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Private Militia Takes Over Federal Wildlife Sanctuary in Oregon

Bundy's 'sane' looks. I'd guess he has a bad case of Bell's Palsey. If you watch Democracy Now, take a good look at Amy. She has it too, but to a far lesser degree.
 
jbrown329 said:
Bundy's 'sane' looks. I'd guess he has a bad case of Bell's Palsey. If you watch Democracy Now, take a good look at Amy. She has it too, but to a far lesser degree.
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A Ford LTD drove over Ryan Bundy's face when he was a kid.

I don't know the details of the incident.
 
3-arrests-composite_ubzwht.jpg


Three more of the Bundy brain trust.

I guess the batteries must have finally run down.
 
Raw video of the FBI traffic stop where LaVoy Finicum was killed, and 5 others arrested:


The militiamen's vehicle (a white 4-door pickup with a cap) gets stopped in snow while trying to get around an FBI blockade. Finicum exits the vehicle about 9:21 with his arms extended laterally. About 9:29, he seems to move his arms to his waist and is immediately shot by two FBI agents. By 9:33 he is down in the snow.
 
Pickup with a cap? Nah, that's a canopy. Here's a pickup with a cap.

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They damn near took an agent out. No small wonder why they shot him. Plus, reaching down like that wasn't a very bright idea.
 
T-Rexx said:
The dead man is Robert LaVoy Finicum, 55.

Ammon Bundy is claiming Finicum had his hands up and was cooperating with police when he was shot 3x by them. Bundy has also said that Finicum was on the ground when he was shot.

The militiamen were stopped on US 395 between Burns and John Day, OR as they were traveling to a community meeting in John Day. Authorities evidently used the occasion of their absense from the refuge to apprehend them.

There seems to be a general roundup of the militiamen underway. Within hours of the shooting in Oregon, Jon Ritzheimer (who had previously participated in the occupation of Malheur) was arrested in Arizona. Joseph D. O'Shaughnessy (known to the militiamen as "captain") was arrested in a separate incident in Burns, OR. And Pete Santilli (who is some kind of independent broadcaster) was arrested in Burns, also.

It's not confirmed yet, but it seems the occupation of Malheur National Wildlife Refuge is over.


http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-standoff/2016/01/bundys_in_custody_one_militant.html
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So now we know why they let them just come and go: get them to let their guard down, then grab them.

Nice move. The local news tonight said there are just four people left at the refuge.
 
T-Rexx said:
Raw video of the FBI traffic stop where LaVoy Finicum was killed, and 5 others arrested:


The militiamen's vehicle (a white 4-door pickup with a cap) gets stopped in snow while trying to get around an FBI blockade. Finicum exits the vehicle about 9:21 with his arms extended laterally. About 9:29, he seems to move his arms to his waist and is immediately shot by two FBI agents. By 9:33 he is down in the snow.
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It looks like he was heading for the woods, saw they were prepared for that, turned around, and stumbled a little. If he was reaching for a weapon at all, it looks like a cross-draw arrangement.

It's clear he was still alive briefly after they shot him. What isn't clear is why they shot him -- there were claims earlier that he had charged at an agent, but he was moving away from the closest agent when he was shot; it appears he may even have been shot in the back. I can see why some are speculating that the LE team was determined to shoot someone, but OTOH he is on record earlier as saying there was no way he was going to be taken alive, and they must have had that in mind. It also isn't clear why no one moved to check his condition to see if an ambulance might have been useful.

I hope there is some dash cam or body cam video that will help make sense of this, but at the moment it looks to me like suicide by cop.
 
Uhh, yeah it's not unclear at all why they shot him.
 
T-Rexx said:
He means those religious crazy people who talk to God and get rewarded in the afterlife for killing people. The ones who like to attract attention to themselves by destroying property. The ones who nobly sacrifice themselves in a blaze of violence (while yet taking out enough surrounding innocent victims) in the misguided belief that that will force you to adopt their ideas. The ones who post videos to the internet to attract believers to their cause.

Those terrorists.

Kulindahr said:
But there aren't any of those involved here: no one has killed anyone, no one has blown anything up.

Your description is exactly why I asked the question: there aren't any terrorists involved in the matter of discussion in this thread.
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Kulindahr said:
...OTOH he is on record earlier as saying there was no way he was going to be taken alive, and they must have had that in mind.
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I'm not going to ask, because I already know the answer. You still don't consider these guys terrorists.


Kulindahr said:
It also isn't clear why no one moved to check his condition to see if an ambulance might have been useful.
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I think that would be because Finicum was near a truckload of terrorists who were shooting at them.
 
T-Rexx said:
I'm not going to ask, because I already know the answer. You still don't consider these guys terrorists.


I think that would be because Finicum was near a truckload of terrorists who were shooting at them.
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According to the FBI, no one shot at them.

And no, there aren't any terrorists involved here -- by your own definition. Terrorists direct violence at civilians in order to make people scared. The only violence in the situation was by law enforcement when a guy who'd declared publicly he wasn't going to be taken alive apparently reached for a gun.
 
Yes, now let us ignore that these men took over a federal building with weapons for weeks and no authorities made an attempt to start any gun fights. It is clearly the law enforcement who brought violence to this situation.

Your irrationality makes your opinions impossible to take seriously.
 
MakeDigitalLove said:
Yes, now let us ignore that these men took over a federal building with weapons for weeks and no authorities made an attempt to start any gun fights. It is clearly the law enforcement who brought violence to this situation.

Your irrationality makes your opinions impossible to take seriously.
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The occupiers didn't engage in any violence -- that's a fact.

In fact, by dodging the parked LE vehicles rather than ramming them, the driver in that instance was avoiding violence. No one opened fire on the police.

By what definition does not engaging in violence become violence?


BTW, it appears in the released video that the first violence involving the guy who ended up dead was by law enforcement; the best assessment so far of a spot that appears right in front of the driver on the vehicle is that someone shot at the driver. That would explain why he turned around.
 
It is a shame that once again, the FBI hands the militia movement another martyr.

As we sit here, this killing will go on to inspire dozens of misguided right wing radicals to join militias and to plot further gun saturated interactions with federal authorities.....perpetuating a cycle of violence for decades to come.

And people have trouble understanding the Middle East?
 
As martyrs go, this guy is a pretty neutered one. The revolution has failed to materialize. I wonder if they get to take their dildos with them to prison?
 
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