Muslims can't do the job.....

[cityboy-stl]

I have two comments about this topic.

I agree on the need for communication and understanding. But I'm getting sick of we're supposed to be the ones communicating, understanding and accommodating while absolutely no effort is applied on the other side to communicate, understand or accommodate. We're supposed to do everything to include them while they make no attempt to assimilate into the culture of where they now live. I'm really getting sick of walking on eggshells to not offend someone while at the same time they couldn't care less about how the rest of us feel. They're the only ones that matter. If I moved to another country I'd have to conform to their culture. I'm willing to give and take but I'm tired of the all give and no take attitude of some of these people. Communication goes both ways and I don't see that happening. That applies to a lot of situations.

My other comment is at least the checker isn't shoving his belief down the customers throat by refusing to sell pork. Unlike some so called "christian" pharmacists who shove their beliefs by refusing to sell legitimate prescriptions because it doesn't fit their religion. Their job is to dispense medication not make moral judgments about the patients medical condition. Who's worse?

 

[Andreus]

seriously... some of you really need to get off ur high horses and RESPECT another persons religious choices.. u have NO RIGHT to mock or dis-respect another persons choices.. i mean i find it funny.. i would have atleast thought YOU of all ppl would know what its like to be judged due to your choices and lifestyles.. and yes.. i come from a Muslim family.

alas

no

you get used to it

just report the posts you think cross the line and move on

 

[unclaimedblessing]

Everyone is entitled to their own religious choices.
What they're not entitled to is forcing their choices down everyone elses throats.
If this woman is incapable of performing the duties the was hired to do and has no problem accepting a pay check for, she deserves to be fired.
Paying customers are usually in a hurry, very few enjoy living in a grocery store. We want to pay for our purchases and get home as soon as possible. We don't want or need a lesson in the faith of others.

 

[bimmrboy]

seriously... some of you really need to get off ur high horses and RESPECT another persons religious choices.. u have NO RIGHT to mock or dis-respect another persons choices.. i mean i find it funny.. i would have atleast thought YOU of all ppl would know what its like to be judged due to your choices and lifestyles.. and yes.. i come from a Muslim family.

I didn't take this thread as mocking someones religious choice. I saw it more as a sad commentary on the state of society at the moment.

You took offense cause you have a muslim background. Would you have taken the same offense if the cashier in question was jewish?

 

[unclaimedblessing]

I really do try to see issues from all perpectives.
Let's change this scenario.
Many Christians take the Bible very literally.There are many passages which urge us to spread the word of Jesus. Suppose a Catholic priest or a Protestant minister was in this womans checkout line frequently. Would she be receptive or offended by their suggestions to find God?
They're both acting in accordance with their holy books.

 

[greaves]

Thanks to Saint Patrick - who we celebrate today - there are no snakes in Ireland.

Not sure what his views were on eating/touching cows/sheep/goats/fish/chickens/vegetables/pigs etc.

And what would he make of JUB?

 

[Andreus]

I didn't take this thread as mocking someones religious choice. I saw it more as a sad commentary on the state of society at the moment.

You took offense cause you have a muslim background. Would you have taken the same offense if the cashier in question was jewish?

are you implying that Muslims dont respect our jewish brothers?

 

[slobone]

I agree employers should make good faith efforts to accomodate the religious beliefs of their employees. But not where it gets to the essence of a job.

The essence of the job of a checker is to scan every item the store sells. People could have all kinds of objections to some of the items sold, like cigarettes or alcohol, etc. A vegetarian, whether one by religion (Hindus of the Brahmin caste) or not, could object to meat in any form.

Doesn't matter. If you can't do the job, get another job.

 

[Andreus]

i dont liek this conversation because i think it is bordering on being disrespectfull

i also think that the muslims who are making this an issue are out of touch with the koran

it says we are not allowed to eat the flesh or touch it, and so it seems to me that only the butchers are the ones that should have an issue

modern packaging of meats in america assures that you dont touch the flesh... you touch the packaging that contains pork

And i think also ...

if you are so offended then you simply need to get another job

the muslim who applies for a bag boy job that doesnt want to be around fresh pork is akin to the shampoo girl that has a skin condition and can't touch the chemicals in shampoo

I am a very very liberal muslim

i want to say this again

some of you have a point here, but you really need to be more respectfull if you want people to participate that actually have the answers that you are asking for

if you're not, you're just mocking people who are different than you

 

[Andreus]

But I don't see this as any different than in my local grocery when I have a cashier who isn't of legal age in this state who has to have another employee ring up alcohol or cigarettes for me.

Yes. It's a minor inconvenience. But it's an extremely minor one of little consequence.

well you do have a point

but the koran also forbids alcohol... and so wheres the fuss over that?

this seems to be a selective issue about what one person is comfortable with

 

[bimmrboy]

are you implying that Muslims dont respect our jewish brothers?

Not at all. Many jewish people won't deal with pork prodcuts. If the cashier in question was jewish and wouldn't touch the pork, and someone posted about it here, would the person I was referring to (yusuf2007) be upset about it to the same degree. Or is he making it just a muslim issue?

Interestingly enough, it seems we're in agreement on something:

if you are so offended then you simply need to get another job

the muslim who applies for a bag boy job that doesnt want to be around fresh pork is akin to the shampoo girl that has a skin condition and can't touch the chemicals in shampoo

How do these threads always take a religious discrimination turn around here.

 

[bimmrboy]

The only comparison I was trying to make between the pork and cigs or alcohol by the cashier needing someone else to ring them up was just how in each instance the inconvenience is just so minute to be of no consequence.

There is a difference. One is a legal requirement, the other is personal preference.

 

[bimmrboy]

Again, bimmer, what I was comparing was the TIME inconvenience.

Got ya......

 

[luckotheirish]

...If the cashier were refusing to sell the pork I could see it becoming an issue as with the case of pharmacists refusing to dispense medication....

I'm a pharmacist and this topic has been discussed quite a bit within our profession - to no universally satisfactory resolution. Go figure....

I will say, from my POV, if you have deeply held convictions or religious beliefs on some subject, you should know that going into a job.

I spent 6 years in pharmacy school and we learned all about the use of oral contraceptives (birth control) and abortifacients (morning after pill, RU-486). If I had a conflict with it, I had 6 years to change career goals or to decide not to go into community pharmacy practice at all.

The most famous case of a pharmacist who was fired for refusing to dispense birth control because of religious beliefs was a Catholic woman in Cincinnati. She didn't make her objection until years into her practice.

She knew when she took the job that she would be expected to dispense these medications. IMO, it appears a bit disingenuous for this pharmacist to suddenly have an attack of conscience.

There are no pharmacists who don't know this will be expected of them when they apply for a position as a community pharmacist!!

The point is... whether it's birth control, pork, beer, condoms, porno mags, potato chips, or lottery tickets and a potential employer is gonna ask you to violate your religion or your conscience by handling, selling or dispensing them, don't apply!

 

[greaves]

What about sheep tripe? chicken tripe? goat tripe? fish tripe? vegetable tripe?

And all the religious tripe.

Do I need to seek the approval of a supervisor/iman/priest/pastor/pope/guru/rabbi about what I eat?/ who I have sex with?/ how I conduct my life?/ who I have to marry?

No I do not.

 

[Just_Believe18]

This is as stupid as fundamentalist Christian doctors denying medical service to patients because of their morality. This is a denial of service to the customer and should be treated as such.

 

[luckotheirish]

luckotheirish:

Yeah. That was kind of my point in my last paragraph in the previous post.

If you're fully aware of the requirements of the job being offered and you accept it anyway, or if your job changes after you're hired and you're offered a position to keep the same job or an alternative when offered in an attempt to accomodate you and you still reject the alternative, then that's not discrimination imo.

Yeah. I got your point and completely agree with you. I just thought I would reinforce your point with my perspective.

 

[nijuusei]

i agree that she shouldn't take on a job she can't fulfill..

Religion should be kept within the walls of the Church, Mosque, Synagogue or Temple.

If Religion is to be used outside these institutions, then it should learn to adapt to its new environment.

but.. i just felt like saying.. ideally.. a religion or a spiritual path is a way of life..
it's not something related to a place or a time.. or at least that's how i see it..
it's not something you switch on or off when it suits you..
if you'd only be 'religious' within the walls of a church for example..
it would be no different then let's say.. soccer practice.

 

[Just_Believe18]

How were they being denied service?

The products weren't being refused to be sold to the customer, nor was the consumer being denied the product by the cashier in this instance.

The two situations of denying medical service and having a different person ring up an item or asking you to scan it yourself are not equivocal situations or circumstances. The customer wasn't even being told to go somewhere else.

One, it inconveniences the customer to have to wait for another co-worker to walk over to the register, scan the item, and then put it into the bag. At the same time, it takes the co-worker away from his/her job to do the favor. It is absolutely ridiculous.

Second, a customer should not be ringing up their own products from the opposite end of the register. There are self-checkouts designed for that purpose. But regular registers are the responsibility of the employee.

Third, it's not even practical. There are so many pork products other than bacon that it is difficult to visibly check every product to make sure you're not "offending religious beliefs."

Superstitious nonesense. A pig is just as unclean to the Jew as it is to a Muslim. Do you see Jewish cashiers refusing to handle pig products?

 

[Andreus]

supersticious nonsense???



thats disrespectfull

i dont agree with the choices this person is making either and i am of the same faith.

but its about personal choices

if someone wants to approach life in this way it is their right in america, but they simply should not work in an environment that is not congruous with their beliefs.

I have a right to be anything i want so long as it doesnt violate the rights of others. Fast customer service is not a right. it is a competitive business decision. theres a big big difference. i dont have the right to make my employer be less competitive, but i do have the rights to my beliefs. If my personal choices are harming the business that i am getting a paycheck from, then it seems counterproductive to me.

hassidic jews would not work in a non kosher shop, nor would they even consider the option of shopping there

if muslims have the same strict beliefs they should make the same choices and this discussion would never happen.