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Help me to understand something about the U.S. football national anthem kneeling protests....

ChickenGuy

ChickenGuy

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I saw a reporter ask Donald Trump coming off an aeroplane a loaded accusatory question to the effect of, "Are you saying this is about race?" to which Trump backtracked and denied that it was anything to do with it....

Excuse me?

OF COURSE this controversy is about race! All of the protesters are black! And they've openly said that their protest is about their self-described ideas about racial injustice!

Why is a situation being set up where a bunch of black players are effectively, through their disrespecting the flag, calling into question the cohesiveness of their race with the entire values and ethos of the country?

The U.S.A. is a country founded on very strong principles, and for the last 50 years, it's been a nation for ALL Americans, regardless of race, ethnicity, or religion, united under a single flag and an anthem, shared values, and a common respect for everything the nation stands for.

Why is it that a few black players can promote endless racial division over their country each and every week and broadcast that idea to TV screens across the land, yet the President of that same country is forced to deny that very same fact, and be accused of racial division by even trying to point out the racial division?

Yes, I KNOW I will get plenty of rhetoric in response about Trump's attitude and behaviour, but these issues pre-dated his arrival, and so I'm not referring to him, I'm referring to the United States here.

The country is more than either the President or a few protesting players and the common ideas and values have to outlast them both.
 
ChickenGuy said:
The U.S.A. is a country founded on very strong principles, and for the last 50 years, it's been a nation for ALL Americans, regardless of race, ethnicity, or religion, united under a single flag and an anthem, shared values, and a common respect for everything the nation stands for.
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Oh honey, if you believe that then you are completely deluded
America is riven by issues of race, ethnicity and religion
 
ChickenGuy said:
OF COURSE this controversy is about race! All of the protesters are black! And they've openly said that their protest is about their self-described ideas about racial injustice!
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The United States has progressed enormously since 1776 when freedom was a preserve of the White Anglo Saxon colonist, with Black slaves, and the local Indigenous peoples denied equality with the settler population.

Race relations is work in progress, there being an awareness that despite the laws of the land there are people who are reluctant to respect the human rights of people with different skin pigmentation.

The previous president of the United States, Barack Obama is a Black American a fact of life that evidences progress.

Freedom of expression is a human right.

Protesting in favour of greater human rights for all Americans represents freedom of expression not lost on we Europeans who have suffered under two world wars to ensure that dictators do not impose their political agenda on the human race.

One of the many great features of American society is freedom of speech, enabling all Americans to express their feelings on matters that impact on their lives. The great Black American athlete of the 1936 Olympic Games held in Germany, Jesse Owens demonstrated to Adolph Hitler that Blacks are the equal to any White man.

Understanding racist related discriminatory behaviour is impossible for me, for I was lucky to be born with a white skin. Nevertheless, I have understood discriminatory behaviour, as it has impacted upon me as a gay man.

“You never really know a man until you understand things from his point of view, until you climb into his skin and walk around in it.”¬Harper Lee, To Kill a Mockingbird.
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medic1 said:
Well my friend, it is easy to deduce that you are not an African-American. Nuff said.
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It's easy to understand this is another of his aw shucks i don't know how America works trolling threads.
 
This kneeling started with one black player, I believe that it was in protest of cops shooting blacks. The last that I heard this player was not given a contract with any team when his contract ran out.

This issue of kneeling during the National Anthem is between the players and team owners pertaining to what the requirements are for
personal behavior on and off of the field with in the parameters of the contract(s) of the owners and players.

A president should be free to issue his opinion, but not tell owners to fire players. This had a severe back lash.
 
peeonme said:
A president should be free to issue his opinion, but not tell owners to fire players. This had a severe back lash.
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Especially a president who had to be reminded by his wife to put his hand over his heart during the playing of the National Anthem.

As you said, it is free speech for the players. It is their way to protest an injustice.

That is 'free speech'. THIS is disrespect:

 
I was never suggesting that they don't have a right to protest.

I was questioning their behaviour, and whether their chosen tactic helps or hinders their cause.

Throwing disrespect for the nation into every American Football fans face every week, and insinuating there's some connection between patriotism and race identity, is just about the most divisive method they could choose. It's a negative, destructive tactic instead of a constructive one that brings the country forward.

LeicsDom said:
Oh honey, if you believe that then you are completely deluded
America is riven by issues of race, ethnicity and religion
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Not in the U.S. military, where the brave men and women are of all races, ethnicities, and religions. It's no coincidence that this is because they each believe in a common set of values of service and duty above their racial identity. Same with the emergency services. Same with a lot of occupations.

P.S. Never heard of this guy but considering he had to stand alone, he shows a lot of spirit.

http://www.dailywire.com/news/21453/former-army-ranger-only-steelers-player-stand-ryan-saavedra

Former Army Ranger Is The Only Steelers Player To Stand For The National Anthem

Pittsburgh Steelers Left Tackle Alejandro Villanueva was the only player on his team to stand for the national anthem — he's also a highly-decorated U.S. military veteran.
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img_7691.jpg


Villanueva, who is of Spanish descent, is a former U.S. Army Captain who served three active tours in Afghanistan and was awarded the Bronze Star Medal for Valor — one of the highest individual awards given by the U.S. military.

Though he stands 6-foot-9, and served in the military at 240 pounds, Villanueva had to gain nearly 100 pounds in order to play on the offensive line for the Steelers after not being chosen in the NFL draft.
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Donald Trump publicly stating that any player who didn’t stand for the national anthem was a “son of a bitch” and should be fired by his team’s owner, clearly demonstrated that Trump has crossed a line which no one could ignore. Sunday afternoon players who previously had wanted no involvement in a racial dialogue stood before giant flags, linking arms in protest. Club owners who once wished their kneeling players would just stop their antics fired off statements in their support. Television networks that have avoided showing the raised fists of dissent elected to show rows of players protesting.
 
ChickenGuy said:
Since the players started the disrespect, they are in no position to get any.
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It is an expression of free speech guaranteed by the constitution and, as Colin explained, he cannot respect a flag and country which goes around treating its citizens in the way it does. He was making a 'silent protest' and now others have jumped on the bandwagon, and for Trump to condemn their actions while condoning the actions of the white supremacists is the epitome of hypocrisy.

Colin and the other protesters have a guaranteed right to protest without violence, which is what they are doing. Trump wants to stop it by taking away that constitutional right.
 
If you ever saw the parades in North Korea you might have noticed how vigorously the soldiers marched and how all present stood straight and did what was "proper". This was not in respect nor out of patriotism, but out of fear. Nazi Germany, China and the old Soviet Union were of the same nature (just to name a few).

America does not operate this way, when people show respect and exhibit patriotism it is because they believe in what the Anthem or the flag represent.
When people don't go with protocol it is because what the Anthem or the flag represent has veered of course and the government has taken actions that the people object to.

I never want to see us in a spot where we must act like puppets to please a tyrant.
 
It's not really about the flag, is it? It's about the anthem. That's when they kneel. And, seriously, how many Americans watching those sports games stand at attention in their sports bar or livingrooms or wherever and put their hands over their hearts every time they hear it at the start of a game?
 
gsdx said:
It's not really about the flag, is it? It's about the anthem. That's when they kneel. And, seriously, how many Americans watching those sports games stand at attention in their sports bar or livingrooms or wherever and put their hands over their hearts every time they hear it at the start of a game?
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I believe proper etiquette is to stand and either salute if in uniform or place your hand over your heart if you are a civilian if you are at the actual event where the Anthem is being played.
 
^ That's etiquette. And, in that vein, as I said earlier, Trump has no right to demand the same respect that he, himself, didn't show.
 
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