wuh oh... Kavanaugh is a #metoo

[ChickenGuy]

There is an idea I thought about that I've never heard yet mentioned on any news media - that the FBI could compile a list of addresses of all known school acquaintances of these four men, narrow down who lived in say a 2-mile radius of roughly where this allegedly occurred, and Ms Ford could then be taken around and shown inside these houses, because she vividly remembers the layout.

And as for the outcome of all this, it seems from what I've heard that it will all come down to the decision of Senator Flake and the two women Senators in Maine and Alaska. Either they will ultimately vote for, or against. All three are Republicans as I understand. Up to them.

I'm strangely ambivalent and undecided. (unusual for me!)

 

[willhunt]

Sad? That's devastating. Let it sink in.... we're in bad shape and I don't have confidence we can overcome this as a nation. At least not without the fight(hopefully NOT literal) for America's heart and soul.

Let it sink in..
To think some Republicans are running on trump's platform is horrifying and ugly.

 

[frankfrank]

I've heard that it will all come down to the decision of Senator Flake and the two women Senators in Maine and Alaska.

Senator Manchin of West Virginia is also a swing vote this time because, though he's a Democrat, he is expected to vote for confirmation. If that happens, all three Senators you mention would need to defect.

 

[KaraBulut]

There is an idea I thought about that I've never heard yet mentioned on any news media - that the FBI could compile a list of addresses of all known school acquaintances of these four men, narrow down who lived in say a 2-mile radius of roughly where this allegedly occurred, and Ms Ford could then be taken around and shown inside these houses, because she vividly remembers the layout.

It's simpler than that. Two boys knew where the bedroom was and how to operate the radio in that bedroom. What are the chances that the two boys, in a drunk state, would be able to do that in a stranger's house?

There's a high likelihood it was a house they had been in many times and their friends also had been in that house, too. If it happened the way the Dr Ford said that it happened, the friends know whose house it happened in and it probably wasn't the first time that the boys did it.

 

[rareboy]

 

[gsdx]

^ Quite a range of expressions there, especially the lady in the middle and the guy snoozing away in the back.

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

There is an idea I thought about that I've never heard yet mentioned on any news media - that the FBI could compile a list of addresses of all known school acquaintances of these four men, narrow down who lived in say a 2-mile radius of roughly where this allegedly occurred, and Ms Ford could then be taken around and shown inside these houses, because she vividly remembers the layout.

Republicans, the president and Kavanaugh have made it abundantly clear they want this investigation as rushed and incomplete as possible. If they were democrats this would be the part where one would insert accusations of conspiracy and cover-up.

 

[MystikWizard]

Where I am at with this.

As I mentioned earlier, I have concerns with Dr. Ford's gaps and the fact she has nobody that can corroborate her story makes her complaint extremely difficult to consider. Otherwise, anyone can start a "He said/She said" and cost someone a government position. It isn't right no matter what side of the aisle anyone is on.

That said, through this process I definitely have concerns with Judge Kavanaugh's behavior ... however, as Lindsey Graham may say, maybe we would react in the same manner if there was an untrue allegation made that destroyed your life and the life of your family.

I also have concerns that he was not being truthful when being questioned about those yearbook term definitions.

Back to the original Confirmation hearings, I mentioned I was not impressed with many of his answers as he did a tremendous amount of dodging questions. On that alone, I had concerns and probably would not have moved forward with him as I do not respect that type of question-dodging and feel like vague non-answers should not be rewarded.

I probably would not confirm Judge Kavanaugh, but mostly due to issues of character I have with him as opposed to the allegations themselves. Dr. Ford needs to have someone corroborate her story.

 

[mikey3000]

But obviously more girls who believe that she's a lying tool who is belittling true victims of sexual assault. shame.

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

As I mentioned earlier, I have concerns with Dr. Ford's gaps

It is common knowledge even for those with a cursory understanding of psychology and trauma that not remembering details is extremely common, perhaps due to the mechanics of assault, also a possible attempt by the psyche to block out unpleasant thoughts. If every rape victims needs to corroborate her story with what cologne the assailant was wearing and whether he was right or left handed that's practically a decriminalization of rape.

and the fact she has nobody that can corroborate her story makes her complaint extremely difficult to consider.

Precedent: Any assault that doesn't have witnesses didn't happen. Unacceptable.

Otherwise, anyone can start a "He said/She said" and cost someone a government position. It isn't right no matter what side of the aisle anyone is on.

All I can say is this is a funny ass time for Americans to start worrying about how untrue charges can cost someone something. Although, when this happens to men of color, as it does frequently, we're told it's par the course for life and just deal with it. Wasn't a concern til powerful white men starting falling at the knees of metoo.

That said, through this process I definitely have concerns with Judge Kavanaugh's behavior ... however, as Lindsey Graham may say, maybe we would react in the same manner if there was an untrue allegation made that destroyed your life and the life of your family.

No reason to believe you're not being truthful, though this rhetoric starkly harkens back to those phony on-the-fence undecideds who know good and well they're going to come around in the end.

 

[MystikWizard]

It is common knowledge even for those with a cursory understanding of psychology and trauma that not remembering details is extremely common, perhaps due to the mechanics of assault, also a possible attempt by the psyche to block out unpleasant thoughts. If every rape victims needs to corroborate her story with what cologne the assailant was wearing and whether he was right or left handed that's practically a decriminalization of rape.

Precedent: Any assault that doesn't have witnesses didn't happen. Unacceptable.

All I can say is this is a funny ass time for Americans to start worrying about how untrue charges can cost someone something. Although, when this happens to men of color, as it does frequently, we're told it's par the course for life and just deal with it. Wasn't a concern til powerful white men starting falling at the knees of metoo.

No reason to believe you're not being truthful, though this rhetoric starkly harkens back to those phony on-the-fence undecideds who know good and well they're going to come around in the end.

If you think you are going to get me to support having people convicted or denying them positions based on mere accusations alone, then I am not your guy. Not seeing how that is any different than McCarthyism or even the Salem Witch Trials.

If you want to make a charge, the burden of proof is on you. That's just the way it is.

 

[frankfrank]

If we hear that more investigation is needed, which of course [Text: Removed] McConnell is unlikely to abide, it's because the FBI investigation, as currently structured, is NOT sufficient. It is intentionally set up to make sure that uncomfortable and inconvenient truths don't come out.


There's obvious in-your-face perjury under oath from last week, and they aren't even allowed to look at any of that. It doesn't matter that a perjurer gets onto the bench, as long as he's a genuine Trumpuppet.


For chrissakes they're not even questioning Ford or Kavanaugh or their attorneys! This is an investigation in name only, so crafted to guarantee the conclusion that has already been pre-judged by those who demand that he be shoved through...RIGHT NOW!


All this, after what they did to Garland.

 

[willhunt]

If you think you are going to get me to support having people convicted or denying them positions based on mere accusations alone, then I am not your guy. Not seeing how that is any different than McCarthyism or even the Salem Witch Trials.

If you want to make a charge, the burden of proof is on you. That's just the way it is.

To be accused without warrant demands an investigation.

An investigation is not McCarthyism, which was actually a witch trial.

I'd like to point out:

"Burden of truth" is a legal expression used in a trial. This was actually a job interview.

 

[MystikWizard]

To be accused without warrant demands an investigation.

An investigation is not McCarthyism, which was actually a witch trial.

I'd like to point out:

"Burden of truth" is a legal expression used in a trial. This was actually a job interview.

Right. And what we are seeing here is a desire to say "Guilty until proven innocent."

Let's assume this situation. You are nominated for the Supreme Court and a number of guys, who you didn't get along with in high school, begin coming forward and accusing you of sexual assault. The allegations were untrue, but the accusations were made. An investigation occurs, but there is no corroboration of their claims and the investigation turns up nothing.

Going through your yearbooks, we find a number of crude remarks you made in your high school years.

Even though there is no proof beyond a reasonable doubt clause of sexual assault, there is doubt in the minds of Congressmen and Congresswomen that the allegations could be true and you are denied a position that you worked your life for.

Would you take no issue with that?

 

[willhunt]

Maybe. But if the Supreme Court was my lifetime goal, under no circumstances would I throw a full-on partisan TANTRUM. just sayin'

 

[frankfrank]

Right. And what we are seeing here is a desire to say "Guilty until proven innocent."

A friend in Arizona said, in an email, that it's "not like we're electing the next Pope or something."

I actually have to take issue with that. For better or worse, the United States still wields more influence and muscle over the world than any other nation. (China, and paradoxically the smallest nation on earth Vatican City, perhaps come "close" for that.)

As such, SCOTUS is the most powerful court in modern human history. (I will NOT try to compare to courts in the Fifth Century, etc.) Laws and other issues judged there often have worldwide repercussions, because this can effect behaviour of corporations in almost every country on earth, because most of the world's most powerful and ubiquitous corporations are based in this country. Environmental cases are eventually headed in that direction. The USA is part of so many international treaties of all types, and no doubt SCOTUS will at some point rule whether "we" can willy-nilly break those treaties as Dumpster seems to want to do. I'm not talking about internal debates and divisions such as Roe v Wade, Obergefell, Freedom of Religion laws, healthcare, etc. Those types of decisions don't have as much of a global impact, and they don't make my case for "the most powerful court in human history" as much as the stuff that affects global decisions.

However, even some things that might not be thought of as global...ARE. Roe v Wade issues can indeed become global if official U. S. policy is for advisers, ambassadors, etc. who are sent to foreign countries, to be forbidden by gag rules to talk about birth control, abortion, and such things. Official websites are removing all content about climate change, LGBT issues, workers' rights, renewable energy, and so much more. The world will NOT be a better place if the Americans officially sent abroad are only allowed to talk about pumping out more and more and more babies, and that COAL is the wonderful gateway to the future of energy. What about a gag rule that allows no Americans to speak up overseas about even the most egregious human rights abuses...such as genital mutilation...because the Americans sent over are all cool with it? (Religious affiliation need NOT be proven in any way.) The USA has kind of dropped the ball about investing in African labor, but that's probably a good thing (and China is filling the need)...if there was a lot of American investment, would these factories and producers be running, basically, horrific work camps? A "conservative" (MY ASS!!) Supreme Court may even start allowing this on domestic soil...the privatized prison-industrial complex is almost "there" already. And, surprise surprise surprise, what is the skin color of quite a few of these prisoners? We know the answer to that, because enforcement is VERY highly selective.

If five people are stopped by cops in different locations under entirely identical circumstances, and one is black and four of them are white, and only one of those five people is searched, WHICH one will it be?

As the most powerful courthouse in the world, and the Justices being appointed for HOWEVER LONG, FOR LIFE, THAT THEY WANT TO SIT...this IS tantamount to electing a new Pope. It's basically like a council of Popes...or perhaps even like KINGS, who have absolute power and final say over the laws of the land.

The elephant in the room is VOTING RIGHTS...discussions about that ALWAYS take a back burner, no matter how much those rights are chipped away at. Even Kennedy NEVER seemed to find any voting restriction that he didn't like, so in that aspect the Court doesn't change at all. (Interesting...in FLORIDA of all places...there's a reverse tide that is trying to change the law so former felons can vote. FINALLY.)

That's not even the biggest elephant in the room. This is a Justice who would vote to give the president complete imperial power over everything, and to do things as terrible as he may want, without accountability. The coup d'etat that has happened is so complete that there is little chance that the 25th Amendment will ever be invoked, no matter how awful it gets...and if the president is impeached, the Senate sure-as-fuck isn't going to convict. The Republicans are ALL IN this completely.

 

[Sausy]

A friend in Arizona said, in an email, that it's "not like we're electing the next Pope or something."

I actually have to take issue with that. For better or worse, the United States still wields more influence and muscle over the world than any other nation. (China, and paradoxically the smallest nation on earth Vatican City, perhaps come "close" for that.)

As such, SCOTUS is the most powerful court in modern human history. (I will NOT try to compare to courts in the Fifth Century, etc.) Laws and other issues judged there often have worldwide repercussions, because this can effect behaviour of corporations in almost every country on earth, because most of the world's most powerful and ubiquitous corporations are based in this country. Environmental cases are eventually headed in that direction. The USA is part of so many international treaties of all types, and no doubt SCOTUS will at some point rule whether "we" can willy-nilly break those treaties as Dumpster seems to want to do. I'm not talking about internal debates and divisions such as Roe v Wade, Obergefell, Freedom of Religion laws, healthcare, etc. Those types of decisions don't have as much of a global impact, and they don't make my case for "the most powerful court in human history" as much as the stuff that affects global decisions.

However, even some things that might not be thought of as global...ARE. Roe v Wade issues can indeed become global if official U. S. policy is for advisers, ambassadors, etc. who are sent to foreign countries, to be forbidden by gag rules to talk about birth control, abortion, and such things. Official websites are removing all content about climate change, LGBT issues, workers' rights, renewable energy, and so much more. The world will NOT be a better place if the Americans officially sent abroad are only allowed to talk about pumping out more and more and more babies, and that COAL is the wonderful gateway to the future of energy. What about a gag rule that allows no Americans to speak up overseas about even the most egregious human rights abuses...such as genital mutilation...because the Americans sent over are all cool with it? (Religious affiliation need NOT be proven in any way.) The USA has kind of dropped the ball about investing in African labor, but that's probably a good thing (and China is filling the need)...if there was a lot of American investment, would these factories and producers be running, basically, horrific work camps? A "conservative" (MY ASS!!) Supreme Court may even start allowing this on domestic soil...the privatized prison-industrial complex is almost "there" already. And, surprise surprise surprise, what is the skin color of quite a few of these prisoners? We know the answer to that, because enforcement is VERY highly selective.

If five people are stopped by cops in different locations under entirely identical circumstances, and one is black and four of them are white, and only one of those five people is searched, WHICH one will it be?

As the most powerful courthouse in the world, and the Justices being appointed for HOWEVER LONG, FOR LIFE, THAT THEY WANT TO SIT...this IS tantamount to electing a new Pope. It's basically like a council of Popes...or perhaps even like KINGS, who have absolute power and final say over the laws of the land.

The elephant in the room is VOTING RIGHTS...discussions about that ALWAYS take a back burner, no matter how much those rights are chipped away at. Even Kennedy NEVER seemed to find any voting restriction that he didn't like, so in that aspect the Court doesn't change at all. (Interesting...in FLORIDA of all places...there's a reverse tide that is trying to change the law so former felons can vote. FINALLY.)

That's not even the biggest elephant in the room. This is a Justice who would vote to give the president complete imperial power over everything, and to do things as terrible as he may want, without accountability. The coup d'etat that has happened is so complete that there is little chance that the 25th Amendment will ever be invoked, no matter how awful it gets...and if the president is impeached, the Senate sure-as-fuck isn't going to convict. The Republicans are ALL IN this completely.

Yep, Frank... in the case of being given what may essentially be a lifetime appointment, this most glorified of all job interviews demands we send someone who doesn't have a background of bells and whistles going off in rapid succession. It's not so much finding him guilty until proven innocent, but his evasiveness, untruthfulness,(not only here regarding the sexual accusations but his original testimony) and his wild eyed partisan hypocrisy in his response to Dr. Ford(as juxtaposed with his earlier touting of judicious decision making... of balance and restraint) which was washed away and replaced with the most one very much lacking in judicial temperament and restraint. You do that in a job interview for real, you don't get a second look... no hand holding by fiercely partisan middle aged and older white bros. Neil Gorsuch, for better or probably worse, passed the test of acting like a professional being given the opportunity for a lifetime seat on the Supreme Court. Brett Kavanaugh most certainly did not... certainly not in his second act and lack of candor and truth telling should not be ignored.

 

[rareboy]

But obviously more girls who believe that she's a lying tool who is belittling true victims of sexual assault. shame.

Projecting much?

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

Projecting much?

Par the course, and of course unsubstantiated.

 

[gsdx]

I won't post the video, but trump was at a Mississippi rally yesterday, mocking and insulting Ford over her testimony. The crowd was gobbling it up. These are not the qualifications of a president of the United States, but it's easy to see that he is a great teacher to his students.

I heard his speech on this morning's news and that was disgusting enough. It's no wonder there is so much hate spreading everywhere, and I mean everywhere!