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Hillary Clinton now seen as 'Risky Gamble' for Democrats [MERGED]

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evanrick

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Yes you can blame a lot of Hillary's negatives on republican attacks and character flaws which could be argued are not a good way to judge how good a president will be.

But in the eyes of millions of voters they will not make such nuanced decisions when they go to vote.

At the risk of sounding like a broken record, its become evident that Clinton would be a huge gamble against a candidate like Trump who is wholly unconventional.
You could say that the negatives will cancel each other out and Hillary could prevail, but we have already witnessed Trumps dominance of the media over the Clinton's and that was before even a single primary vote was cast.

https://theintercept.com/2016/02/24...ability-gamble-by-nominating-hillary-clinton/
 
Re: Hillary Clinton now seen as 'Risky Gamble' for Democrats

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Re: Hillary Clinton now seen as 'Risky Gamble' for Democrats

I read that piece - not sure of the logic frankly

Bernie does poll better vs. Trump than Hillary - that is currently true

But just as the Hillary side narrative of Bernie will be painted a socialist by Repubs and get beaten in general - I don't buy

I don't buy this

Bernie vs. Hillary - may the best person win - and then beat the Repubs
 
Re: Hillary Clinton now seen as 'Risky Gamble' for Democrats

BenDan said:
Bernie does poll better vs. Trump than Hillary - that is currently true

may the best person win - and then beat the Repubs
Click to expand...
The most important word is large and bold..."right now" is before the Kochsuckers get $900 million lavished on them, and Trump taps his own similar amount, etc. The Republicans (and for that matter the Democrats) have pretty much gotten a free ride through the media all this time...and the exceptions (such as Jeb! putting up around $100 million in media buying) have been so feeble compared to all the other coverage, so far, that it's hardly been noticed.

I mean, WHERE did Jeb spend that $100 million? I'm not sure if I remember ever seeing more than maybe two airings of Jeb ads???

Indeed, may the best person win...are the young going to just sit home and not care, and pull the level and flush the United States down the toilet? God I sure hope now.
 
Re: Hillary Clinton now seen as 'Risky Gamble' for Democrats

Look, I'm not in agreement with everything Bernie's for, but we do need a voice like his to be heard. No one else stepped up. Bernie in truth has his work cut out for him. However phony Hilary is, and god yes she is.... she's ethically challenged, disingenuous, a hypocrite, and would never be within a light year of where she is had not she attached her fortunes to Bill Clinton and married him, no self made feminist at all... Bernie lost tonight decisively in South Carolina. He needs a strong showing... I mean a few upset wins and close battles. on Tuesday. I sympathize with evanrick's support of Bernie and disdain for Hillary, but save that it just won't matter. Hillary is too strong, and polls saying Bernie could whoop Trump are nice but I bet you can post about other ones showing the complete opposite. And even if the poll was true, it doesn't seem to matter. Does Hillary deserve overwhelming black support? I can't think why.. because Bill appropriated himself as the first "black" president, lol? Because he goes on Arsenio back in the 90's and plays a cool sax? She has it nonetheless... and it's depressing, but the facts as currently constructed don't support any other conclusion. If she's the nominee, DO the young stay away from the ballot box in November and give us President Trump? Or Cruz? Or Rubio?

Basically, this cycle of insider dominance has to end and can only end when you have people who vote who will not merely settle for two evils(or one evil and one not so good but could be worse). Anyone who really supports Hillary out of merit, I would severely question their judgement... yeah she's no less capable than anyone out there now, she has been a Senator and Secretary of State. But deserving? Truly deserving of her dominant position? absolutely NOT. I live in a state(New Jersey) that votes blue... in November only if the margin is so close EVERY vote really did count, would I most disgustedly and reluctantly hit the button for Hillary but I'll vote Jill Stein(Green Party)most likely. I could not turn the executive branch over to the worst generation of political "leadership" in GOP history though under any circumstances. It's a conundrum though... Hillary is better but only by degree. She'll always be the insider and look at how the path to the nomination was intended to be paved by her lackey DNC chairperson Debbie Schultz-Wassermann to ensure a coronation, not a battle. Only because Bernie resonated as a folk hero of many do we even get a battle of ideas... only because he challenged her and not deferred do we even have a semblance of a race.

Right now, I'm so downcast about our future as a country. A GOP completely unhinged, a Democratic establishment not really willing to make the crucial reforms needed to set this country truly back on the right track. We're not doing great yet, no matter how much the economy has seemingly improved, and how much lower the jobless rate is. I'm concerned about how brittle things really are... how any downturn, whether under a Democratic or Republican administration, will be the straw that broke the camel's back and set this nation into an ugly spiral that will be incredibly difficult to get out of.
 
The interesting thing about this argument is that it calls for increased polarisation, where in the past both sides competed to claim the middle ground.
 
Re: Hillary Clinton now seen as 'Risky Gamble' for Democrats

Sanders

“I think Snowden played a very important role in educating the American public. I think there should be a penalty to that, but I think that education should be taken into consideration before the sentencing.”
 
Re: Hillary Clinton now seen as 'Risky Gamble' for Democrats

opinterph said:
Sanders

“I think Snowden played a very important role in educating the American public. I think there should be a penalty to that, but I think that education should be taken into consideration before the sentencing.”
Click to expand...

I don't really know where you are going with that, but can we get all of these Hilary bashing treads consolidated?
 
Re: Hillary Clinton now seen as 'Risky Gamble' for Democrats

frankfrank said:
are the young going to just sit home and not care, and pull the level and flush the United States down the toilet?
Click to expand...
NOT CLEAR, and a typo:

Are the young going to just sit home and not care, and instead pull the lever AT HOME and flush the United States down the toilet?
 
Re: Hillary Clinton now seen as 'Risky Gamble' for Democrats

Any gay person that does not vote fro who ever wins the Democratic Convention is a fool. Do not write in a candidate we will then have Trump!
 
Re: Hillary Clinton now seen as 'Risky Gamble' for Democrats

opinterph said:
Sanders

“I think Snowden played a very important role in educating the American public. I think there should be a penalty to that, but I think that education should be taken into consideration before the sentencing.”
Click to expand...
If it weren't for Snowden, we would NOT know about the mass spying by the NSA. If people aren't concerned about the spying, we might just as well become a full fascist state.
 
Re: Hillary Clinton now seen as 'Risky Gamble' for Democrats

TX-Beau said:
I don't really know where you are going with that, but can we get all of these Hilary bashing treads consolidated?
Click to expand...

I honestly agree. It is getting a bit much.
 
Re: Hillary Clinton now seen as 'Risky Gamble' for Democrats

I don't suppose any of you ran across this. I did when Hillary ran in '08. If you want the nuts and bolts, Google "The Family" and put Jeff Sharlet's name in the search box too.

Hillary's Prayer: Hillary Clinton's Religion and Politics
For 15 years, Hillary Clinton has been part of a secretive religious group that seeks to bring Jesus back to Capitol Hill. Is she triangulating; or living her faith?

It was an elegant example of the Clinton style, a rhetorical maneuver subtle, bold, and banal all at once. During a Democratic candidate forum in June, hosted by the liberal evangelical group Sojourners, Hillary Clinton fielded a softball query about Bill's infidelity: How had her faith gotten her through the Lewinsky scandal?

After a glancing shot at Republican "pharisees," Clinton explained that, of course, her "very serious" grounding in faith had helped her weather the affair. But she had also relied on the "extended faith family" that came to her aid, "people whom I knew who were literally praying for me in prayer chains, who were prayer warriors for me."
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Mother Jones

'Family': Fundamentalism, Friends In High Places
In the book The Family: The Secret Fundamentalism at the Heart of American Power, author Jeff Sharlet examines the power wielded by a secretive Christian group known as the Family, or the Fellowship.

Founded in 1935 in opposition to FDR's New Deal, the evangelical group's views on religion and politics are so singular that some other Christian-right organizations consider them heretical.
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NPR
 
evanrick said:
Sanders has twice the edge over Trump vs Clinton. But please, vote Hillary because shes 'experienced'. http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/2016_presidential_race.html Democrats must prepare to vote for a right-wing corporate democrat or a left wing economic populist. http://www.pbs.org/newshour/updates/sanders-backers-have-easy-choice-in-potential-clinton-vs-trump-matchup/
Click to expand...

The only statistics I trust in terms of electability are Nate Silver's. He also has quite a lot to say about misuse and skewing of polling data.
 
Re: Hillary Clinton now seen as 'Risky Gamble' for Democrats

Alnitak said:
That's good news if he wins the nomination :-)
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No. But its also why Hillary never talks about polling, just her 'abstract' and sometimes divisive 'negative' comments and public dislike for republicans. Probably why so many neo-con democrats are attached to the warmonger. Hillary supports a no-fly zone in Syria, Obama and Sanders do not, why doesn't she declare world war 3 and get it over with? We can send her over to the middle east with George Bush and the rest of her crony war allies inside the Clinton Foundation.
 
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