Hide the 'niggers!'

[Críostóir]

My opinions do carry a bit of what I consider "morality". I think we all have that. I am not about ready to drink the kool aid or throw everything out the window just to adhere to anyone's level of open-mindedness. I don't follow a specific herd.

Bravo for you! People on the right don't understand that people on the left aren't as monolithic as they are.

 

[ShihTzuTylenol]

OHM'GAWD! two hundred some odd posts over night? I half ass expect Billboard magazine to issue this thread a bullet!

oh shit, I see bickering below me.
am I going to have to separate you brats? brats....oooo a bratwurst sounds good right now.......
but hey,
don't make me turn this damn thread around or I'll fucking blister your fucking asses!!

 

[SLOPPYSECONDS]

Bravo for you! People on the right don't understand that people on the left aren't as monolithic as they are.

yeah lot monolitihics about ans centurys old ans sureeeeeee hurt whens theys hit ya

 

[ShihTzuTylenol]

I don't follow a specific herd.

that's a good thing really, because herds leave behind an incredible amount of shit piles you'd be stepping in...



have you heard this credo before?
Lead, follow, or get out of my way!

and these carpool rules?
Get in, shut up and hang on!

or a variation...
We're going into the ditch! -- Hang on, take my beer and WATCH THIS SHIT!



those are all cute but I think my personal credo for following the leader would be;
Leaders get lost/ Followers fall behind/ Friends keep together

 

[Kulindahr]

A small amount of amusement. Regarding this, Neil Gaiman tweeted earlier today:



... which, of course, has now resulted in #KlingonHuck

Making Big Jim a Klingon would be more honest than making him out just a slave. A slave got nobody, not family, not people, but a Klingon, he's got people, some he can be mighty proud of, some everyone looks down on and all. It's not the same as being a Nigger, but it's closer than being a slave.

 

[Kulindahr]

I'm just as confused, elvin.



So...should Huck Finn be allowed in schools?

Absolutely not.

Neither should the dictionary, the Encyclopedia Brittanica, most history books....




OMG! We can't let black people into schools, either -- they use the word all the time!

 

[Kulindahr]

The problem with Huck Finn is that it's not a book for children. Huck is a kid, to be sure, but he's an objectivity-through-innocence narrator. Many of the events in the story are absolutely horrific. Just because a book is ABOUT kids doesn't mean it's FOR kids.

I don't think this book should be taught prior to high school at the earliest. I think high school students can handle the N word without thinking it's acceptable in modern society.

Depends where you are. In the rural school where I did student teaching, I would have had no hesitation giving this to seventh graders: they already all knew about sudden death, people having to get their guns out to protect themselves, etc., while in the school where I helped in Fort Wayne, I'm not sure I wouldn't have wanted to hold it off till tenth.

Where kids are sheltered (and thus made less ready to really face life, generally), it belongs much later than where kids run into the brutal conditions of life.

 

[ShihTzuTylenol]

It's because you're so dependable.

you and elvin fight like brother and sister!
just sayin'








Think about the irony here;
The new and improved Huck Finn has an amazingly powerful symbolism inherently attached to it by default -- it's actually a place [once again] where no "niggers" are allowed!



Funny how irony works, huh?
It's truly a sad day for all sides of this debate, no matter what your position is here.

The new issue of Art In America has a piece about how the new incoming Republican agenda will censor 21 years of same sex tolerances in museums like the Smithsonian, The Phillips Collection and the National Gallery....
TWENTY ONE MOTHER FUCKING YEARS! erased because they want to extinguish the fiery spirits of people they consider beneath them.

For a crowd that talks about less government these fucking bastards sure like to pile their plates with junk food! when will they concentrate on jobs and infrastructural integrity? after they stamp out the homosexual threat?

Prediction! the next Civil War won't be racial or even about sexual orientation...it will be the starving masses trying to get food from a small percentage of wealthy money hungry paranoid groups held up in fortresses surrounded by the soldiers they have on the payroll! Skinhead mercenaries and KKK remnants that just want to shoot somebody...ANYBODY! These folks are angry and they are too stupid to know why they are angry, so they cling to cliches that are fed them!

Class war! They have no class, so what are we waiting for boys?
Let's KICK THEIR FUCKING ASSES BEFORE IT GOES TOO FAR!!

vote
that's how we can win...so don't light your torch yet just
VOTE!

 

[Ninja108]

My take on it is this...those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.
We can't learn about the darkness of our past by censoring it.

 

[belamyi]

My opinions do carry a bit of what I consider "morality". I think we all have that. I am not about ready to drink the kool aid or throw everything out the window just to adhere to anyone's level of open-mindedness. I don't follow a specific herd.

The very fact that you didn't understand what I said only gives more proof of what I said: I didn't mean that you coincide directly with views of the Reps, but that the way you support the more specifically "liberal" views, indirectly and unawarely give strength to the views you theoretically oppose.
Capisci now or shall I dumb it down until it makes no sense so that you can find some sense in it?

 

[Lefty]

bastardization because of pronunciation
originally, niger which is a latin term meaning black.

Also an extenuation of the Spanish/Portugese word negro.

Etymology is from the Greek, study of words.

My research finds other terms offensive at at the least,

TITillating ..

These words are in need of removal, replacement also.....

Cock, crank, pussy, crank, boob, intercourse, tit, bastard....

well,

did we smart it up enough for you belicose barcelonian boner

dick head of the spic 'n' span regime? Or do we need to COME

down a bit and not be so hard on the topic?


(Elvie, that is still the best pic you show)

 

[fetaby]

Because it opens up other avenues for homophobia and racism. It is not going to be the same in Alabama than it will be in Manhattan.

How? I could agree with this stance if the words are just thrown out there and stood alone, with nothing but today's definitions and stereotypes around it.

But how does this view relate to it being included in Huck Finn? A noted anti-racist book. Also with today's PC climate, and teachers in this thread, that have said they have prefaced the teaching of the book with discussion of what is appropriate?

 

[belamyi]

Intellectual snobbery is quite a turn off.

I never vehemently took on a concrete position either way.

I simply stated that in theory and ideally I believe words like nigger or faggot should not be taught to children in school. Why? Because it opens up other avenues for homophobia and racism. It is not going to be the same in Alabama than it will be in Manhattan. Any idiot can see that. In my theory I took that into consideration.

I also don't support underaged drinking or some sexual fetishes. Do they make me less democratic or liberal?

I simply weighed both options and came up with my ideal or conclusion as to the situation. I believe we all do that.

If you see contradictions then most likely you're reading way too much into it.

Like I said, I don't believe in censorship. How about we call it "delaying"? Much like we don't believe that 5 year olds should be taught about certain sexual practices or how to make bombs.

In life some things don't fall into either black or white, but in gray areas.

No need to dumb anything down. This conversation is dumb enough as is.

What opens up avenues for homophobia, racism and what not is to let kids stay in a moral limbo totally disconnected from reality until they are too old to learn what is right and they will just side with what is given to them by those who start young in being taught to shoot and hate this and that.
Again you are showing how you are "opening up avenues" and strengthening fundamentalist haters by your prudish (liberal? grey?) "delaying". Have you ever considered the possibility that it's not that "I'm reading too much" but rather that others are not "reading" enough?
But you can be comforted by the fact that most people, if not everyone except some queer belamy, do exactly what you propose, because it is harder to deal with reality and the complexity of a world of shades of grey and all the other colors, in which truth doesn't prevail by itself and enlightens everybody's "heart and mind"... and whatever people do is right even if it is screwing themselves, and all who propose anything different are just snobbish intellectuals who can't dress well... that's truly snobbish, the snobism of the masses who will end up like all proud and aristocratic snobs of the past despising what they considered laughable snobs.

 

[Lefty]

Wow Elvin.....

I guess bellamy named that tune and sang your song.

Lyrics seemed a bit queer but they came through the

translational transition well, very well.

My spanish/english dictionary doesn't show

Belamo as an acronym or synonym for political double

speak........maybe I need to make a trip to Barnes and Noble.

Fudge, I hate to feel educationally impoverished, a...a...a...

redneck in the woodpile so to speak.

 

[Lefty]

Elvin my old buddy,

Bellamo was windy and wordy and full of his usual.

Hate to admit it but young Matt nailed his point,

salient and succinct.

Damn him.

 

[belamyi]

Oh, Lefty, elv's "opinions" and arguments are such a mess of hollows and incoherences that merely pointing at one may seem to suffice but in fact it will be useless... he's agaisnt... but then sometimes... and he is against "some sexual fetishes"... I guess sodomy qualifies as such, not of course, for his liberal mind, but again to those who use the same logic of "killing but just a little bit"...

for such people the "shades of grey" are just black and white in contrasting white and black contexts: it's the sort of people who believe that black-and-white ideas are shaded and made grey, less violent by saying them nicely... the rogues do it in full hypocritical awareness and the elvs just side with them without having any idea of what they are actually doing... only because they appear nicer and they "ideally" and "theoretically" (talk about cheap, candid intellectual snobism) are against censure but with some censure... they do have the sense that "they world is grey" but all they can elaborate is regurgitated incoherent contradictions, and going beyond them is "reading too much" and being an "intellectual snob".

In short, and somewhat "dumbing it down":+++=

 

[Lefty]

OMG.........

What hath God wrought

Belleramo speechless?

Forced to be an inarticulate rendeder

of graven images rather than viscous verbosity.

Tsk, tsk...



gods blood,a viscid wicket EH?

 

[frankfrank]

Getting rid of the word is a way of whitewashing ("pun" intended) history.

Leaving the word in the novel usually leads to discussion, in classrooms and elsewhere, about the inappropriateness of the word, and how things have changed since the book was written. Those days cannot, must not, return.

I felt entirely the same way a few years ago when the NAACP briefly talked about changing what their acronym stands for - revised names such as the "National African-American Coalition for Progress" were suggested.

Yes, that name sounds ABSOLUTELY GREAT, but keeping it as "...Colored..." is a reminder of the history that we must not return to, as well. Yes, if the organization was formed only two years ago instead of 102 years ago, I'd think "Wow what a great name!"

Removing reminders of past history helps to make it possible that the same thing can happen again. The extreme of this is exemplified by the "HOLOCAUST DENIERS" who I believe, in general, hope that the Holocaust will be forgotten, and "HOPEFULLY" (FROM THEIR POINT OF VIEW) it will happen again.

"Those who forget history, are doomed to repeat it."

 

[belamyi]

And yet here you are engaging me. I guess I have something going.

Yeah, what is going is that you are a believer... your beliefs make no sense whenever you try to elaborate arguments supporting them, because having not been derived from reasoning, all you can do is try to make reason fit what you already believe... of course you are not a priestly Catholic of the Middle Ages, so there's no way you would be doing the exact same thing with the same fucked up result under a different name and with opposite aspirations...
as long as you walk so happily and confidently and with good intentions, why caring about what is actually paving the way you are treading, and where it is leading.

 

[Lefty]

Bellyacheamo,

Back filling posts...i.e. #242. is a rather pollo con guavo (i know thats not

right but chicken shit just looked so tacky) way to distort or amplify your

position on an issue or opinion of a post/poster.


El Sinestro