Why are JUBbers so prejudiced against the religious/religion in general?

[Kulindahr]

I should also add, on a separate point, that I've always found it odd that on a forum where so much (whether you think it's valid on not) criticism of Christianity and Christians is done, that so many here refuse to criticise Islam or Muslims.

Some of them are THE most violently disgusting homophobic murderers on the planet and responsible for routine hanging and executing of gay men and boys, yet in comparison, I hear absolutely NO outrage about this on a regular basis as there should be.

I don't understand why, if it's OK to go after Christian beliefs, why it's deemed so not OK to go after Islamic ones, when they are about 1000 times worse in every way. Just because it's not the majority or state religion in most of the countries JUBbers are from (N America, Europe, Aus/NZ) DOESN'T mean it should be ignored and excused which is patently what the media (and I have to say, in particular the far-left outlets) do, especially in America.

But then I suspect the reason is very simple and pithy:

In America, the foremost number of visible extremists are Christian.
In Europe, the foremost number of visible extremists are Muslim.

I've gone after Christians and Muslims... and atheists. And yes, there is an odd deference to Islam that doesn't apply to Christianity.

 

[bort138]

Do you really think that people would not find other ways to hinder your rights if it were not for religion?

Is religion the driving force? Or is it the fear of the "other" and the need for powerful individuals to retain constructs of power that keep groups oppressed?

Religion may not be THE driving force but it is certainly A major driving force to impede gay rights. I don't think people use religion as a deliberate means to oppress others and retain their status. I think they are well-meaning people who honestly believe that homosexuality is a sinful affront to god and tolerating it would make them complicit.

 

[sixthson]

I don't mind them for the most part either because I typically try to understand the poor relationship between gays and the religious (or at least those that choose to separate themselves from the other), but I think that if we had a thread titled "Funny anti-white Internet pics" or "Funny anti-black Internet pics" then it might not last as long. Because the religious here are possibly in the minority then the majority are fine to mock them.

I don't think some gays have learned a thing from being ostracized themselves.

How long do you think a "funny anti-muslim pics" thread would last?

 

[johaninsc]

 

[Kulindahr]

Beliefs have consequences and many religions encourage the idea that faith (belief without evidence) is a virtue to be held in high regard. I find this to be an incredibly flawed method for determining the nature of the world and reality which we experience. If religion was not a constant impediment to progress in politics and affecting my rights, I would largely be indifferent to religion and never bring it up at all.

The problem isn't holding faith in high regard -- humans can't operate without faith, after all -- it's in the pernicious idea that faith can replace knowledge and/or thought. From Christians especially that's disgusting, given that God is reported to say we should reason and examine and study and follow His thoughts. If He is indeed Creator, then studying every detail of Creation is nothing else but following His thoughts -- so pitting faith against science is an insult to the Creator, besides being foolish.

I can easily picture a vast array of Christians facing God in judgment, and getting severely chastised for treating Him as a liar because they didn't believe what He plainly set forth in the universe.

 

[Kulindahr]

Speaking for myself as an American citizen, Christian beliefs are an enormous part of the antiprogress movements in our national politics (not failing to recognize a strong Christian presence on the pro-progress side, btw, Kuli)

Ironically, it's because I'm a very conservative Christian that I stand on the side of progress: I refuse to pick and choose, and refuse to assent to a doctrine that fails to pass the ancient test of the Gospels. My gut reaction to the scriptures cited against gays is to go with them, but I refuse to go with my gut reaction and insist on examining the texts in light of the whole.

 

[borg69unimatrix]

How long do you think a "funny anti-muslim pics" thread would last?

Maybe we should start one?

 

[LuckysRevenge]

Religion may not be THE driving force but it is certainly A major driving force to impede gay rights. I don't think people use religion as a deliberate means to oppress others and retain their status. I think they are well-meaning people who honestly believe that homosexuality is a sinful affront to god and tolerating it would make them complicit.

So how does "religion" do this? How does "religion" teach?

Ultimately, i think the part in bold is where most of the misunderstanding comes in. Who has told people that homosexuality is wrong? Who teaches intolerance? Because intolerance isn't a Christian teaching or ideal. These are attitudes and beliefs that have been purposely skewed and promoted.

I've read the Bible back and forth several times. I've also studied Islam, Judaism and several Eastern religions. They have all made me more tolerant. So where does the oppression come from if it is not from the text and from time-honored individuals and writings?
It comes from ignorant and hateful individuals who exist in all walks of life whether religious or non-religious. The religion of some zealots is merely a tool or vessel which they can use to justify their hate.

 

[johaninsc]

How long do you think a "funny anti-muslim pics" thread would last?

not very long...not as many anti-muslim pics and memes out there as there are anti-christian ones




maybe I should start creating some to add to the main thread

 

[Kulindahr]

"We"? Are there a lot of Muslims in Australia?

I think to a certain degree we expect those 3rd world countries to act barbaric, and expect more civility in first world ones.

There are more in the US than most people would guess. One of my first real exposures to Muslims was a vigorous argument between two groups of them on the OSU campus, one insisting that the entire Qur'an has to be regarded through the assertion "Merciful is Allah!", and the other insisting that slaughtering infidels was merciful....

Not even the Elohim of the Old Testament claimed that killing off idolatrous tribes was "mercy"!

 

[bort138]

I've gone after Christians and Muslims... and atheists. And yes, there is an odd deference to Islam that doesn't apply to Christianity.

Fatwa envy much? The double standard exists not necessarily because people respect Islam more but recognizing the reality that saying certain things about Islam publicly can seriously put your life at risk. Do you really want Christianity to gain respect through violence and intimidation?

 

[xbuzzerx]

There are more in the US than most people would guess. One of my first real exposures to Muslims was a vigorous argument between two groups of them on the OSU campus, one insisting that the entire Qur'an has to be regarded through the assertion "Merciful is Allah!", and the other insisting that slaughtering infidels was merciful....

Not even the Elohim of the Old Testament claimed that killing off idolatrous tribes was "mercy"!

But it did present it as righteous and God's will, in fairness. In the Old Testament God even directed the Israelites to take over a new land that was already populated, resulting in what today we would call a genocidal war, from modern sensibilities.

 

[bort138]

So how does "religion" do this? How does "religion" teach?

Ultimately, i think the part in bold is where most of the misunderstanding comes in. Who has told people that homosexuality is wrong? Who teaches intolerance? Because intolerance isn't a Christian teaching or ideal. These are attitudes and beliefs that have been purposely skewed and promoted.

I've read the Bible back and forth several times. I've also studied Islam, Judaism and several Eastern religions. They have all made me more tolerant. So where does the oppression come from if it is not from the text and from time-honored individuals and writings?
It comes from ignorant and hateful individuals who exist in all walks of life whether religious or non-religious. The religion of some zealots is merely a tool or vessel which they can use to justify their hate.

It's kind of a chicken or the egg question. Are people already moral and their interpretation of the bible is merely a reflection of their moral compass or are people initially amoral and the bible is the source that shapes the moral positions of the individual?

 

[Kulindahr]

Religion may not be THE driving force but it is certainly A major driving force to impede gay rights. I don't think people use religion as a deliberate means to oppress others and retain their status. I think they are well-meaning people who honestly believe that homosexuality is a sinful affront to god and tolerating it would make them complicit.

There are both types.

I have this notion than when a redneck says the word "faggot" with a wrinkling of the nose and a sneer, the Bible is secondary in his or her priorities, and the same when asserting that "homosexuality is a abomination" comes out with a much higher energy level than "Jesus rebuked the hypocrites".

 

[brokegayguy]

Who has told people that homosexuality is wrong?

..........

 

[Kulindahr]

So how does "religion" do this? How does "religion" teach?

Ultimately, i think the part in bold is where most of the misunderstanding comes in. Who has told people that homosexuality is wrong? Who teaches intolerance? Because intolerance isn't a Christian teaching or ideal. These are attitudes and beliefs that have been purposely skewed and promoted.

I've read the Bible back and forth several times. I've also studied Islam, Judaism and several Eastern religions. They have all made me more tolerant. So where does the oppression come from if it is not from the text and from time-honored individuals and writings?
It comes from ignorant and hateful individuals who exist in all walks of life whether religious or non-religious. The religion of some zealots is merely a tool or vessel which they can use to justify their hate.

It comes from people who are too lazy to try to grasp the actual principles involved so instead grasp little details that make them feel good and run with them regardless of the whole picture.

 

[Jack Springer]

How long do you think a "funny anti-muslim pics" thread would last?

It would be taken down immediately.

 

[johaninsc]

It would be taken down immediately.

if so, why are the ones that I've posted in the anti-religious pic thread still up?

 

[MakeDigitalLove]

I understand why people would have a problem with the religious right, but I find it weird on here that people are willing to mock people on this very board and their beliefs when they clearly aren't of the same group.

 

[Jack Springer]

if so, why are the ones that I've posted in the anti-religious pic thread still up?

I don't read that thread -- too many people full of hate.

There are actually real anti-Muslim cartoons in the thread?