway.

It is your choice how you convince, or educate people on issues. It would probably be better to just supercede a church and just go into black communities and go door to door, or leave pamphlets or just information on peoples doors and cars.

And yes, a lot of white people got away from religion. But in recent history, they didn't have to deal with living as slaves, or under oppressive segregation laws. Therefor they didn't need God or someone to keep them sane and from killing themselves as they wondered how people could treat us like that.

And back in times of slavery, sunday was pretty much their only day off and church was always on Sunday.

It is "Your" Choice? What about "Our" Choice? Again, this further points to my comments above. You don't appear to even want to be in the Gay "Community", and are giving off the impression that you would rather White Gays do your work for you with your Black Church leaders. Again, because of Apathy and/or Fear to stand up to them, and how you would be perceived amongst your Race for doing so.


And to the second part of my question from my prior post?

Which Black Leaders have reached out to or are planning to reach out to the Black Church leaders? And where are they at so we can get in contact with them? Maybe we can get their help in reaching out to White Church leaders, too.

 

[Apollo]

See, this is part of the problem I think there is. Because the bounds of religion are so strong in the Black Community, I am not even convinced that Gay Blacks themselves have broken those bonds. And that only leads to speculation on how many of you view yourselves, in the context of religion. And because of this, what I am gathering is that a lot of Black Gays are apathetic to the cause. At least, publicly, anyway. They don't want to be seen by other Blacks as doing anything that rocks the boat in the Black Community for fear of rejection of their fellow peers. Then, there would be no "community" to be a part of, in their eyes.

I am not religious, I just don't agree with your assessment on religion.

It is "Your" Choice? What about "Our" Choice? Again, this further points to my comments above. You don't appear to even want to be in the Gay "Community", and are giving off the impression that you would rather White Gays do your work for you with your Black Church leaders. Again, because of Apathy and/or Fear to stand up to them, and how you would be perceived amongst your Race for doing so.

Well, the first step is reaching out to gay black leaders. Giving them help and support to talk to people.

And when I said "your" I wasn't talking about white gays.

And to the second part of my question from my prior post?

Which Black Leaders have reached out to or are planning to reach out to the Black Church leaders? And where are they at so we can get in contact with them? Maybe we can get their help in reaching out to White Church leaders, too.

I have no idea where the gay black leaders are. They aren't as vocal or well known as the white people. Mostly because media and such doesn't bother to care about the plight of black people. And gays in the media certainly don't give a shit who is a gay black leader.

I am sure Google can help.

 

[BabiGayPimp]

I've yet to see it explained from anyone - just alot of pandering and calling so and so a racist for little to no reason, and yet, very few call those in this thread that are actually racist out on their shit.

It's made for a boring read.

Oh, I think it's been explained quite well. We are dealing with an individual who is hard of understanding.

 

[CupCake]

Where at? If i missed it, then i'm wrong, but i certainly didn't see an answer.

Well he explained it to me... He said its like if you have two battle fields and one is getting constantly blown up and the other is being rarely hit... Then you would put the one which is getting attacked first on your priority list... Although I understood exactly what Babi was saying and what he meant by putting his race first because thats what people see first is your skin all I was saying is that I love being black and gay equally and I will defend them both equally! I will vote for gay rights just like I will stand up for the rights of any other injustice... racism,sexism,homophobia there all wrong.

I think some Blacks do not get attacked in their gay battle field as babi put it as much because they are not out the closet.... I am out so I feel the burn allot so thats where we are different.

 

[Apollo]

Where at? If i missed it, then i'm wrong, but i certainly didn't see an answer.

Well I just tried to explain it. Mystik seems happy with my explanation and the conversation has kinda moved on.

 

[MystikWizard]

Well I just tried to explain it. Mystik seems happy with my explanation and the conversation has kinda moved on.

Ahhhhh, wouldn't go that far, yet, Apollo. Don't necessarily judge my non-response for the past few hours as moving on. I just haven't been on JUB since earlier. I just signed on real quick, but I'm getting ready to head out to dinner. So I'll be back on a little later.

Gentlemen, I appreciate the discussion. And I mean that very sincerely.

See you all later.

 

[Apollo]

Ahhhhh, wouldn't go that far, yet, Apollo. Don't necessarily judge my non-response for the past few hours as moving on. I just haven't been on JUB since earlier. I just signed on real quick, but I'm getting ready to head out to dinner. So I'll be back on a little later.

Gentlemen, I appreciate the discussion. And I mean that very sincerely.

See you all later.

I know the convo isn't over, but we the convo has kinda evolved from your little quesiton. Enjoy dinner though.

 

[Apollo]

Damn you!!!!!

 

[CupCake]

I think this thread is feeling a bit neglected.

NOOOOOOOO! Let it die! lol

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

I dunno if this has been mentioned before but black Americans circa the 1960s are an entirely different breed from black Americans in 2009.

They were driven and organized, we're lost and unorganized. They had unity and causes to fight for, we're killing each other in record numbers and our main priorities are owning expensive cell phones and clothes from Italian designers.

Obviously this isn't all black Americans but they seem to be the majority.