Could you be friends with someone who opposed gay marriage?

[terry751]

Carey, Diamondskin isn't any more zealot than anybody else here on the board. Then again, I don't think he needs me to defend him.

 

[terry751]

As I posted earlier, sometimes a person's silence is their answer.

 

[DiamondSkin]

As I posted earlier, sometimes a person's silence is their answer.

Exactly.

When they came for the Jews, I did nothing, for I am not a Jew.

When they came for the Socialists, I did nothing, for I am not a Socialist.

When they came for the labor leaders, the homosexuals, the gypsies, I did nothing, for I am none of these,

And when they came for me, I was alone, there was no one to stand up for me. --

Martin Niemoller, a Lutheran pastor from Nazi Germany

 

[terry751]

Not to get off the topic but I remember debating with that same co-worker about the effects of religion on the world. I asked him why didn't the Catholic church say anything about the persecution of the Jews. He didn't answer; he just scoffed. I then asked him does he think the Holocaust really happened. He just looked at me and didn't say anything. That, my friends, is extremely scary.

 

[NineOfClubs]

While I'm a supporter of gay marriage, I'm not enthusiastic about it.

If we get it, we will no longer be allowed to declare bankruptcy without dragging our partners into the mess. Or vice versa. And no matter how frugal we are, our partner's spending habits can be our own ruin too.

Not to mention all the messy divorces and grabs for wealth.

Anyway, I'll be your friend no matter what your opinion on this topic is.....

 

[fetaby]

Hardly. The equivalent would be if they were out there with picket signs or doing something to actively try to STOP gay marriage from happening. Someone simply having a position that collides with yours does not equate being pelted with a rock. A friend merely not agreeing with the concept of gay marriage isn't the same as gay bashing.

The rock is not what is important, it's the mindset that is. To discount our rights is very much akin to saying we are not human. What makes the straights any better than us that they get rights and we don't? Percentages. that's all.

If a person is allowed to view another person as something less than equal, they are then afforded the ability to run with it. The whole idea perpetuates homophobia. And you may not be the one hit with the rock, but until we have acceptance, or even tolerance at this point, do not assume those rocks are not being thrown.

It must be nice to feel all warm and fuzzy when someone is petting you, like a dog. That is what a friend who opposes gay marriage would be to me. A person patting a dog on the head.

Heston said it best, Damn you dirty apes. I am not an animal.

And good to see you back DIamondSkin.

 

[fetaby]

Your plight for equal rights is your struggle. Don't demand other people (BTW, I'm actually FOR gay marriage, I was playing devils advocate earlier) to join in the battle. If they want to, great. If they don't, then that is their choice. For you to say that someone who has reservations about same sex marriage being legal but is cordial enough to leave the box blank to not hinder the cause is in line with the people who vote YES is way overboard. In your mind only ONE option (yours) is acceptable. This goes beyond gay marriage. This is about DiamondSkin having a fascist mentality. I bet if someone did disagree with you about flavored ice cream, or whether or not a movie was good, you'd throw a fit about that too and not hear their side.

It's quit easy to believe you are invited to the same table..

Try applying for the tax credits though.

It's all about the numbers, and the fact of the matter is, we are too unorganized and ramshackle. We need people like Diamondskin. It is gonna be people like him who get you your rights.

So not only will I support him throwing a fit, I'll even raise a lil hell myself.

I may not have been able to enjoy the main course at the adults table, but I sure in the hell will have my just desserts...

Thank you. thank you.

 

[fetaby]

While I'm a supporter of gay marriage, I'm not enthusiastic about it.

If we get it, we will no longer be allowed to declare bankruptcy without dragging our partners into the mess. Or vice versa. And no matter how frugal we are, our partner's spending habits can be our own ruin too.

Not to mention all the messy divorces and grabs for wealth.

Anyway, I'll be your friend no matter what your opinion on this topic is.....

I would rather focus on the benefits of the arrangement rather than the reflections of poor judgement chosen by others.

Your putting the cart way ahead of the horse, at this point why fear a divorce that isn't possible. That's a logic fail.

 

[terry751]

In all fairness Carey does have a good point about not forcing people into battles they don't understand. I do believe that by showing how complacency can affect a movement we can gain more supporters.

 

[NineOfClubs]

I would rather focus on the benefits of the arrangement rather than the reflections of poor judgement chosen by others.

Your putting the cart way ahead of the horse, at this point why fear a divorce that isn't possible. That's a logic fail.

Since half, or more, of straight marriages end in divorce, I think it's fair to think that 50% of gay unions or, more probably, many more will end up in the courts.

Lawyers are salivating at the prospect of all the gay splits...

 

[terry751]

I always found it amusing that prop 8 supporters rarely mention the divorce rate among straights. That's why I was so upset at the Dr. Phil episode about the topic. Phil never, I mean NEVER, brought up the simple question to prop 8 supporters: how does a gay marriage affect your personal relationship? Answer: it doesn't. Of course, I think it's fair to say that we already know how Dr. Phil felt about the gay marriage issue. In his case, however, his actions speak louder than his silence.

 

[NineOfClubs]

My personal prediction is that the "gay" divorce rate may exceed the "straight" rate.

But it will be very close.....

The gays may even see the straights win this one.

 

[fetaby]

In all fairness Carey does have a good point about not forcing people into battles they don't understand. I do believe that by showing how complacency can affect a movement we can gain more supporters.

Not really. Individual culpability.. Do you have time to raise a bunch of lil chicky babies?
Carey's stance is not one of complacency, it's one of denial. It appears he denies the fact that we do have a legitimate issue. By hiding behind a false label of patriotic bravado. If you're one of us. You'se one of us. The end. Game over..

And if you can't accept that, help is available.

 

[fetaby]

Since half, or more, of straight marriages end in divorce, I think it's fair to think that 50% of gay unions or, more probably, many more will end up in the courts.

Lawyers are salivating at the prospect of all the gay splits...

Hmm that's a notion... suppose gay's get married..
suppose they get divorced...
at the rate some fuck, and then fuck each other over..
the lawyers are standing on a gold mine..
Well, noc, time to go to back to school and become a lawyer...

I think it amiss to assume any thing. I don't think like a straight person. I don't love like a straight person.. What makes you think my marriage would end like the majority of straight people?

Just askin. In this day and age of cragslist cocksuckin I can completely understand your hesitancy.

Do you not feel an impending gay renaissance? Just askin. I do. I hope I'm alive long enough to see it all through... Great Days.

 

[terry751]

fetaby, don't get me wrong; I don't agree with the majority of Carey's postings but I was just observing that people who aren't LBGT don't completely understand our perspectives and find it difficult to sympathize with us. Still, I don't believe that laying motionless and waiting for their sympathy is the answer so I believe in acting up if and when the situation calls for it.

 

[terry751]

I have to go to bed. I have to take the car in tomorrow and pay a heft load of bills. Good night!

 

[NineOfClubs]

^Whatever.

And, just what has given you any glimmer of hope that gays will be more loyal, and true, and everlasting, in their romantic connections than straights?

We're the same, at best, or even worse......

 

[fetaby]

terry, don't get me wrong I don't really foam at the mouth...

I was just pointing out that if a person identifies as gay, as the majority of people here do, I see it as a major conflict of interest for them to propagate homophobic attitudes.

I don't like getting beat up, ok? And quite frankly I'm beginning to think if people do, they need to take that shit over to the kink subforum..

 

[boxerdudeuk]

priceless.

telling people that they're intolerant for not being on the side of gay marriage - and then if they don't support it - casting them aside.

sounds pretty tolerant to me.

 

[boxerdudeuk]

It's not a 'belief'. It's prejudice.

Our belief is equality. Their 'belief' is discrimination.

We cannot accept or tolerate prejudice or intolerance.

bullshit. it's their belief. their beliefs lead them to not support gay marriage.

respect of one's beliefs is a two way street. don't expect anyone to support yours if you're not willing to recognize and respect anyone else's but your own.