So, what do you guys think about the possible mosque by ground zero

[Críostóir]

You damn right it's about opposition to Islam!

I see Islam as a particularly dark, particularly insidious cancer, metastasizing on the face of the planet. Brutally repressive, aggressively intolerant, stuck in the Middle Ages, a direct antithesis to human progress...and to the advancement of the acceptance of gays, too.

Or have you forgotten that?

Homosexuality is punishable by death according to Islam, and you jokers are defending it.

Talk about Jewish Nazis...

None of that is true in America. If you knew American Muslims, you'd know that.

Homosexuality is punishable by death in IRAN and SAUDI ARABIA, two of the most brutally oppressive regimes in the world by any standard. The Christian nation of Uganda is about to pass a similar law.

Also, any out-of-wedlock sex is punishable by death where wahhabists dominate. Wahhabism is a bad, bad thing; but these aren't wahhabists putting up this cultural center. In fact, they're the best defense AGAINST wahhabism.

 

[Críostóir]

I say put a mosque on the roof of every new building being built on or near ground zero.

That would be excessive. Besides, Al Qaeda and their ilk delight in blowing up mosques and murdering Muslims, if the mosques and Muslims in question are Shi'ite or moderate. The Cordoba Center will be a middle finger raised at Osama and his loathsome breed.

 

[CowboyBob]

Catholic priests have been convicted of molesting children.

I protest having any Catholic churches near schools!

 

[Joshua_me]

10 Excellent points from Mr. Ebert.

It's refreshing to read common sense.

http://blogs.suntimes.com/ebert/2010/08/ten_things_i_know_about_the_mo.html

 

[MercuryJones]

This video is a reminder of why the thing should be built. The harassed gentleman is not in fact Muslim, but what if he were? Is this the kind of harassment Muslims are facing, they deserve our support as fellow citizens.

Also note the snarky anti-Obama comments made by the protesters.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwaNRWMN-F4[/ame]

 

[SuperPsyze]

Catholic priests have been convicted of molesting children.

I protest having any Catholic churches near schools!

That's gonna put a kink in all those Catholic Schools

 

[MoltenRock III]

You damn right it's about opposition to Islam!

I see Islam as a particularly dark, particularly insidious cancer, metastasizing on the face of the planet. Brutally repressive, aggressively intolerant, stuck in the Middle Ages, a direct antithesis to human progress...and to the advancement of the acceptance of gays, too.

Or have you forgotten that?

Homosexuality is punishable by death according to Islam, and you jokers are defending it.

Talk about Jewish Nazis...

Knock it off! Your bigoted bias is disgusting. Christianity and Islam suck equally. Islam is not "stuck in the dark ages" as a religion, merely those small numbers of whack jobs believing in it. The same goes for disgusting pig Christians who think its ok to blow up and kill innocent people at abortion clinics. Or at the federal buildings in Oklahoma.

Stop blaming Islam in general for what happens in repressive regimes, and use your brain to think, instead of reflexively belching out a willfully ignorant statement. How many American Muslims born & raised do you hear killing gays? Hmmm? How many? I have a much, much, higher chance of being gay bashed and even killed by some wingnut Christian than I do a Muslim. So spare me your faux righteous indignation.

There are 1.6 BILLION practicing Muslims, the vast majority peace loving, "normal" people, like the 210 million Muslims from Indonesia, the 2.5 million from the USA, the 5 million from the Philippines, the 74 million from Turkey (a staunch US ally & NATO member), or even the 22 million from China.

Do the grisly murders of Andrew Cunanan or John Wayne Gacy's describe all gay people? How about the cannibalism, sexual rape, and murderous ways of Jeffery Dahlmer? Is he the usual gay person?

Judge not, lest you be judged homo.

 

[Críostóir]

Knock it off! Your bigoted bias is disgusting. Christianity and Islam suck equally. Islam is not "stuck in the dark ages" as a religion, merely those small numbers of whack jobs believing in it. The same goes for disgusting pig Christians who think its ok to blow up and kill innocent people at abortion clinics. Or at the federal buildings in Oklahoma.

Stop blaming Islam in general for what happens in repressive regimes, and use your brain to think, instead of reflexively belching out a willfully ignorant statement. How many American Muslims born & raised do you hear killing gays? Hmmm? How many? I have a much, much, higher chance of being gay bashed and even killed by some wingnut Christian than I do a Muslim. So spare me your faux righteous indignation.

There are 1.6 BILLION practicing Muslims, the vast majority peace loving, "normal" people, like the 210 million Muslims from Indonesia, the 2.5 million from the USA, the 5 million from the Philippines, the 74 million from Turkey (a staunch US ally & NATO member), or even the 22 million from China.

Do the grisly murders of Andrew Cunanan or John Wayne Gacy's describe all gay people? How about the cannibalism, sexual rape, and murderous ways of Jeffery Dahlmer? Is he the usual gay person?

Judge not, lest you be judged homo.

Fond as I am of the person you're replying to here, I can't help but agree. Well said.

 

[Just_Believe18]

You damn right it's about opposition to Islam!

I see Islam as a particularly dark, particularly insidious cancer, metastasizing on the face of the planet. Brutally repressive, aggressively intolerant, stuck in the Middle Ages, a direct antithesis to human progress...and to the advancement of the acceptance of gays, too.

Or have you forgotten that?

Homosexuality is punishable by death according to Islam, and you jokers are defending it.

Talk about Jewish Nazis...

I have often criticized the religion of Islam and how it is practiced around the world. I've received very negative comments on this forum for believing Islam is currently in a Dark Age, much like Christianity was with Catholicism in Europe centuries ago.

However, I would never generalize all Muslims to be responsible for 9/11, nor would I believe all Muslims are capable of turning into terrorists. I am also a patriot, and believe in the U.S. Constitution's 1st Amendment clause that every American's religion is protected under the highest law of this land. NYC's Muslim community has THE RIGHT to build a community center where they wish. No mob of people or politician would ever have the right to scream, "NO CHURCH HERE! NO CHURCH HERE!" The same applies to any mosque, synagogue, or temple of anyone's faith.

So while it's so easy for you, Johann, to throw around the words "Jewish Nazis" to everyone here, a rational thinking man would understand the principles of law, fairness, and justice before making such an ignorant, racist, and xenophobic response as you did.

 

[desmond]

No churches on Church Street!

Sorry, that's flip, this subject makes me a bit crazed, and I seem to be in good and plentiful company.

It's a very intense spot, with or without 911, I remember a caretaker at the church at the end of Wall Street showing me the spiky fence someone landed on in the 29 crash.


You can still run your hand across the pockmarks in the former JP Morgan Bank across from the stock exchange where a bomb went off in 1920, although it seems a little weird to do so with all the security.

 

[laikaNYC]

This video is a reminder of why the thing should be built. The harassed gentleman is not in fact Muslim, but what if he were? Is this the kind of harassment Muslims are facing, they deserve our support as fellow citizens.

Also note the snarky anti-Obama comments made by the protesters.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwaNRWMN-F4

I can't believe you're calling someone snarky.

Mosque supporter tells Americans to "Get Over 9/11". Apparently this delusional man wasn't taught that the Holocaust wasn't perpetuated in the name of Catholicism. That argument is preposterous.


[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2VbYHyBTJJA[/ame]

 

[desmond]

He must have been thinking of the Tribunal of the Holy Office of the Inquisition or some such shit. He should get over it.

 

[Críostóir]

He must have been thinking of the Tribunal of the Holy Office of the Inquisition or some such shit. He should get over it.

For those who don't know, it's now called the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, and no longer has the authority to torture people or burn them at the stake,* but it's the same organization.

The current Pope was head of it under the last Pope.
____
*Technically it never did, but turned people over to secular authority for execution after torturing confessions out of them.

 

[xxxsultanxxxx]

You damn right it's about opposition to Islam!

I see Islam as a particularly dark, particularly insidious cancer, metastasizing on the face of the planet. Brutally repressive, aggressively intolerant, stuck in the Middle Ages, a direct antithesis to human progress...and to the advancement of the acceptance of gays, too.

Or have you forgotten that?

Homosexuality is punishable by death according to Islam, and you jokers are defending it.

Talk about Jewish Nazis...

The Ottomans, Mughals, Safavids were not direct antithesis to human progress.
The Muslim scholars of the Bait ul-Hikmah in Baghdad who saved the works of the Greeks from destruction, who brought and cultivated knowledge from China, India, and Persia weren't against progress. Rumi wasn't a cancer to this planet.

The nobel peace prize just the other year was given to Muhammad Yunus who jumpstarted the microcredit movement was motivated by Islam. The women fighting for rights in Iran such as Shirin Ebadi are motivated by Islam. Amr Khaled, a television personality in Egypt and the Arab world, created one of the most comprehensive anti-drug programs in the world. He found motivation from the teachings of the Prophet.

Just because your news media only shows "Muslims killing in the name of Islam" doesn't change the fact that millions of Muslim human rights activists, doctors, lawyers, teachers, reformers are all motivated by the teachings of Islam

and BTW, the Quran does not proscribe "death penalty" on homosexuals. Had you read the Quran, you would know.

Your hatred of all Muslims/Islam... only gives fuel to extremists who want to believe that Western nations are war with Islam.

 

[Críostóir]

The Ottomans, Mughals, Safavids were not direct antithesis to human progress.
The Muslim scholars of the Bait ul-Hikmah in Baghdad who saved the works of the Greeks from destruction, who brought and cultivated knowledge from China, India, and Persia weren't against progress. Rumi wasn't a cancer to this planet.

The nobel peace prize just the other year was given to Muhammad Yunus who jumpstarted the microcredit movement was motivated by Islam. The women fighting for rights in Iran such as Shirin Ebadi are motivated by Islam. Amr Khaled, a television personality in Egypt and the Arab world, created one of the most comprehensive anti-drug programs in the world. He found motivation from the teachings of the Prophet.

Just because your news media only shows "Muslims killing in the name of Islam" doesn't change the fact that millions of Muslim human rights activists, doctors, lawyers, teachers, reformers are all motivated by the teachings of Islam

and BTW, the Quran does not prescribe "death penalty" on homosexuals. Had you read the Quran, you would know.

Your hatred of all Muslims/Islam... only gives fuel to extremists who want to believe that Western nations are war with Islam.

Thank you for this! I will use these examples next time I get into an argument with some bozo about Islam.

You forgot to mention the heroic, noble, and great-souled Abd El Kadr, one of the few Muslims with a US town named after him.

ETA: The French awarded El Kadr the Legion of Honor after he rescued a bunch of Christians from rioting mobs in Damascus; but that was only the crowning achievement of a noble life; that Iowa town was named after him before that.

 

[xxxsultanxxxx]

Thank you for this! I will use these examples next time I get into an argument with some bozo about Islam.

No problem, sexy I actually heard this in a very well-put debate with two female Muslim reformers (including one lesbian and one hijabi).. I will try to hunt it down.

 

[SuperPsyze]

Everybody here seems to be focusing on the behavior of the anti-Islamics, without realizing that the Islamics building the mosque are the ones being insensitive. That's a double standard.

I see the issue as being very similar to this one:

http://www.justusboys.com/forum/showthread.php?t=317551

How is it that they are being insensitive? The 9/11 attacks were done by terrorists who happen to be Muslim. There were mothers, fathers, sons, and daughters of Muslim families working in the World Trade Center when it fell, many of them US Citizens.

The 9/11 attacks had nothing to do with those who practice Islam in the United States, but people keep insisting that it does.

 

[MoltenRock III]

Everybody here seems to be focusing on the behavior of the anti-Islamics, without realizing that the Islamics building the mosque are the ones being insensitive. That's a double standard.

I see the issue as being very similar to this one:

http://www.justusboys.com/forum/showthread.php?t=317551

LMAO! Did you bother to read that thread you posted? Did you notice the vast number of responses was, "who cares", "doesn't matter", "sure let them". This disproves your "double standard" nonsense. Just like the cake, the 600,000 Muslims in New York City can build a community center, and it's no big deal.

Wanna try again?

 

[MoltenRock III]

There were a lot of good, white people in the South, who want to display the Confederate flag without a single sentiment of racism in their bones, but who want to celebrate Southern history.

Then why is flying the Confederate flag such an issue?

How difficult is it for you to understand that just because you don't agree with something or someone, (ie... I don't believe in Islam) isn't the same as denying them their Constitutional rights (ie... trying to stop them from building a community center.) Mob rule doesn't supersede Constitutional rights of the minority. Gay marriage is a perfect example of this.

I vehemently disagree with Fred Phelps and his anti-homosexual tirades he parades and protests with at US soldier's funerals. I do however, fully support his right to free speech, and the government not being able to do much.

 

[Críostóir]

There were a lot of good, white people in the South, who want to display the Confederate flag without a single sentiment of racism in their bones, but who want to celebrate Southern history.

Then why is flying the Confederate flag such an issue?

In what way is a community center, with no dome, no loudspeakers, no minaret, in any way a symbol of Al Qaeda terrorism? I don't see it.

I ask this because the Confederate flag IS a symbol of a particularly vicious racist period in the 20th Century, when the South was fighting to preserve segregation by any means necessary, and these putative "good white people...without a single sentiment of racism in their bones" want to celebrate an attempted nation built on fundamentally racist principles.

What's the superlative of "not really comparable"?