Seriously, George Santos deserves his own thread

[TX-Beau]

They were asleep at the wheel and a con artist who fled Brazil after passing stolen checks not only got elected to congress but was put on committees, he didn't just make it into the house he made himself comfortable and fixed himself a snack with his feet up on the table. If dems can't, at a bare minimum, keep frauds out of government, if they're that inept and toothless then they need to find another field of work. to call this negligence would be complimentary. or should we just anticipate that they're not vetting opponents and US govt is an open field for spies and conmen?

No. Santos got the REPUBLICAN nomination for some reason as yet unexplained, why? We'd all like to know the answer to that, especially since they knew exactly who he was.

The Dems are guilty of the same thing they always do, this is prioritizing marginal races for the flip while ignoring the ones they think are hopeless or safe.

None of that makes them somehow responsible in any way for the other party that knowingly nominates and supports a known thief and liar.

 

[LoveMyPeppermill]

No. Santos got the REPUBLICAN nomination for some reason as yet unexplained, why? We'd all like to know the answer to that, especially since they knew exactly who he was.

The Dems are guilty of the same thing they always do, this is prioritizing marginal races for the flip while ignoring the ones they think are hopeless or safe.

None of that makes them somehow responsible in any way for the other party that knowingly nominates and supports a known thief and liar.

^ Thank you! ^

The New York State Democratic Party does deserve some blame more generally, especially with respect to Congress: five winnable seats (including Santos's) were lost, and if they'd been won, we'd have the House now.

Now-former Rep. Sean Patrick Maloney (now-former chair of the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee) deserves blame for blowing two of those seats because he chose not to run in the new district that included most of the territory of his old district and big-footed the now-former Rep. Mondaire Jones, who had been quite popular, out of his district instead.

Tom Suozzi, who had been the incumbent Rep. for what is now Santos's district (NY-03), deserves blame for giving up his seat to run against Kathy Hochul, the incumbent Governor. When Letitia James (the NYS Attorney General) dropped out of the race for Governor, Suozzi should have dropped out, too; if he had, he'd surely have kept his seat.

 

[rareboy]

One of the articles I posted explains the clusterfuck that resulted in Santos.

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

None of that makes them somehow responsible in any way for the other party that knowingly nominates and supports a known thief and liar.

2024 can be 2016 part 2 if they're just gonna fart around and make excuses. this is exactly why republican voters practically masturbate to their candidates while dem voters are exhausted, unenthused and in many cases voting against republicans which isn't the same as voting for democrats.

nothing reeks of piss-poor work ethic quite like the ubiquitous "that's not my job description." those aren't the people who get promoted. being not as terrible as republicans is not a sustainable political culture. if you were a politician and i were a voter in your district expressing concerns about santos, this would be your response? "not my party, not my job." oh, be still my voting heart.

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

^ Thank you! ^

The New York State Democratic Party does deserve some blame more generally, especially with respect to Congress: five winnable seats (including Santos's) were lost, and if they'd been won, we'd have the House now.

Now-former Rep. Sean Patrick Maloney (now-former chair of the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee) deserves blame for blowing two of those seats because he chose not to run in the new district that included most of the territory of his old district and big-footed the now-former Rep. Mondaire Jones, who had been quite popular, out of his district instead.

Tom Suozzi, who had been the incumbent Rep. for what is now Santos's district (NY-03), deserves blame for giving up his seat to run against Kathy Hochul, the incumbent Governor. When Letitia James (the NYS Attorney General) dropped out of the race for Governor, Suozzi should have dropped out, too; if he had, he'd surely have kept his seat.

some of you guys are like my better half, often stoned i avoid mentioning specifics (names, dates, et cetera) to avoid a gaffe so i speak in generalities but somebody always swoops in with the manilla folder that has all the info and tea. you're the real MVP.

yeah, elections dems squandered recently could be a whole topic in and of itself. two words: beasley. demings.

 

[TX-Beau]

2024 can be 2016 part 2 if they're just gonna fart around and make excuses. this is exactly why republican voters practically masturbate to their candidates while dems are exhausted, unenthused and in many cases voting against republicans which isn't the same as voting for democrats.

nothing reeks of piss-poor work ethic quite like the ubiquitous "that's not my job description." those aren't the people who get promoted. being not as terrible as republicans is not a sustainable political culture. if you were a politician and i were a voter in your district expressing concerns about santos, this would be your response? "not my party, not my job." oh, be still my voting heart.

None of this gives any reason why Democrats are responsible for Republican choices. The responsibility for Santos is on their heads - excusing the trogs for whatever reason, or ignoring their culpability in favor of placing the blame elsewhere does not solve any problems. It's just a distraction. If you were in my hypothetical district, I would not be a Republican and would have no influence over who they nominated. How exactly were the Democrats going to affect the Republican primary?

You want to blame Democrats for the way their campaign was conducted, that is another issue, and it still does not make them responsible for Santos.

You already know what I'm going to say to anyone who is unhappy with their current political choices. Everyone is responsible for changing the system. Everyone.

 

[TX-Beau]

One of the articles I posted explains the clusterfuck that resulted in Santos.

I saw that earlier. A bunch of things came together and resulted in his election win - not the least of which is the mysterious cash donated by invisible friends and unknown relatives.

My theory is that Stefanik wanted the cash, and figured he'd lose again. Or maybe there are other imaginary friends giving to the NY delegation that have yet to be found.

 

[Alistair]

 

[KaraBulut]

The Dems are guilty of the same thing they always do, this is prioritizing marginal races for the flip while ignoring the ones they think are hopeless or safe.

^ Thank you! ^

The New York State Democratic Party does deserve some blame more generally, especially with respect to Congress: five winnable seats (including Santos's) were lost, and if they'd been won, we'd have the House now.

Both statements are true. Republicans flipped 4 NY House seats in 2022 - NY-3, NY-4, NY-17 and NY-19. Three of those seats were in the NYC metro area - 3, 4 and 17.

I would add a few other issues:

1. The Republican candidates weren't the looney election deniers that ran in other parts of the US.
2. The 2020 census reapportionment of NY House seats caused havoc. NY lost a House seat because they were 89 residents short of qualifying under the screwy census apportionment that results in 435 seats for the House. In the melee, 30 year incumbent Carolyn Maloney (NY-12) lost in the game of musical chairs that was the Democratic primary; her opponent was Jerry Nadler, another 30 year House veteran. One of the flipped seats was NY-17 where Sean Patrick Maloney lost because he switched districts between 2020 and 2022 after the redistricting and he ended up losing by 1% of the vote (a little over 3,000 votes).
3. The Republicans ran on claim that crime in the NYC metro area was out of control. NY Mayor Eric Adams was giving interviews talking about how crime in NYC was at a 30 year high and he was going to get tough on crime. Those interviews damaged the entire Democratic ticket from Gov Hochul down to the local NYC races.

New York has a declining population. Since 2000, they have lost 3 seats in the delegation because of the population loss. Before the 2020 census re-apportionment, NY delegation had 19 Democrats and 8 Republicans. With the lost Maloney seat and the 4 flipped seats, the Democrats lost 5 Democratic members in the delegation.

On paper, George Santos looked good- a Jewish, Latino, gay businessman who is 34 years old. The local newspaper had questioned some of what was on Santos' resumé but the concerns didn't get traction with voters until after the election when the Times picked up the story.

Santos' Democratic opponent Robert Zimmerman looked good on paper (likeable, gay, Jewish), too. But Zimmerman is 68 years old and the Democrats in the NYC are looking for young, fresh faces like Ocasio-Cortez (age 33), Torres (age 34), Jones (age 35), Goldman (age 46) which even makes Jeffries (age 52) look like an old man.

My favorite quote from a WaPo story today is from one of Santos' constituents:
“Santos is all I talk about in therapy,” said Great Neck resident Nina Gordon at the luncheon in Port Washington, after hugging Zimmerman. “My therapist said: ‘He’s not worth the co-pay.’”

 

[TX-Beau]

My primary frustration with the DNC and the primary reason I am not a registered Democrat - even though I've spent damn near 8 years now busting my ass trying to elect them, is that they spend next to nothing to help anyone in Texas, and just basically cede a fucking ton of contests to the trogs uncontested.

You can't get people to vote for you if you won't compete.

 

[LoveMyPeppermill]

1. The 2020 census reapportionment of NY House seats caused havoc. NY lost a House seat because they were 89 residents short of qualifying under the screwy census apportionment that results in 435 seats for the House.

God, don't remind me ...

1. In the melee, 30 year incumbent Carolyn Maloney (NY-12) lost in the game of musical chairs that was the Democratic primary; her opponent was Jerry Nadler, another 30 year House veteran.

Before the redistricting, I was in Carolyn Maloney's district. (I am now in AOC's.) She did good work, but I was ready to see her go; I voted against her in the previous two primaries.

1. NY Mayor Eric Adams was giving interviews talking about how crime in NYC was at a 30 year high and he was going to get tough on crime. Those interviews damaged the entire Democratic ticket from Gov Hochul down to the local NYC races.

Grrr ...
And no, crime in NYC is not at the levels it reached in the early 1990s.

Christ, why couldn't just a few more people have voted for Kathryn Garcia?

New York has a declining population. Since 2000, they have lost 3 seats in the delegation because of the population loss.

Just to be clear for readers (I know you know this), New York state has a declining population. (We seem to be exporting Republicans to Florida.)

I remember that roughly 2017-2019, a number of people (Derek Thompson at The Atlantic leaps to mind) were writing articles about how New York City was losing lots of population. Evidently the Census Bureau agreed, based on USPS change of address forms and one-way moving van rentals and such. I was always skeptical. Lo and behold, the city's population went from 8.19 million in 2010 to 8.77 million in 2020. (Told ya so, Derek!)

Santos' Democratic opponent Robert Zimmerman looked good on paper (likeable, gay, Jewish), too. But Zimmerman is 68 years old and the Democrats in the NYC are looking for young, fresh faces like Ocasio-Cortez (age 33), Torres (age 34), Jones (age 35), Goldman (age 46) which even makes Jeffries (age 52) look like an old man.

True, but those are mostly NYC candidates. I'm inclined to doubt that the North Shore of Long Island (NY-03) cares as much about youth.

I hear that Zimmerman is running around the district, more-or-less campaigning again, on the assumption that there will be a special election soon. When there is, I think it'd be a safer bet (sorry, Robert Zimmerman!) for Tom Suozzi, Santos's predecessor, to run again. Name recognition matters, and I gather the district was pretty content with him. (He's 60, by the way.)

 

[KaraBulut]

Before the redistricting, I was in Carolyn Maloney's district. (I am now in AOC's.) She did good work, but I was ready to see her go; I voted against her in the previous two primaries.

I liked Carolyn because she showed up for her district. I disliked Carolyn because like a lot of the Democrats, she needed to focus on building a bench of new and, yes, younger candidates, instead of focusing on accumulating power and chairing a committee.

And no, crime in NYC is not at the levels it reached in the early 1990s.

Christ, why couldn't just a few more people have voted for Kathryn Garcia?

This is always the game in NYC. If you're in that area, you see what is on the news stand- whether it's "wilding" stories or Bernard Goetz or the Central Park 5. The tabloids gin up public sentiment any time there's a Democrat in office. The only reason they didn't do it as much for Cuomo is that they were scared of him and his revenge tactics.

And there's a reason that NYCers always hate the mayor, regardless of who it is.

Just to be clear for readers (I know you know this), New York state has a declining population. (We seem to be exporting Republicans to Florida.)

For apportionment, it is State but a lot of the NYC boroughs are losing people. It's just getting too expensive to live there unless you are in a rent controlled apartment or own your home. Plus, there's that city income tax that everyone hates.

True, but those are mostly NYC candidates. I'm inclined to doubt that the North Shore of Long Island (NY-03) cares as much about youth.

NY-3 had minor redistricting changes compared to NY-1 and some of the suburbs.

When I saw who won and who lost in that district, I was surprised because I know that district well. It's one of those areas of Long Island that has two townships in the same zip code but you dare not confuse the two townships if one is more white, more affluent and has better schools. If I remember correctly, NY-3 is about 60% white and it has a large Jewish population (which explains why one of the candidates claimed to be Jew-ish with Holocaust survivor ancestors).

The only other factor besides age that I could point to is that the Democrats had 5 candidates that ran in the NY-3 primary, so they wasted a lot of time and money on the primary instead of putting their weight behind a single candidate.

I will say that Zimmerman might be a backroom operator and an insider but there's no evidence that he's a liar. All evidence is that he's a mensch and the people of NY-3 know they made a big mistake.

I hear that Zimmerman is running around the district, more-or-less campaigning again, on the assumption that there will be a special election soon. When there is, I think it'd be a safer bet (sorry, Robert Zimmerman!) for Tom Suozzi, Santos's predecessor, to run again. Name recognition matters, and I gather the district was pretty content with him. (He's 60, by the way.)

You might be interested in the WaPo article that came out (linked in post #269).

 

[LoveMyPeppermill]

I liked Carolyn because she showed up for her district. I disliked Carolyn because like a lot of the Democrats, she needed to focus on building a bench of new and, yes, younger candidates, instead of focusing on accumulating power and chairing a committee.

I feel exactly the same way about Carolyn Maloney.

And there's a reason that NYCers always hate the mayor, regardless of who it is.

Now that you mention it, I really don't remember much hate for Mike Bloomberg (and what there was seemed to me to be from lefty types who hated him solely because he was rich and worked in the finance industry). I think that, compared to other mayors, he didn't have a strong enough personality to engender hate. (We New Yorkers tend to like strong personalities in our mayors.) And for all that I didn't like some of his policies (thank god the West Side stadium fell through), Bloomberg and his commissioners kept the city running more smoothly than any other mayor in my lifetime. (Any mayor who'll appoint Janette Sadik-Khan as Transportation Commissioner has my vote.)

This as opposed to Bill de Blasio, whose policies we liked and who did get a lot done but who was just an insufferable jerk.

Oh, and Bloomberg finally brought Christo's and Jeanne-Claude's The Gates out of the limbo it had been trapped in for decades and made it happen, and it was one of the great visual art experiences of my lifetime.

For apportionment, it is State but a lot of the NYC boroughs are losing people. It's just getting too expensive to live there unless you are in a rent controlled apartment or own your home. Plus, there's that city income tax that everyone hates.

Well, since 2020. Also, though, if people are leaving, why do rents keep soaring? New York magazine's Curbed site has an article about that, though I haven't read it yet.

New Yorkers Never Came ‘Flooding Back.’ Why Did Rents Go Up So Much?

Getting to the bottom of a COVID-era real estate mystery.

www.curbed.com

Regarding NY-03, I know exactly what you mean about the North Shore of Nassau County. (Probably the North Shore of western Suffolk, too, out to at least Port Jefferson.) Definitely true in parts of North Jersey as well.

I will say that Zimmerman might be a backroom operator and an insider but there's no evidence that he's a liar. All evidence is that he's a mensch and the people of NY-3 know they made a big mistake.

Yeah, I sense that he's a good guy, too. I just figure that Suozzi has more name recognition, but if you think Zimmerman could pull it out against some other Republican, great.

 

[KaraBulut]

Now that you mention it, I really don't remember much hate for Mike Bloomberg (and what there was seemed to me to be from lefty types who hated him solely because he was rich and worked in the finance industry).

That's another phenomenon: they hate the mayor, until a new mayor is elected and then they say, "Oh, the last guy wasn't so bad. I wish he were still mayor".

About a month before 9/11, I was walking in Midtown and the cops were ticketing people for jaywalking. The friend I was with started complaining about what a Nazi that Giuliani was with his stop-and-frisk, blocked crosswalks, his ill behaved son, his cheating on his wife, his alcohol issues, etc. After 9/11, all was forgotten and Giuliani was "America's mayor".

Some reminders of why Bloomberg was hated:

Bloomberg Seeks to Ban Smoking In Every City Restaurant and Bar (Published 2002)

Bloomberg administration will ask City Council to amend New York City's antismoking law to include all restaurants and bars; current law, passed in 1995, forbids smoking in restaurants with more than 35 seats, and excludes stand-alone bars and bar areas of all restaurants; roughly 13,000...

www.nytimes.com

The FDA wants to eliminate trans fats. You can thank Mike Bloomberg for that. [WaPo 2013]

Bloomberg's ban on big sodas is unconstitutional: appeals court

New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg's controversial plan to keep large sugary drinks out of restaurants and other eateries was rejected by a state appeals court on Tuesday, which said he had overstepped his authority in trying to impose the ban.

www.reuters.com

This as opposed to Bill de Blasio, whose policies we liked and who did get a lot done but who was just an insufferable jerk.

I think you meant "is" there. Being a prick is necessary to get anything done in a NY politics (state and local). Like most NYC mayors, he fit the bill but like most former mayors, it's a political dead-end because being a prick doesn't play well on the national stage.

Well, since 2020. Also, though, if people are leaving, why do rents keep soaring? New York magazine's Curbed site has an article about that, though I haven't read it yet.

New Yorkers Never Came ‘Flooding Back.’ Why Did Rents Go Up So Much?

Getting to the bottom of a COVID-era real estate mystery.

www.curbed.com

It's a question that a lot of cities are asking, not just NYC. Thanks for the link to that article- I plan on giving it a read this morning.

Regarding NY-03, I know exactly what you mean about the North Shore of Nassau County. (Probably the North Shore of western Suffolk, too, out to at least Port Jefferson.) Definitely true in parts of North Jersey as well.

I have a lot of stories about my time in that district. Most of them focus on the eccentricities of the people there. I think there's something about too much time on the LIE and the LIRR that may affect people's reasoning.

Yeah, I sense that he's a good guy, too. I just figure that Suozzi has more name recognition, but if you think Zimmerman could pull it out against some other Republican, great.

You may be right. I think that just about anyone is going to be the better option over Santos. I just don't know how Santos survives for 2 years and I'm hoping the Dems don't waste time and money battling each other if they get another chance in a special election for the seat.


Today's editorial:

New Yorkers Aren’t The Only Ones Who Really Dislike George Santos

Welcome to Pollapalooza, our weekly polling roundup. In one of America’s most enduring myths, President George Washington damaged his father’s cherry tree with …

fivethirtyeight.com

 

[LoveMyPeppermill]

After 9/11, all was forgotten and Giuliani was "America's mayor"? In the rest of the country, yes, but that didn't last too long in the city. We remembered what a prick he was quickly enough. (Well, except for the people in places like Staten Island who always loved him.)

Bloomberg banning smoking in every bar and restaurant in the city is one of the reasons I liked the guy. If only it had happened while I was still going to bars ...

You saw cops actually ticketing people for jaywalking?? I remember when the initiative to crack down on jaywalking was announced; it seemed like everyone just rolled their eyes and snickered. I remember an article by one reporter (was it the Times? Village Voice? can't remember ...) who recounted jaywalking right in front of a cop, walking up to the cop, and mentioning that he'd just been jaywalking. The cop just looked at him.

 

[TX-Beau]

I remember when the smoking ban went into effect in the clubs in WEHO. There was lots of whining - but it was nice not to wake up next to a pile of reeking clothes that stunk up the room for hours anymore.

 

[KaraBulut]

After 9/11, all was forgotten and Giuliani was "America's mayor"? In the rest of the country, yes, but that didn't last too long in the city. We remembered what a prick he was quickly enough. (Well, except for the people in places like Staten Island who always loved him.)

There was a period where people were being nice to each other and polite after 9/11. Taxi drivers stopped honking at pedestrians, even! NYCers were even saying nice things about Giuliani , too.

The niceness to each other lasted about a month before it returned to every man and woman for himself. I didn't stick around long enough to see how long the Giuliani grace period lasted.

Bloomberg banning smoking in every bar and restaurant in the city is one of the reasons I liked the guy. If only it had happened while I was still going to bars ...

I was happy about it. Most of the residents of the south of 14th St weren't.

You saw cops actually ticketing people for jaywalking?? I remember when the initiative to crack down on jaywalking was announced; it seemed like everyone just rolled their eyes and snickered. I remember an article by one reporter (was it the Times? Village Voice? can't remember ...) who recounted jaywalking right in front of a cop, walking up to the cop, and mentioning that he'd just been jaywalking. The cop just looked at him.

Yes, and I even witnessed a yenta giving a NY cop an earful when he ticketed her.

Around the same time Giuliani had put up barricades around crosswalks that had everyone pissed off, especially since they changed almost daily.

There were things that I preferred about NYC pre-Giuliani. I would rather be propositioned by a hooker in Times Square than deal with Elmo trying to shake me down for cash like happens today.

Back to Kitara George Santos, Frida Ghitis has an editorial on CNN today where she makes a good point. We shouldn't get caught up in Rep Santos' daily dramas to the point that we lose sight of what is going to take him down: there's a lot of illegal money stuff in his 2022 campaign, and perhaps even his 2022 campaign. Ignore the glitter and follow the money.

Opinion: The most important secret George Santos is keeping

Frida Ghitis writes that in the continuing drama surrounding Republican Rep. George Santos of New York, there's one particularly disturbing aspect that points to a dangerous weakness in American democracy: Who paid for Santos' election camapign?

www.cnn.com

 

[KaraBulut]

I remember when the smoking ban went into effect in the clubs in WEHO. There was lots of whining - but it was nice not to wake up next to a pile of reeking clothes that stunk up the room for hours anymore.

It wasn't just reeking clothes that we were waking up next too.

The smoke permeated under the clothes, too.

 

[cabinfever]

It wasn't just reeking clothes that we were waking up next too.

The smoke permeated under the clothes, too.

I always had to take a shower as soon as I got home and throw my clothes in the washer at 3 AM. If I didn't the smell would be in our bed.

 

[rareboy]

So Georgina Kitara Santos Ravache did an interview with OAN.

As Louis Virtel noted...the bitch can see. Gone were the fake glasses and all over the place with everything all at once and all the time.

This Kween is pathetic.