Torchwood

[Críostóir]

OK, I'm writing this before seeing the episode, so I haven't looked at the spoilers either.

It's not necessarily true, Russel T Davies said the implication of his line was only a theory and has refused all forms of media, comics and books etc that explicitly state a connection between the two characters

Well, actually, after CoE Russel T Davies can bite my fucking ass. I hate that guy. So I don't care what he says; if he kills Jack Torchwood MD is some bullshit thing and I will treat it like the three toy commercials that other asshole George Lucas claimed were "Star Wars" movies!

Oswald has got to be the most irritating fucking character on a show since the creation of television.

Just so. Brilliantly played by Bill Pullman, I thought.

I felt the same way about the Battlestar Galactica reboot. I watched a handful of the first season episodes and I never felt compelled to go back and continue watching.

You might want to give that one another try. IMO it just kept getting better and better. It had gut-wrenching drama, compelling characters, and real progress and even redemption for some characters. Good characters corrupted; evil characters redeemed, but also betrayal punished and...

...well. Anyway. It's one continuous story, and every episode builds on the previous one, so catching odd episodes is guaranteed not to work. Watch the opening miniseries in its entirety and then see if you want to go on with it.

Or not. Your choice of course. Just my recommendation.

 

[DigitalFudge]

SPOILERZZZZ

I don't know how to make that box so here we go.


First of all, I knew Rex was immortal as SOON as he got up to kill that sanctimonious prick on his side of the miracle.

If giving the Blood back reversed everything then Jack would be immortal again and since Rex got Jack's blood (The key to everything) he switched back too.

Why did they have to kill the only character I actually liked? I'm so blown. Esther was so cute and she reminds me of my best friend.


I really have no problem with the ending, hopefully we find out what Plan B is.


Now that I think about this is their chance to knock it out of the park. If they can top no one getting killed then they better go for it.


I was still loling when they were talking about the miracle

"They say it reflects yourself back" (Or whatever)

.....Really? The hole does that? It's a fucking hole.

 

[braex27]

The show was trying waaaay too hard to be a lot more philosophical than it needed to be!

Spoiler

Of all the people there, Jack has the most to the guilty about and yet, nothing not reaction?!

And how the heck is it possible that in two of the most densely populated cities, no one in 80 years noticed a giant gaping gap running through through the world - especially given as it's meant to have some profound impact on anyone who gets anywhere near it?!

 

[braex27]

They did say they had to dig quite deep to find it, so I think the idea was that it was really far underground. Some people might have been somehow aware of its presence, like the woman in Shanghai who didnt want to open the door to the alley.

But then they also say it goes right through to the other side?!

Nevermind. These are unimportant. What is important is that it appears the ultimate reveal was quite unsatisfactory.

Shame.

Such potential. Gone.

 

[Stardreamer]

SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER
IF YOU DON'T WANT TO KNOW READ NO FURTHER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Sorry I do know how to make the box but the whole post is a spoiler so why bother.

SPOILERZZZZ

I don't know how to make that box so here we go.


First of all, I knew Rex was immortal as SOON as he got up to kill that sanctimonious prick on his side of the miracle.

If giving the Blood back reversed everything then Jack would be immortal again and since Rex got Jack's blood (The key to everything) he switched back too.

Why did they have to kill the only character I actually liked? I'm so blown. Esther was so cute and she reminds me of my best friend.


I really have no problem with the ending, hopefully we find out what Plan B is.


Now that I think about this is their chance to knock it out of the park. If they can top no one getting killed then they better go for it.


I was still loling when they were talking about the miracle

"They say it reflects yourself back" (Or whatever)

.....Really? The hole does that? It's a fucking hole.

I'm what I call a Techie, originally a Trek Techie one of those people who fell in love with Franz Joseph's wonderful tech manual and blueprints and just got into the fun of trying to figure out how Sci-Fi techno babble would work.

I can see the Blessing making Rex immortal since he was one pole of the system 'reboot?' 'reprogramming?' that was occurring. Sort of a backlash of Jack's condition got implanted on him in the process since for that brief moment he and Jack were linked through the Blessing.

The whole blood thing is confusing the issue really. Jack has stated over and over again, his blood has no special properties. The explanation from Dr. Who for Jack 'condition' is that Rose made him a "fixed point in time".

That is taking a quite a bit of speculating on my part to make sense of. Essentially I think Jack's life force is anchored to the current space time, so he can't really die because his life force (soul?, spirit?) is just yanked back into this reality by that anchor.

The blood wasn't really a the key but a conduit through which Jack's curse was transferred to the life force of the planet itself, which is what I think the Blessing was, a pole of the combined life force of the entire planet similar to magnetic pole.

That is really lame and weak reasoning but its all I have that works. That being the case when the process was reversed, the 'curse' snapped back into Jack and Rex because they were on the ends of the linkage.

Which means that, IMO the least likable character in this new season is now immortal. GRRRR.

 

[Stardreamer]

And here I was thinking the whole season "at least he'll die in the end" :

Yea me too, was actually looking forward to it

 

[Críostóir]

As I said before, Jack isn't dying.

Spoiler

My theory: from the Blessing's point of view, it was Jack on both sides (it only recognized his blood), so the immortality went to both of them.

And you just put the word 'spoiler' in square brackets, ending with the same thing with a slash before the s, and that's how you create the spoiler box.

 

[Stardreamer]

As I said before, Jack isn't dying.

Spoiler

My theory: from the Blessing's point of view, it was Jack on both sides (it only recognized his blood), so the immortality went to both of them.

And you just put the word 'spoiler' in square brackets, ending with the same thing with a slash before the s, and that's how you create the spoiler box.

It is simply a that any argument that Jack cannot be killed based on the connection made in Dr. Who is not really valid. The connection was not solid and as Jack says, the future can change. His survival was more assured by being one of the main characters but British dramas don't have the qualms US shows have about killing off the 'heros'.

 

[roadtripboy]

And you just put the word 'spoiler' in square brackets, ending with the same thing with a slash before the s, and that's how you create the spoiler box.

Thanks for telling us how to do that. Of course now that Torchwood and Big Brother are over or just about over, I won't need to use it and will forget how to do it when I do need it.

 

[Críostóir]

It is simply a that any argument that Jack cannot be killed based on the connection made in Dr. Who is not really valid. The connection was not solid and as Jack says, the future can change. His survival was more assured by being one of the main characters but British dramas don't have the qualms US shows have about killing off the 'heros'.

I wasn't saying he couldn't be killed. I was saying that if he IS killed the show will drop out of the Dr. Who canon that *I* accept. And I've noted that I admit only three Star Wars movies, so appropriate grains of salt go with that!

Thanks for telling us how to do that. Of course now that Torchwood and Big Brother are over or just about over, I won't need to use it and will forget how to do it when I do need it.

Note that I put things under a spoiler tag. Torchwood is delayed in the UK (because it's now a US show). So there are still people who haven't had an opportunity to see it. So it's still a courtesy to tag the spoilers for now. (I think it's a couple of weeks delay.)

 

[roadtripboy]

^That's same reason I kept my rant about Russell T Davis and the Rex character generic.

I think the final episode airs Thursday in the UK.

 

[ILLBFIRE]

This whole season didn't feel like Torchwood to me

 

[braex27]

And here I was thinking the whole season "at least he'll die in the end" :

Yea me too, was actually looking forward to it

Me too. The character was such an arse.

 

[braex27]

It also misses the fundamental point that the world simply does not go on after an event like this.

What government can continue to govern when its revealed they'd been incinerating people?

What world functions when countries have closed off their borders?

How diseased would this place be with all the former category ones having died and are decomposing?

That begs the further question - where the heck would you bury everyone?!

Add to all of that, economies don't automatically jump back into gear. In fact, with everything that's happened, global economics would have gone absolutely to shit!

 

[Críostóir]

braex27, those are all good points, except that dead bodies, I'm told, are not nearly the disease vector people think they are. The idea apparently came from the plague years, when they were much more dangerous than they are now, and burial itself more from a desire to avoid attracting predators to the community (hence the six feet rule: six feet is farther than most scavengers will dig).

As for who will bury them: why bury them at all? Once they're actually dead, the incinerators (which are right on hand, remember) are no longer immoral. Cremation is a fine way to dispose of body that's actually DEAD (in fact it's what I intend to have done with my own body when I'm done with it).

Also, billysosilly is right. Can you imagine the world going right back to normal after the events of CoE? But it did, in that peculiar Torchwood universe.

At this point I'm really hoping there isn't ever another season of Torchwood. It's become really nasty. But if there's another season I'll probably watch it, even if I hate it.

 

[Críostóir]

I don't believe Esther is dead, either. They'd've showed her dying if she were really dead. I think she recovered and Rex helped her disappear, and kept it from Jack and Gwen.

 

[morgaes]

I just finished watching through Miracle Day, and while it was not as good as Children of Earth it was bloody fan-fucking-tastic! I really hope that if they make more series that they won't return to the old "monster of the week" format. This overarching story format is so much more interesting.

I seriously love the fact that in the 3rd and 4th series, Jack is not the main focus of the show. I really cannot stand the character nor the actor. In the scene in CoE where he was buried in cement, I was hoping he'd never be found. Give me some Gwen, Esther or even Rhys instead.

I can tell that the opinions on Oswald are really mixed. I, personally, loved him as a character. He's the guy that you love to loathe but still can't help but have some respect for because he figured out that something was going on before a lot of other people.

Rex being immortal now makes total sense to me. Okay, Jack is immortal because he is now a fixed point in time. But the whole Miracle Day doesn't have anything to do with WHY Jack is immortal, just that he IS immortal. The blessing works through blood and since they used Jack's blood to make everyone immortal and then mortal again, it only makes sense that the blessing has the same rules for everyone sharing that specific blood.

There was not a single episode of MD that I felt was bad. The only episode that I felt slowed down the story was the one that was about Jack's and Angelo's past. Mostly because I thought the end reveal wasn't dramatic enough to warrant such a huge backstory.

 

[braex27]

I don't like that they tried to redeem Oswald. I wanted him to die painfully from the poisons in his body for the murder of that schoolgirl.

 

[Irish Queer]

Oswald didn't really redeem himself as he was shouting to the schoolgirl to run as he was coming. Truthfully I'm still wondering what was the point of Oswald. I saw the Rex thing a mile off I hope we get a new season, although I had issue with this series it was finding its feet. I want to know what plan b is.

 

[nondescript]

I don't like that they tried to redeem Oswald. I wanted him to die painfully from the poisons in his body for the murder of that schoolgirl.

Oswald's sole purpose was to be a way for the writers to point out the evil that supposedly exists in Jack. i.e., they've both deliberately killed little children, therefore they are somehow kindred spirits and recognize something in each other. personally I think RTD is over-reaching when he goes for these grand concepts.