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Op-Ed Iran .... another Red Line in 6 Months

Thanks for supporting my point. Obama isn't blaming the Republicans for the problem, he's just saying they're making a bad situation worse.

I finally stopped laughing. Read it again. Obama is blaming the republicans for the poor performance of his web site.

Even if you believe you nonsense ... please tell me how any person outside the group of people who are working on the web site are making it harder to create a working web site? Are republicans teasing the programmers as they work in their cubicles?
 
I finally stopped laughing. Read it again. Obama is blaming the republicans for the poor performance of his web site.

Even if you believe you nonsense ... please tell me how any person outside the group of people who are working on the web site are making it harder to create a working web site? Are republicans teasing the programmers as they work in their cubicles?

I read it three times to be sure.

BTW, I didn't say it wasn't one of the stupidest things I've ever heard from a politician. How dumb dies he think people are?

Actually, it reminded me of being in extemporaneous speaking at speech tournaments when someone gets hit with a topic he's clueless about and just talks nonsense to fill up the time.
 
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I haven't read one of our "true believers" even mention Munich, Neville Chamberlain or appeasement. (Neocon talking points of the day) Let's get with it. (!)
 
^All good points, though Israel would strike, even if it is not a logical move to some.

I agree to an extent. I am not sure as I dont sit in the room during negotiations, BUT I think Israel coordinates actions more often than not in accordance with American and Israeli intent. We are allies as aligned as possible. Probably the only greater in 'lock step' foreign policy with our nation is how we coordinate with the last empire. Yours, of course. The point is we can make a case and until they are actually producing weapons grade uranium, Israel will remain bristled but patient. Iran is too big considering the current dysfunction in the middle east.

The problem was that the Bush administration did not calculate the demographic make up of Iraq, likely because Republicans are not terribly cultured or aware of the outside world. Two thirds subscribe to Shiite Islam. What was a replacement government supposed to look like?

Agreed. They should have followed the time honored policy of keeping the foot soldiers of the previous authority in Iraq, and then told them the new policies. It would have maintained much more order than the replace model. Regardless of their previous shameful crimes in the name of Saddaam, the locust of power has a way of maintaining authenticity if only because that is how is has been for so long.

The plan failed in almost every aspect until a recovery tactic under Patreus managed to establish controlling order once again at great loss of life. It was not necessary.

The people whining include many top dem Senators who want more sanctions against Iran.

What triggers my distrust more than anything is the need to sign an agreement at 3am in the morning. What could be that important that it couldn't wait until daylight? Is Iran that close to fully building a nuclear bomb?

The only thing I would ask you, while it is easy to stand back and armchair quarterback, after you have been negotiating for months and years, then when the opposition caves to a point previously agreed, then you close. You don't fucking wait till Tom, Dick, JACK or Harry chime in with their approval. After months and years you have already reached a consensus as to what is an acceptable agreement. You take it and you seal it when agreed before other entities can make it impossible to sign. No offense, but you have never actually negotiated anything of substantial weight with massive political implications. One does not wait for the thousand of useless voices to tear it apart. A deadline for doing is exactly how you move forward. Saying it is a red line is just ignorant word play.

In the end, a situation where we negotiate our way to success under a democratic president is an election nightmare for republicans. That is the main complaint here, nothing substantial or worth consideration. Plus any thing we agree to long term has to meet the test of our congress. If it proves worthy then it will, if not then it wont. Crying about a chance is simply political chicanery.

The Israeli Government's hawkish position serves to encourage Iran to negotiate seriously, and deliver on its agreement with the international community...whilst, it is reported that Israel's security services, and military have rejected an air assault on Iran's nuclear industry sites.

I quote:

http://972mag.com/anonymous-decision-maker-advocating-war-with-iran-is-ehud-barak/52617/



Furthermore it is also understood that any assault on Iran would embolden the postion of the hawks in the Iran government:

http://thediplomat.com/2012/08/why-israel-wont-attack-iran/

I quote:

I agree with you here which is odd since our thought processes rarely align. This is very logical but would be entirely defused if Iran acts as it has indicated in the first step of negotiations.



What bothers me most is that there are entities in our political leadership that would derail this simply to deny Obama a political win. That is bad for America, Israel, and the rest of the world. A grown up, diplomatic middle east would be a boon to the world. Iran is the keystone to such an environment. Chopping that off for national political gain is an affront to humanity.
 
What bothers me most is that there are entities in our political leadership that would derail this simply to deny Obama a political win. That is bad for America, Israel, and the rest of the world. A grown up, diplomatic middle east would be a boon to the world. Iran is the keystone to such an environment. Chopping that off for national political gain is an affront to humanity.

Definitely there are such people. For starters, there are many in Congress whose geographical knowledge is so minimal they might not even be able to find Iran on a map, and even if they could wouldn't be able to make a comparison between its size and the US. That doesn't give a good foundation for hope.
 
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I haven't read one of our "true believers" even mention Munich, Neville Chamberlain or appeasement. (Neocon talking points of the day) Let's get with it. (!)

Peace in our time . . . . at 3am in the morning.

onc.jpg
 
^Already been explained to you mate, rather well actually. As has already been mentioned by another member. Reading comprehension?
 
Peace in our time . . . . at 3am in the morning.

onc.jpg

Neville Chamberlain was definitely influenced by his own very personal experiences with bloody horror, for he fought in front line trenches during WW1 with those memories haunting him till his death....whilst, also understanding that neither the United Kingdom, or France were ready to fight a world war in 1938.....a different reality to this agreement with Iran for the Iranian government understands the strength of Western determination, and the power of Western military assets to ensure that a nuclear weapons programme is never realised in Iran.
 
I assume that the metrics established in the Accord are meaningful. I do hope, however, the inspections are more than "a peak over the backyard fence." In the past we have heard that so much of the Iranian program is underground, literally. I would imagine too that NSA/CIA are in the hot seat on this one. The trump card in the Accord is China, with whom the US has worked successfully in circumscribing Iran's nuclear efforts.
 
It has been clear for some time that Obama has no intention of preventing Iran from getting the bomb. Perhaps if he could talk them out of it, but he is friendlier to Muslims than to Israel.
 
It has been clear for some time that Obama has no intention of preventing Iran from getting the bomb. Perhaps if he could talk them out of it, but he is friendlier to Muslims than to Israel.

In your opinion, what is the best way to prevent Iran from getting a bomb from here, methods which Israel and the US have not tried.
 
you right wingers are so unbelievably dumb

its thanks to obama that sanctions have worked for the first time, basically, ever. and its thanks to them that we might actually get a concrete peace deal and avoid having to go to war again.
 
I assume that the metrics established in the Accord are meaningful. I do hope, however, the inspections are more than "a peak over the backyard fence." In the past we have heard that so much of the Iranian program is underground, literally. I would imagine too that NSA/CIA are in the hot seat on this one. The trump card in the Accord is China, with whom the US has worked successfully in circumscribing Iran's nuclear efforts.

People with the same attitude as my cousin the nuclear engineer would be good to send -- he thinks inspections are futile unless you have permission to shut systems off and examine them in detail. But then he worked in safety systems, so . . . .
 
you right wingers are so unbelievably dumb

its thanks to obama that sanctions have worked for the first time, basically, ever. and its thanks to them that we might actually get a concrete peace deal and avoid having to go to war again.

I think Iran wanted this deal under Obama before a hardline Republican comes to office and lets Israel bomb the shit out of Natanz and Isfahan.
 
I think Iran wanted this deal under Obama before a hardline Republican comes to office and lets Israel bomb the shit out of Natanz and Isfahan.

well everyone who actually follow foreign policy awwm ro agree that Iran wanted this deal because the public there wants them to do something about the sanctions, and voted in a new leader mainly on that issue.

the idea that republicans are somehow better for foreign diplomacy (or anything) is pretty laughable. Obama is leagues better than Bush was.
 
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