Nifty.org - Pedophilia Central?

[gsdx]

I don't disagree with you, ds. I simply don't agree with not calling the stories at Nifty 'child pornography'. We have very strict laws about that here in Canada, which is why none of it is allowed in the stories at the Story Forum here in JUB. Being a Canadian website, they can get in very serious trouble for allowing the stories which Nifty allows. From Canada's point of view, the stories at Nifty are considered 'child porn' and, therefore, illegal.

I wonder what sort of traffic a site such as nifty gets? And how much to certain catagories? I wonder if they track which particular story or stories get the most hits or traffic?

That would be very easy to keep track of, and would probably reveal some very interesting results. It would also be very easy to test what affect it has on pedophiles. I mean, there's no shortage of them in prisons all over the world. It would be very simple for a number of independent groups to administer the same tests and then compile all their findings.

The test could be as simple as measuring a pedophile's reaction to various stimuli according to a 'rating' system (such as 'On a scale of 1 to 5' ). Then one group is allowed to read the stories at Nifty for a month or so while a control group is not. Re-test the prisoners at the end of the study and measure the differences - if, in fact, there are any.

But then we would be faced with the same old problem. If the tests reveal that they stories actually do put more children at risk and the stories are banned from Nifty, we're back to Censorship and Free Speech.

There may be thousands of writers and thousands of readers, but there are millions of children. Whose rights are more important?

 

[Green_Man_007]

The same old arguments. The same old defenses. I thought we were discussing pedopilia and children, but no-one can seem to get beyond the 'Free Speech'. I want to protect the children. You want to protect Free Speech. This thread was at a stalemate from the very first post, and nothing whatsoever will be gained by me discussing it further.

Which "children," and how far are you willing to go to "protect" them?

Would you join the Peace Corps, to help children in third-world countries from starvation and disease?

How about joining a mission into the isolated coal-mining hollers of West Virginia, to educate children about self worth and lift them out of the generational incest and sexual abuse?

Would you lobby for every child and adult implanted with microchip RF tags for government authorities to locate anyone, at any time?

Or is the answer being armchair warrior trying to put genies back in their bottles?

For me, there are FIVE children I care about --- my nieces and nephews --- and I will go from zeee-ro to "never-ending torrent of a crazy storm" in the blink of an eye, if they're harmed in any way.

Make that half a blink, because I've already worked out a proactive flowchart iof variables n my head. (variables being the perp's daily habits, type of car, and his home security system.)

And "crazy" doesn't mean an intimidating round of bitch slapping.

The culprit will be found dead, half naked, of "apparently accidental" IV drug overdose, beside a dumpster in the vicinity of a gay bar's back door, because "evidently" it was too embarrassing to have "child molester" fliers with his photo littered on the sidewalk around his place of work.

I'm not saying that I personally will actually be connected to such a scenario, nor encourage other nut cases like myself to do the same.

I am merely an innocent person who has a mental flowchart of making people gone in a very humiliating way.

 

[Green_Man_007]

I don't know if you'd need to let "pedophiles in prison" (sounds like a campy and very lurid movie) read the nifty material to see if they have a reaction. I would think a pedophile reading stories involving adults and children would have the suspected response.
.

Actually,

"Inmates confined for sexual offenses, especially those against juvenile victims, are at the bottom of the pecking order and consequentially most often victimized. Because of their crime, the general population justifies using their weakness by labling rape "just punishment" for their crime. Sexual offenders are the number one target group for prisoner rape."
​

http://www.hrw.org/reports/2001/prison/voices.html

 

[gsdx]

Which "children," and how far are you willing to go to "protect" them?

Would you join the Peace Corps, to help children in third-world countries from starvation and disease?

How about joining a mission into the isolated coal-mining hollers of West Virginia, to educate children about self worth and lift them out of the generational incest and sexual abuse?

Would you lobby for every child and adult implanted with microchip RF tags for government authorities to locate anyone, at any time?

Or is the answer being armchair warrior trying to put genies back in their bottles?

You have sooooooo missed the point of this entire discussion. This thread is not about me. It concerns Nifty and our opinions about whether or not the stories are a haven for pedophiles.

 

[1gayguy]

Let me pre face this by saying that I do not condone any type of abuse against children, wether verbal, physical or emotional.
That being said I have to ask, do we have any thing to say that the stories in question on Nifty, cause people to act on what they read? Are we being proactive by saying that the offensive stories be banned because of the potential lapse of reason that they might cause?
I could live without the adult/youth catagory on Nifty. I do enjoy the stories in the high school and young friends sections becuase they bring me back to my own youth and my experimentation with my friends of the same age. The stories in these sections do not make me want to hang out by a school yard or a high school gym. I don't think I'm the exception to this but rather the rule. But then again I have no solid proof to back this up.
I do think that before we go and say that the stories involving children need to be banned or removed we do need to find out if there is a significant threat posed by the the stories. Is there a direct correlation between a reader of those stories and pedophilia tendencies? If so then by all means get rid of them. If not, then it seems that this is a lot of tilting at windmills.

 

[Xavier_Holland]

First of all, I'm only 21 but my view stands on pedophilia being anyone below 16 is no longer conscious of their own sexual deviancy. That being said, anyone who coherently or incoherently abuses and coerces an unaware minor into sexual intercourse or oral activities is WRONG. When I was a LATE teenager I was old enough to understand acts of willingful sexual exchange. I had my first sexual experience @ 12 so I know it is indeed possible to achieve orgasmic conclusion in any sexually affiliated entrancement.
The adult/youth category is always going to be around. Reason being is most of the stories are fabrications of an adult's fantasy he/she themselves had at that age or a pubescent adolesence in which they could picture the actions being committed while they were partcipating. (Whew, long sentence.) I myself, being a college guy. Will definitely say that some of the stories involving teenagers is sexy, my boyfriend in particular happens to be a teenager in his later teens. Does it make me want to flashback time and have sex with someone whose insecure, unsure, and easily susceptible to rape or anything close to it? HELL NO.
Stories involving two children together is weird, but then again it starts with just one idea.

"Kids having sex."

That explains it all right there. Do you want your offspring to experience intimate and sexually engrossing material before they are ready? Because if you remember, I am willing to bet most of us had an experience before we were an adult. But do you remember the risks involved? The emotional undertones recieved from such capacities? Then I suggest it be removed lest you wish the rather painful or disgusting stories to be a part of life today instead of fantasy and involve someone or someone you know.

Kids should not be having sex. Period.~.^

 

[gsdx]

I do think that before we go and say that the stories involving children need to be banned or removed we do need to find out if there is a significant threat posed by the the stories. Is there a direct correlation between a reader of those stories and pedophilia tendencies? If so then by all means get rid of them. If not, then it seems that this is a lot of tilting at windmills.

That was the point of this entire thread. Do these stories pose a significant threat to children?

I have no proof - no statistics - and, frankly, I don't have the time to investigate it and to do the proper research. Those of us against the stories and given many arguments to support our opinions, but the only arguments for the stories seem to be that they are works of fiction with fictional children and, therefore, are protected under Free Speech.

The issue doesn't revolve around murder mysteries, or horror stories, or anything else. The issue revolves around pornography and the safety and protection of children.

Sure, we might be tilting at windmills, but I'd rather be doing the Don Quixote thing than sitting back with my feet up and saying, "It's in the Constitution. Get over it."

Meanwhile, innocent children - real children! - are being abused, raped, and murdered by pedophiles every day. It there's even the slightest chance that the stories at Nifty are boosting those numbers, no matter how slightly, isn't it worth a child's life to do something about them?

 

[mz2005]

But back to the point. There have always been categories on that site that
totally gross me out. (Beastiality comes to mind) I mean, I can't even imagine that people get off reading about that sort of thing, but apparently they do. But, does this mean that they start crusing the humane society looking for a little Lab on Retriever action ? Of course not.

Now, I'm certainly not comparing animals to young children...

I think pedophilia is despicable, but I think beastiality is MUCH worse. Most of those stories on Nifty are about consenting children (like that would ever happen), but animals are victims.

I don't think those "young friends" and "adult youth" stories should be illegal, because they are works of FICTION. If that stuff really happens that is a different story.

 

[rad_vsovereign]

No abuse. Once you stop people from having a fantasy, where will you stop? If someone doesn't like it, just don't go there. I don't believe Nifty is a ped-central. There is a FINE line from thinking about an act to actually commit it.

Really of if you start trying to have stories in Nifty removed or deleted, a WHOLE category, it will create a dangerous precedent. It's a FANTASY. The ones who should be hanged are those pedophiles out there who actually committed the act.

Nifty has done great service to us all. I really don't think that attacking nifty is a good thing. Especially since it is so open & free. Please do not confuse reality with fantasy. When was the last time you guys read a good story at Nifty? Last week, last month, last year? & now you viciously attack the site?

 

[gsdx]

Please do not confuse reality with fantasy.

Please do not confuse Freedom of Speech with promoting child pornography and pedophilia.

 

[luminum]

I think the reason is that the concept of pedophilia is not illegal (because you can't make an idea or depiction of an idea illegal) since there is no physical victim and no actual crime.

You can argue that this kind of stuff encourages pedophilia because it makes it acceptable as a topic in discussion or fantasy, but I think drawing a distinct line between reality and fantasy is important and should fall about where it is now.

In the end, there's no actual crime. It would make stories about killing fictional people illegal if these were illegal. I believe most of the authors of these stories (with egregious violence, brutality, substance abuse, sexual abuse, or pedophilia) all have disclaimers stating that they do not advocate what is happening. They distinguish between reality and fantasy and do not encourage the actions that are depicted, they merely depict them.

I would almost even argue that this is a safe means of drawing the desires of pedophiles away from actual pedophilic actions extending to abusing a child or sending pornography and redirecting them to literature. Of course, the oppostite argument could be made.

 

[Leidian]

I never really thought about this issue before. When I was 12 I used to go on that site all the time because I could read about the things I wish were happening to me. As I got older I steered away from the really young stories to the more HS age stories.

I don't think that erotic stories should only include characters that are over 18, but I don't think it should include little kids who are like 10. As for the line between 10 and 18 - I have no idea. Personal preference I guess. I personally don't want to read about a sixth grader having sex like a 28 year old.

 

[theatreboi]

^That's exactly what i did when i was younger, and now i just don't go into those sections, except for the highschool section every once in a while, just to remenisce.

 

[ok455]

I don't think its a pedophile website its just applying to people with many fetishes. I look it as if you don't like it don't read it. I hate reading incest stories that have the mother and sister and grandmom involved in the sexual act. I think there should be Mods or something in there to clean up the stories some are badly written or that is too nasty. I think the lesbian and animal sections and kiddy stories are nasty. But im not reading it or complaining about it to each its own. Im sure that younger kids probably read the stories that has younger kids situations.

 

[irydion]

I'm glad that this thread shown up. Nifty has a lot of great stories. When it comes to the ones with pre-16 yo (15 or 16-, I don't know, is the legal age in Poland for a person to have sex), I simply ignored them, and if I downloaded first, and read later, deleted them or edited them so that they would show decent age (sometimes the only thing "wrong" are these numbers). But since then, paedophilia became such a discussed topic, and it really is better to be a murderer than to have anything to do with anything that has to do with it, that I decided to quit Nifty altogether, not to see any paedophilic stuff even unwillingly. But I miss stories. I don't know any other page with gay stories that big and varied.

 

[Just_Believe18]

Wow, I can't believe someone dug this thread out of the grave. But hey, the discussion never ends right? Better an old thread than a new one with the same misconceptions.

Well trebor, I read your post and I am humbled by how open you were with your feelings and experiences. You've had a hard life and it's not easy for someone to understand what you went through.

One of your points focused on what defines pedophilia. I would invite you to read this thread where it is discussed extensively: http://www.justusboys.com/forum/showthread.php?t=120239&highlight=foley+is+-a+pedophile

Although I understand your points and feelings, I disagree about Nifty.org serving as an "outlet to fantasies" that will keep child predators from acting on their feelings. There is no proof pornography eliminates the wants and desiries of the individual. In fact, it influences the sex lives of them. When a child predator is usually found, most of the time they also have media and files of child pornography on their computer. Based on your reasoning, why didn't it stop them from acting on their impulses?

 

[reinventedboy]

Gawd i remember reading those stories about N Sync and Backstreet boys lol

 

[Just_Believe18]

Fair enough, trebor. You make a good argument. We'll just have to agree to disagree on some points.

 

[VICTORIADON]

Just curious...how many of you know the history of Nifty and their mission?

 

[Claudio63]

Calling Nifty a pedophilia central is quite an exageration. I posted half-a-dozen stories there some years ago and none were about child abuse. There's plenty of sections I don't care for in nifty. There's one on bestiality which aroused my curiosity at that time, I read a couple, but found they weren't to my taste so I skipped it ever since. I had that choice.