Alternate view of Columbus Day

[fabulouslyghetto]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

Who said he was a liar? Who said he was a rapist? Who said he was a murder? Why shouldn't we believe what he wrote?

Because he said that the natives were honorable and kind people means there's no way he could have enslaved and stole from them?

We're two pages in and NOBODY is bothered by his actions. Very telling. Very damning as well, and shocker, it's the same "non-racist" guys who never have two kind words to say about people of color anyway. Doing these weird mental somersaults to make what Columbus did ok.

I get ignoring the slavery and genocide, ethnic cleansing and slavery of brown people has been an integral part of American culture since day one, but to actually know that this man sold children as sex slaves and still double down on the support shows just how celebrated racism is in America. And for what? What did he accomplish? He didn't even set foot in North America. It's worth noting, nobody's even going into specifics on what exactly Columbus achieved, then again they can't, because history and facts just don't support it aside from the cutesy songs they sang in elementary school about him. Somehow, in my head, I imagined this going way differently. I knew that people were ignorant about Columbus cuz, hey, American schools, but to present them with this information and have it dismissed as irrelevant or inconsequential is absolutely mind-boggling.

He had slaves.

Who cares?

He tortured and hunted people.

Yeah, well I stole a pack of skittles when I was 7, we've all got blood on our hands.

He sold children into sex slavery.

But... 'Murrica.

that this is even attempting to masquerade itself as intelligible discourse is as hilarious as it is pathetic.

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

I don't understand the desperate need to celebrate him or make excuses for him. It probably goes back to some rhyme we learned in elementary school...and our pitiful need for Eurocentric validation.

You answered your own question.

Some days it's really fucking hard for me to preach racial unity to my brown friends, this is why, here we have a bunch of guys praising a murderous lunatic and the slightest acknowledgment of his ACTUAL history vs the imagined one is some sort of "attack on whiteness." And of course, all the usual suspects are showing up and telling on themselves. This thread could serve as a case study for white supremacy and racial insecurity. "You can't criticize a white guy cuz you can't cuz I said you can't cuz you can't." Yeah, how dare I challenge the celebration of a man who used 9 year old girls as currency. What was I thinking? I mean, I've got that unpaid parking ticket from a few years ago I'm totally a hypocrite.

 

[peeonme]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

See, a few of us are smart enough not to judge people of history by today's standards, but we're also smart enough to not make those people false heros, and saints. We can see their accomplishments but we can also see their faults. Both should be taught equally.

The reason that we still have a Columbus day is because federal employees don't want to give up a holiday. I never saw him as any type of hero or saint. Neither did he discover North America. Most people see history as they want. Truth went out of the window some time ago.

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

I have no problem acknowledging Columbus ....

I'm only going to say this once, and if you tell anyone I said it I'll tell them you're a dirty liar..... You have no problem acknowledging him because you're miles smarter than many of your peers, and immeasurably more sensible and thoughtful. I myself don't mind DISCUSSING him, but this need to exalt him as some sort of hero and crying whenever anyone intercepts that narrative with, ya know, the truth, is confusing and frankly disturbing.

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

The reason that we still have a Columbus day is because federal employees don't want to give up a holiday. I never saw him as any type of hero or saint. Neither did he discover North America. Most people see history as they want. Truth went out of the window some time ago.

Nope. The truth is right here, being ignored because it's inconvenient to this white savior/hero complex. The irony of someone dismissing heinous acts against people of color talking about "the truth." So far Columbus' cheerleaders in this thread haven't SAID one true thing about him. Numerous attempts have been made to at least figure out what exactly he accomplished. Nothing.

This is live, in living color, a result of identity politics and white supremacy in American education. I remember distinctly singing "Columbus sailed the ocean blue in fourteen-hundred" blah blah blah. A child. Singing songs. About a sexual predator. Amazing how all these violent noble heroes in the history books are white. All. Of. Them. Martin Luther King devoted his life to preaching peace and he was considered a domestic terrorist.

So.... just so we're clear

black pacifist: domestic terrorist
italian conquistador: hero

maybe, juuuuuuuust maybe, I'm not being a "sjw," maybe you're so sensitive about your whiteness that it causes you to leap into defense mode the moment a brown person levies criticism, no matter how legitimate, at a white person. I'm not complaining that Columbus accidentally bleached my colored clothes, or used too much salt in his pot roast, the things he did were some of the darkest, most sinister actions in recorded history-- and again, no it's not ok just cuz "other people did it" or "It was ok at the time." It wasn't ok, and he almost went to prison for it. Of course none of this TRUTH matters when you blindly praise a white guy for... being white.

 

[Kahaih]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

Well of course he lied about his accomplishments/findings when he went home. It would have been the only way he could ever have shown his face again.

His mission, what he was paid to do, was to find an easier route to silk and spices. He failed miserably.

He had to have been like an unsavory real estate agent trying to justify an unearned commission.

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

Well of course he lied about his accomplishments/findings when he went home. It would have been the only way he could ever have shown his face again.

His mission, what he was paid to do, was to find an easier route to silk and spices. He failed miserably.

He had to have been like an unsavory real estate agent trying to justify an unearned commission.

Finally some truth in this barren wasteland of a topic.

 

[peeonme]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

Nope. The truth is right here, being ignored because it's inconvenient to this white savior/hero complex. The irony of someone dismissing heinous acts against people of color talking about "the truth." So far Columbus' cheerleaders in this thread haven't SAID one true thing about him. Numerous attempts have been made to at least figure out what exactly he accomplished. Nothing.

This is live, in living color, a result of identity politics and white supremacy in American education. I remember distinctly singing "Columbus sailed the ocean blue in fourteen-hundred" blah blah blah. A child. Singing songs. About a sexual predator. Amazing how all these violent noble heroes in the history books are white. All. Of. Them. Martin Luther King devoted his life to preaching peace and he was considered a domestic terrorist.

So.... just so we're clear

black pacifist: domestic terrorist
italian conquistador: hero

maybe, juuuuuuuust maybe, I'm not being a "sjw," maybe you're so sensitive about your whiteness that it causes you to leap into defense mode the moment a brown person levies criticism, no matter how legitimate, at a white person. I'm not complaining that Columbus accidentally bleached my colored clothes, or used too much salt in his pot roast, the things he did were some of the darkest, most sinister actions in recorded history-- and again, no it's not ok just cuz "other people did it" or "It was ok at the time." It wasn't ok, and he almost went to prison for it. Of course none of this TRUTH matters when you blindly praise a white guy for... being white.

It always goes back to black and white, get over it.

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

It always goes back to black and white, get over it.

Your hero was a pathetic human being undeserving of life. Get over it.

Sometimes white people do bad shit. Get over it.

It's not 1945 black people are allowed to criticize American culture. Get over it.

Nobody is attacking you or your whiteness. Get over it.

White American history isn't all pretty sunshine and rainbows. Get over it.

This country was founded on thievery and genocide. Get over it.

We KNOW what a different song you'd be singing if the racial dynamics were reversed. Get over it.

 

[peeonme]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

That's exactly what's happening in this thread. Some guys with paper-thin feelings about their heritage are trying to prove that a murderous sexual predator was a hero. And. Not. One. Of. You. Has. Acknowledged. Him. Selling. Chidren. Into. Sex. Slavery.

 

[Alistair]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

That goes for you as well. Maybe even more so.

 

[Alistair]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

You're welcome. It's most disturbing wondering if the people gushing over him knew about it, but besides the point even if they didn't know, they know now and are still full steam ahead with this silly nonsense. Typical smug American stubbornness.

"I ain't not gone let them tharr facts mess up mah 'Lumbus holiday."

Right? Show them the truth and you're throwing shit at the wall.

We have to have an excuse to go buy white sheets and towels at the Columbus day sale. Mattresses too.

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

Right? Show them the truth and you're throwing shit at the wall.

We have to have an excuse to go by white sheets and towels at the Columbus day sale. Mattresses too.

Judging by the environment in this thread, they might be sold out of white sheets.

I'm wondering if they're going to acknowledging the child sex trafficking by page 3. Maybe page 4?

 

[peeonme]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

That goes for you as well. Maybe even more so.

Who do I throw shit at? Do I indict a whole group of people over the actions of a few?

 

[Latimer]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

Ah, there it is, "Where would you colored folks be if the white man hadn't saved you from your mud huts?" So I was right. This IS a white saviorism thread.

That's one way of putting it. Exaggerated, but--in essence--yes. The attack on Columbus is not so much an attack on the man, but an attack on Western civilization.

And my response isn't racism, it's reality. Where would any of us be without the legacy and achievements of white European civilization?

 

[belamyi]

Re: Happy Columbus Day!!

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

Who do I throw shit at? Do I indict a whole group of people over the actions of a few?

What thread are you reading? Nobody's indicting every white person that ever existed pre- and post-Columbus, we're talking about one specific man, the indictments against wypipo exist only in your fraught imagination.

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

Re: Columbus Day, the history, the people, the fuss, and whatever it all means

That's one way of putting it. Exaggerated, but--in essence--yes. The attack on Columbus is not so much an attack on the man, but an attack on Western civilization.

Attack on Western civilization? And how disgusting of you to suggest that this man did a favor for people he enslaved and tortured. That is bonafide, tried-and-true, racism. "Slavery and child sex prostitution is better than they would've been if he hadn't intervened." Racist. As fuck.

And my response isn't racism, it's reality.

You're talking about reality.... as you make a man who sold brown children as sex slaves some icon for western culture? Were you unaware of this, or do you just not care?

Where would any of us be without the legacy and achievements of white European civilization?

So as rareboy said, this IS just a desperate, pathetic need for euro validation. I must say your choice of posterboy is quite manic, a man who sold sex slaves is your hero for white saviorism?

This is not normal. It's not healthy. It's like these 14 year olds who fan out for Chris Brown even though he beat up Rihanna. They make excuses, they deny, they blame her. except it's not teenage girls, it's grown ass men, and instead of beating a pop star he orchestrated the slaughter, torture and sex trafficking of thousands of indigenous peoples. As a "gift." From the western world. This man was a fucking terrorist so you don't get to play your "Oh yall just bein mean cuz he be white" card. Not this time.

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

Re: Happy Columbus Day!!

di porque estas dando los gringos una otra razon para jugar al superheroe con sus terroristas?