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On-Topic Trump Bans Syrian Refugees

MystikWizard said:
We need to control the population … We are over-populated … population control … controlling the population … over-populating the United States
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Seriously?


Benvolio said:
the [Muslim] flood
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Let’s see some actual numbers from an original, credible source.


Benvolio said:
Hillary had more recent immigrants voting … against Americans.
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How are recent immigrant voters different from “Americans?”


kev said:
Actually, someone who uses Al Jazerra (or however you spell it) as a source at JUB is darker than any of this.
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I am interested to better understand the general basis for your complaint against Al Jazeera. (words only please)


Benvolio said:
500,000 or so a year is an alien invasion by any definition
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500k? #:>
 
Jeebuz. It is hard to keep everything up to date....and this story is far from over.

So despite whinging and whining and claiming that of course they'd win because 'it was a bad court'.....Trump has thrown in the towel.

The DOJ is not going to ask for review by a larger panel because the Dark Lord's minions are penning a new order to walk around the law prohibiting discrimination against particular Muslims.

So, expect it to be broader. Maybe they'll exclude people from Central America as well in order to remove the stench of Islamaphobia and replace it with the stench of something else.

“Rather than continuing this litigation, the President intends in the near future to rescind the Order and replace it with a new, substantially revised Executive Order to eliminate what the panel erroneously thought were constitutional concerns,” the Justice Department told the court. “In so doing, the President will clear the way for immediately protecting the country rather than pursuing further, potentially time-consuming litigation.”
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One assumes that this time, the White House has actual lawyers with experience in constitutional matters and not just Miller and Bannon scribbling away.

I still expect that whatever he signs will be subject to challenge under a number of articles, amendments and statutes though.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/02/trump-ninth-circuit-defeat/517095/
 
Muslim Ban v 2.0

So as expected, the draft wording has started circulating.

Same seven countries....

Green card holders excluded this time.

Dual citizens excluded this time.

Travellers already holding visas excluded this time.

No targeting Syrian refugees this time.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/trump-s-revised-travel-ban-targets-same-countries-ap-source-1.3292597

One suspects, however that it won't be enough to overcome the stay if the White House can't overcome the issue of animus and can't provide some real justification as to why only those seven countries are included in the ban.
 
rareboy said:
Muslim Ban v 2.0

So as expected, the draft wording has started circulating.

Same seven countries....

Green card holders excluded this time.

Dual citizens excluded this time.

Travellers already holding visas excluded this time.

No targeting Syrian refugees this time.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/trump-s-revised-travel-ban-targets-same-countries-ap-source-1.3292597

One suspects, however that it won't be enough to overcome the stay if the White House can't overcome the issue of animus and can't provide some real justification as to why only those seven countries are included in the ban.
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He seems to have eliminated all those who have an arguable existing right. Not everyone in the world has a litigable right to come to the US. People with green cards or visas have enough to argue about and he has eliminated them from the ban.
 
Benvolio said:
He seems to have eliminated all those who have an arguable existing right. Not everyone in the world has a litigable right to come to the US. People with green cards or visas have enough to argue about and he has eliminated them from the ban.
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I rather believe that the courts should be gratulated for this action.
 
Oh my fucking God.

Have you had your head up your ass all weekend?

Or just doubling down like Trump.

Many of the 'facts' in the documentary in question have been debunked by many senior sources in Sweden.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...sed-on-debunked-fox-news-report-a7589031.html

The US has the highest rate of violent gun crime in the world, ahead of Serbia and Yemen. Yemen for fucks sakes.

Almost three times the rate of Sweden.

http://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/stats/Crime/Violent-crime/Gun-crime/Guns-per-100-residents

And it wasn't because of immigrants.

So don't try that shit.

If anything, the rest of the world should be trying to contain America's gun lust in order to prevent the spread of that kind of violent crime in other countries. Like Canada. Where illegal guns from the US are a constant cause for concern.
 
Benvolio said:
Will you congratulate rhe courts for the crimes resulting? Sweden, having welcomed muslims, is now a rape capital. http://video.foxnews.com/v/5248024459001/?#sp=show-clips
Germany has similar problems. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...d-142-500-crimes-Germany-six-months-2016.html
But, hey, criminals vote drmocrat too.
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Trump said Germany "is crime-riddled right now" because of migration to Europe.

There are more criminal acts in Germany these days because there are more people, thanks to the influx of 1.1 million refugees in 2015 alone.

But the data suggest that the refugees tend to be better-behaved than the typical German. Even if you presume that refugee-related crime is underreported for political reasons, we could find no evidence in German media reports that the country warrants Trump's riddled-with-crime characterization.

Because his statement contains some element of truth but ignores critical facts that would give a different impression, we rate it Meist Falsch — Mostly False.
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Politifact

Some reports I've read finds that most of the crime is coming from young men who have managed to enter Europe but have little chance of gaining asylum status thus they have little incentive to behave they are going to be deported anyway. This is not so much a problem in the US since we are screening for refugee/asylum status before they even enter our country.

The idea that massive numbers of immigrants are criminal hoodlums is a common one throughout the history of the US, it is a default position taken up by bigots to justify their bigotry. It is rarely true though.
 
indeed, sweden’s crime rate has fallen since 2005, official statistics show, even as it has taken in hundreds of thousands of immigrants from countries like syria and iraq.

Sweden's embassy in the united states repeated mr trump’s tweet about having seen the fox report, and added: “we look forward to informing the us administration about swedish immigration and integration policies.”

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...donald-trump-sweden-immigration-a7589946.html
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fox=fake
 
You are citing the World Tribune for fuck sakes.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=109x1205

It is a 'blews' site with zero cred.

Except that all the right wingers love to cite it and then create the kind of feedback loop of fake news.

You then cite the same discredited FOX story based on the story that Trump was citing.

And the third story doesn't support your premise.

The Swedish government has said that the rumours about crime running out of control in Sweden are false.

So let's take a look at the numbers again then.

From 2016

http://www.thelocal.se/20170112/swedens-2016-crime-stats-analyzed
 
One difference is that you are citing national figures, while my citations tend to deal with neighborhoods in which the problem is concentrated.
 
Two of Sweden's leading politicians have written a Wall Street Journal op ed agreeing with Trump [QUOTE]https://www.google....zOOfC5ucYMP8Jg&bvm=bv.148073327,d.eWE[/QUOTE]
 
So let's not forget that the immigration order is being released this week.

But I guess it will have to be without the pretext that TrumpCo. was looking for.

They couldn't provide any demonstrable threat from people originating from their first seven Muslim targets when the 9th circuit knocked down the first immigration ban and Trump must be really pissed that Homeland Security failed to provide him with any meat since then.

Their report is a clear indictment against the White House....it shows that the first ban was arbitrary and based on animus.

ooooh. I'll bet that TrumpCo. isn't happy.

The Department of Homeland Security has concluded that citizenship is an “unlikely indicator” of whether an individual poses a terror threat to the US, according to a draft report obtained by the Associated Press.
US president Donald Trump had ordered an intelligence report to justify his embattled travel ban on seven Muslim majority nations. But the three-page draft “challenges Trump’s core claims” about the reasoning behind the executive order, the AP writes. The report also found hardly any terror-related activities in the US linked to people from the seven countries listed in the travel ban.
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https://qz.com/919257/department-of...port-rejects-donald-trumps-travel-ban-claims/
 
Therefore, we should stop all immigration, which has been my position all along.
 
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