A Question for you Pro-Heathcare Reformers

[rareboy]

rareboy seems to think that that is what universal healthcare means – make people pay.

You're wrong.

I live in Canada.

But be clear here folks. No health care is for free. It has real costs associated with it. Not amazingly, the tax funded systems actually mean more dollars directed at healthcare and fewer toward the administration of insurance and billings etc. than in the US, ie...more eficient.

Also fewer duplicated high cost low volume hi tech services.

But it is subject to political will. And constant cost cutting because while supplies and wages costs keep going up, we can't outsource the care to thirdworld jobbers.

Looking at the pitiful mess the US is in with the rapacious private insurance plans, it is no wonder that your businesses are no longer competitive and the middle class is in real trouble when it comes to paying for health care.

Buck up folks. Eventually, you may join the rest of the civilized, socially responsible world.

 

[bripatrick]

Why should I, a hard-working citizen who pays his taxes and is able to hold his own job, have to pay for someone else's care? Now my taxes are gonna go up to pay for some drug addict bum who can't keep a job. And by the way, get ready to have hospitals overcrowded and you guys having to wait long lines with this "universal healthcare" idea. If you want to help out crackwhore jobless bum that's your business, but I shouldn't be obligated to pay for someone's life insurance.

So, when that hurricane hit New Orleans and surrounding areas, were you pissed off that we (eventually) sent FEMA and spent a lot of money on helping all those despicable victims who weren't you? God, that must have been horrible for you...seeing tax money spent on Americans in need...

 

[bankside]

Why should I, a hard-working citizen who pays his taxes and is able to hold his own job, have to pay for someone else's care? Now my taxes are gonna go up to pay for some drug addict bum who can't keep a job. And by the way, get ready to have hospitals overcrowded and you guys having to wait long lines with this "universal healthcare" idea. If you want to help out crackwhore jobless bum that's your business, but I shouldn't be obligated to pay for someone's life insurance.

Because the lowest-cost way for you to deal with that person is medical treatment. It is cheaper for you to send someone to rehab than to pay for them to be arrested, pay deductibles when they break into your house, pay with your life when they're on a meth-induced paranoia trip.

It isn't just compassion that should motivate you to give your fellow citizen a second chance, it is also your own greed. Health care is cheaper than any alternative. Addicts don't just go and efficiently die somewhere to save you money. In their own despair, they cause lots of expensive mayhem for you, my fellow taxpayer.

By the way, some very good research has been done by Dr. Gabor Maté on the path to addiction. Check it out http://www.drgabormate.com/

 

[DigitalFudge]

Yeah that was my issue too.


Paying for these people


But then it hit me, I pay for public schools, people in the ER.


I don't care anymore.

As long as there is one person thats life could be saved by this. I will give as much money as it takes.

I donate so much shit to charity tax season is not even close to being a pain.

A little more off my income wouldn't hurt.

Thats why they made trust funds in offshore banking accounts

 

[MercuryJones]

But then it hit me, I pay for public schools, people in the ER.

To say nothing of unnecessary wars to benefit Haliburton and other right-wing war profiteers.

 

[LoveIsNow]

As I said before in another thread, my issue with this bill is why we're required to have healthcare insurance? I have a healthcare plan, so I have no problem with it, yet, but I know some older (yes, I know) folk who feel as if the most they need is dental care, which apparently isn't covered in the bill.

I think the hilarious thing is that my state's Attorney General is suing the federal government over this on the basis that "you can't force citizens to buy a product", even though anyone who drives a car in Florida is forced to buy auto insurance. The point being that it's not an unheard of demand. And isn't this the same sort of system that many Republicans said they wanted in the beginning of this debate? Where you're strong-armed into buying from the private-sector cronies. The only way to achieve any meaningful reform is overhauling the system, and going single-payer.

 

[saymyname]

Why should you have to pay taxes for libraries, the fire department, public roads, education if you have children, etc.? BECAUSE THESE ARE THINGS THAT EVERYONE IN A HEALTHY, FUNCTIONING SOCIETY NEEDS. As others have said, you're already paying for those people when they end up in the ER in some form or other. That's already being funded by taxes. Instead of taking this out on poor people who can't afford insanely high health care costs, why don't you take it out on the greedy companies that are posting skyrocketing profits while so many people go uninsured?

I swear, some people in the US would like nothing more than for that country to be so seriously behind other modern nations as to be unrecognizable. The middle class needs to wake up and realize it has more in common with the lower middle class and lower class than it does with the super rich.

 

[sabot3ur]

do people think before they speak anymore? at least about ANYONE else's feelings?

you would have a different perspective on this if someone you loved was dying and had no way of getting health insurance. If their condition was declining for years and they could do absolutely nothing about it. have some fucking class, hearing all of this bitching every single day from conservatives makes you all look righteously bad and coldhearted. not that it's new.

 

[BINOWGAYLATER]

Thankfully, there seems to be more "forward thinking" here than republican bullshit !! but Ididnt get to read everythingyet -- but the opening really got me - it's not -- def NOT bout you or me paying for some crackwhore's ER visit -- it's about the 40,000,000 Americans WITHOUT any healthcare -

and as far as "older" people only wanting Dental benefits? wtf?
I know people who are too young for Medicare that are paying $600.00 a month for their required meds - and $95.00 for an office visit - and that's WITH some half-baked employer provided retiree plan - that they have to pay over $3,500 a year for - and get hardly anything for it !!
If you think all the blue hairs want is dental coverage - think again - Diabetic meds are not cheap - neither is Lipior or 100 other meds , that insurance will NOT cover unless it is GENERIC !!
wake up people !! YOU'RE GONNA Get OLD - sooner than you think !!

 

[Críostóir]

Is the troll I smell?

Subtype Randroid.

 

[MystikWizard]

Why should I, a hard-working citizen who pays his taxes and is able to hold his own job, have to pay for someone else's care? Now my taxes are gonna go up to pay for some drug addict bum who can't keep a job. And by the way, get ready to have hospitals overcrowded and you guys having to wait long lines with this "universal healthcare" idea. If you want to help out crackwhore jobless bum that's your business, but I shouldn't be obligated to pay for someone's life insurance.

I am not reading through nearly 40 replies in here, but unless you are making $280,000 a year as a Single filer, your taxes aren't going up a penny.

In general, the bill would impose a tax at the rates of 1 percent, 1.5 percent, and 5.4 percent on the income of high-income individuals.

Specifically, for joint filers, the 1 percent rate would apply to the amount of a taxpayer’s modified adjusted gross income that is between $350,000 and half a million.

The 1.5 percent rate would apply to the portion of modified adjusted gross income between half a million and one million.

And the 5.4 percent rate would apply to all modified adjusted gross income above one million.

For married individual filers, the dollars amounts of the brackets above would be reduced by 50 percent.

For unmarried individual filers, the dollar amounts would be reduced by 20 percent.

Over ten years, the congressional Joint Committee on Taxation estimates that this provision would raise $543 billion over 10 years. Generally, this new surtax would target many of the same people that benefited most from the Bush tax cuts.

So what exactly is your problem again or do you just want to keep on re-iterating FOX News' Talking Points?

 

[BINOWGAYLATER]

It's sad that I had to read something similar about this when my roommate made an update on his facebook about it. It's a shame how much people really don't care for other people, like it literally doesn't matter to a good portion of people that there are people out there that need health care, who weren't getting it and are going to be able to now.

Shove your greed up your ass and actually think about other people for once. If people are benefiting from this and people can get something out of it, I'm fine with it. I had a lady in my store today who had a problem with her insurance and she was already blaming Obama for it. The ignorance boggles my mind.

Like other people have said, you've been paying for all sorts of things ever since you started paying your taxes. Why is this all of a sudden a problem? We have a Country that is doing a poor shit job of taking care of citizens that need the medical attention that they don't get.

If the first thing that pops in your head about this health care reform is about you 'losing money', there are no words that I can describe of how sad that really is.

IN TRIPLICATE!! WAY TO GO !!!

 

[JasunStrikesBack]

It's sad that I had to read something similar about this when my roommate made an update on his facebook about it. It's a shame how much people really don't care for other people, like it literally doesn't matter to a good portion of people that there are people out there that need health care, who weren't getting it and are going to be able to now.

Shove your greed up your ass and actually think about other people for once. If people are benefiting from this and people can get something out of it, I'm fine with it. I had a lady in my store today who had a problem with her insurance and she was already blaming Obama for it. The ignorance boggles my mind.

Like other people have said, you've been paying for all sorts of things ever since you started paying your taxes. Why is this all of a sudden a problem? We have a Country that is doing a poor shit job of taking care of citizens that need the medical attention that they don't get.

If the first thing that pops in your head about this health care reform is about you 'losing money', there are no words that I can describe of how sad that really is.

OH Thanks so much. I just want to strangle the Tea Baggers sometimes for their greed, ignorance and racism.

Just drives me nuts.

 

[The_Reaper]

Golden Rule: Do onto others as you want done onto you.

Canada's had medicare since the 1960s, with Saskatchewan (my province) leading the way. We've had a few problems, after all no system is ever perfect, but for the most part we all do our share.

The fact of the matter is, likely, under the American insurance system now, you are already paying for that 'unemployed, drug addict' as you said. If you take into account 'free clinics' in the USA, the cost of those operating comes from somewhere. There may be private benefactors, or donations from insurance companies looking for PR, but ultimately the cost of operating that clinic is passed onto Americans in the long run.

So, if you're already paying for it (indirectly through services costing you more, or through payments you make to the insurance companies, which in turn are donated to a free clinic), why not make sure that everyone else in the country can get access to health care?

The problem is that right now you are employed and able to afford your health insurance. What would you do if you lost your job? Or you retired and your benefits were not nearly as comfortable as you thought they would be? There are people in those situations, not just 'drug addicts' and other 'undesirables' who cannot afford health coverage. And there's no guarantee you won't be among them some day, as none of us can see the future and know that we'll be ok the day after tomorrow.

As such, a medicare system makes the most sense.

The only problem with medicare systems, as envisioned by CCF leader and 'father of medicare' here in Canada Tommy Douglas; is that medicare is only supposed to be the first step.

The second step is preventative care; encouraging healthier lifestyles so that even though we have free medical access, we have fewer people using it. TRUE health care, as opposed to 'sick' care. Sadly, no one seems to have gotten to this second objective yet, but anything is still possible.

Medicare could be the first step in helping to curb unhealthy lifestyles, and isn't that worth a few tax dollars in exploring?

 

[Tadaa]

Why should I, a hard-working citizen who pays his taxes and is able to hold his own job, have to pay for someone else's care? Now my taxes are gonna go up to pay for some drug addict bum who can't keep a job. And by the way, get ready to have hospitals overcrowded and you guys having to wait long lines with this "universal healthcare" idea. If you want to help out crackwhore jobless bum that's your business, but I shouldn't be obligated to pay for someone's life insurance.

You should move.

 

[Paws]

Why should I, a hard-working citizen who pays his taxes and is able to hold his own job, have to pay for someone else's care?

Because that's what citizens in most European countries do and it works. So don't be backwards.

 

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[gadgdfgsg]

Ok so before I start writing let me make one thing clear: I am
Canadian. I have enjoyed "free" healthcare for my whole life... And I ask u opposers this:
what will happen if you are out of a job, and u need to go to the hospital? Then you will probably be glad someone else "paid" for your visit... And so to the person who started this post: you are saying that we should deny life to a person (bum) who might have made a few mistakes in life? That sir makes u a murderer! Healthcare is a right to everyone and not a privilge! If u r going to post here... Please get your facts straight...

PS: I live in Toronto but I was so happy to see the protests in ottawa... Her speech was cancelled due to security threats!

Ann coulter is a blonde republican puppet bimbo... Much like her counterpart... Sarah palin who enjoyed our healthcare more than once!

 

[evanrick]

well its easy to single out healthcare, you should also single out everything else taxes pay for such as roads and police.

 

[wastingmymind]

Why should I, a hard-working citizen who pays his taxes and is able to hold his own job, have to pay for someone else's care?

Why should you, a hard working citizen who pays his taxes and is able to hold his own job, have to pay for your own son's naturopathic doctor due to his pre-existing condition? He's eight years old, he can work for his own insurance plan.

The fact that a country used to treat 32 million of its citizens like shit is astounding to me.