Undying love for my best friend...please read(long

[NameTaken]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

he's lovesick...and there ain't a pill for that.

Oh yeah there is... E

 

[LostVegas]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Small update...buddy called..hes really down to the point that he cant take it anymore.

I started talking memories of what we used to do inb Vegas and in Texas(we all took a road trip there once).

He got a little down..while on the phone the real estate guy called and told my buddy that hes going to call back later with what type of loan they can get an what kind of credit they have....:-(

Anyway ttyl..Vegas

 

[Kyanimal]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Small update...buddy called..hes really down to the point that he cant take it anymore.

I started talking memories of what we used to do inb Vegas and in Texas(we all took a road trip there once).

He got a little down..while on the phone the real estate guy called and told my buddy that hes going to call back later with what type of loan they can get an what kind of credit they have....:-(

Anyway ttyl..Vegas

Hey, Bri!

You really, Really, REALLY, need to do, whatever you can, to get Andy to RUN as far away from that "Real Estate Guy" as You possibly can!!

Sounds like "The Guy" is a "Shark"! Doing some Very Shaky financing just to get his commission! Andy, and "Girl", get the loan (at astronimical terms), sign the papers, move in, and end up (literally) "on the street", a few months later, when the bank repocesses!

Your friends' credit is ruined even further ... perhaps beyond Repair! ... they're now Homeless! ... the bank gets the property (again) ... "Real Estate Guy" gets his commission (again) ... and the whole set-up is "recocked" for the next sucker(s)!!

Get "The Picture"??

Your Bro, and his Girl, are very much in DANGER of being tempted to fall into a very Deep, Dark, Hole!! You NEED to make Them see that!! You have to be very "Frank" about this! Warn about possible "trampled feelings" before you get into it ... but ... you HAVE to make them SEE this!!

Best of Luck with this, Bri! But ... it's something that MUST be done! For THEIR Good!! And ... QUICKLY So!!

My Heart, and Thoughts, are with YOU!!
Chaz

 

[LostVegas]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Hey guys back with a small update....Hope you all had a nice day(or few days) off...

Called my buddy this morning around 10am his time..was missing him dearly and was heartsick about missing Vegas.

He called back but got my dad..he was visiting my apt..and I was out.

I got in and called him back a little later on..and we just got to talking.

He said that electricians' job wanted a years worth of experience...and that he wouldnt be able to get it.

His girl was at work. Him and his mom were BBQing on a grill she bought him.

He seemed to be rather jovial..I knew something was up.

He eventually admitted to me that hes playing in a poker tournament tonight for free.

I go where?. He goes online.

I act happy for him but inside I want to scream at him or warn him of the dangers of gambling on a head hes in. Ive done it a million times before. I guess he will only listen when something bad happens. Yeah hes playing for free with a shot at winning money..so technically there is nothing to lose on the outside looking in..but I think by even playing hes slowly losing his grip on the importance of doing the right thing right now.

You know what? Im nowhere near perfect. Hell I even gambled when I wasnt supposed to. But lesson learned. I wont do it anymore if I cant. And thank God I had th ability to quit it cold turkey.

My buddy however does not. Hes intent on becoming a poker champion. I know my buddy has a dream and I walk a fine line of being "dream-killer" and "Mr. Rational" when I talk to him about it.

There is nothing I can do.

He is either going to keep losing or win one day and rub it in my face and say "see I told you it would pay off"

Hey buddy? I hope it pays off..I could use a nice amount of money right now.

Anyway we joked around and around and eventually he said "Oh this girl on TV is fucking hot."

I went dead quiet...I got down..I know it sounds immature and babyish and selfish..but my heart sank.

He knew it and asked what was up..I just chalked it to being down about Vegas..

I guess Im still in love wit him and even though rationally sometimes I seem to be moving ok...my heart kicks me in the ass with thoughts that are otherwise.

I do not want to be someone who keeps updating you guys on my love for my buddy.

I want to post an update saying how I have managed to get passed this.

I look at "newbie" threads all the time about a love for a straight friend/buddy/roommate and it sinks my heart.

I want to reply to all of those..but when I press the reply button, I simply do not know whereto begin.

Its hard for a gay man sometimes, in more ways than one.

This thread..I hope..serves some purpose...I know you see it as me updating you on the nuances and minutia of my daily life with my buddy..but I hope some who are in the same situation can look at it and learn.

Learn how to come out.
Learn how to admit to your friend if you have feelings for him.
Learn how freeing both those things can be..and scary.
Learn to admit to yourself that you might lose a good friend over this.
Learn how good it can actually turn out.
Learn how bad it can actually turn out.
Learn all the right and wrong things to do.
Learn what good friends are supposed to be like.
Learn how to still love him and move on.

Im having trouble with the last one. Im not a dumb guy JUBers...The heart is a complicated thing...I know fully that the reason Im like this is because:

I have really nobody in my life.
I have no partner.
I grew up socially deprived from what I went through.
Besides work I dont have any friends.
My only friends I have are the two that moved to Vegas.
And one of those Im in love with.

Soilwork mentioned in another thread that guys who have crushes on straight friends or guys in a sense have very low or poor self esteem...that seems to be true with me.

Im kind of down and crying right now . Could use some advice. I know none of you KNOW me and my buddy..but please the best advice you can possible give to me to help me move on would be appreciated. Im kind of flat out asking for some shoulders to lean on. -(Heart Lost in Vegas) ttyl...

 

[Soilwork]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Oh man, I hate showing up this late to a party.

But you asked me to join in..and you asked me to be brutally honest, so here goes.

Get over it. Now. This has gone on long enough.

You've wasted months on this.. and you know it.

It's pointless.. it's kinda like seeing that kid next door trying to dig a hole to china... you have to kinda admire his inability to accept the truth and move on, but in the end, it's still kinda sad to see someone wasting their time and energy.

So cut it out.

Stop wallowing in the freaking self-pity party for one that's been encompasing your days. Stop telling yourself that this is the guy for you, because he's not.. he's a straight guy who's incapable of returning any of your feelings, and he's never going to.

If you want out.. and I know you do, because you asked me to help you here (in a PM, people...), you're going to have to meet us half way... well. no.. you're going to have to do it with us cheering from the sidelines.

Get some gay friends.. you live in freaking Brooklyn.. it's not like there aren't enough gay men your age for you to hang with. Start to meet people who have your interests, who want what you want out of life.

You'll soon meet someone who's capable of being more than a friend who's oblivious to your feelings, and you'll forget all about ever felling anything but friendship for him.

Or, you can just stay in your little rut, but I have a feeling you'r ready to move on.

you are, right?

 

[LostVegas]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Thanks Soil...yeah I am ready to move on.

And I agree with all that you have said.

I agree about the meeting people part. I think it is truly the key to getting out of this "rut"...thanks!

Ill continue to get back to you guys with my progress.

And hopefully...after that is started I will spend less time here...In a way I kind of know what people mean when they want a break from the boards..it can be all too encompassing..

I love all you guys for the strentgh you gave me to come out...and now you are giving me the same strangth to move on..thanks.

 

[cumluv]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Hey Bri. Good luck with moving on. I think your doing the right thing. Even tho it's going to be tough. No mater what happens JUST MAKE YOUR SELF HAPPY . And you'll do fine. Bri you have a supper big heart any guy who goes out with you or knows you is lucky. Just keep teaching.

 

[CGHJ]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Hey Jasun...the only problem with showing up late is that you don't know what's happened up to this point yet. Andy isn't straight, he's more in love with Brian than Brian is in love with him. Andy needs help coming out, not a cold shoulder.

Brian, you could get out of that rut by simply accepting some flier miles and going to Vegas for a weekend. Is that really more difficult that breaking up with someone that loves you, who's only problem is that they're so messed in the head with love for you that he almost can't stand it anymore? You think you've got it bad, think of poor Andy. If you walk away I think he'll be suicidal. Don't underestimate how he feels about you.

Take the flier miles, and go to Vegas. Then you'll know. You're both pining for the way things were, either your passion will explode and you'll be able to move on to the next step, or you'll realize that you were trying to capture something from the past that is now gone, and you'll be able to move on to your next step. In any case, this is something that you should not decide before you go to Vegas.

You have a responisibility byond yourself now Brian, more than just making yourself happy. You've led Andy out to the side of a cliff, which from his conversations it sounds like he is now sliding down. I know you won't just leave him there.

 

[LostVegas]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

CG-Have you been getting any of my emails????? Just curious..Vegas

 

[Lube]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Andy isn't straight, he's more in love with Brian than Brian is in love with him. Andy needs help coming out, not a cold shoulder.

That just sounds awfully optimistic.

Sure, we know Andy is in love, but will Andy admit it publicly? With his conservative/Catholic upbringing? And a fiance? You just make this sound too easy.

I hope you're right.

 

[CGHJ]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Sure, we know Andy is in love, but will Andy admit it publicly? With his conservative/Catholic upbringing? And a fiance? You just make this sound too easy.

Based on personal experience, it should be. It's obvious Andy wants to come out, it's obvious that his heart belongs to Brian. Tons of married catholic men have come out, better it happens now before the wedding, a catholic divorce would be 10 times as messy.

Also, I never actually said anything about easy. A friend is in trouble, who cares if it's easy or not? How many guys post to these boards wanting to know how to come out even though they're in some kind of whack situation that makes it almost impossible?

How great would the ire be if someone posted and said, "I have this gay friend who's in the closet...I can tell he wants to come out but I don't want to deal with it...he's always hinting that he's gay and that he likes me and I'm gay and I think he's hawt...but I just don't want the bother of dealing with it, I'd rather move on." We'd crucify him! Soilwork would crucify him!!

Aside from that though, this should be as easy as falling downhill. Brian goes to Vegas, treats Andy like a King, doesn't mention love until Andy brings it up and then says, "You know I'd give anything to have you back with me. We wouldn't have to worry about money, you could be my househusband. Come with me Andy and we'll start a new life together." Done deal. Brian, I guarantee that if you show up in Vegas and are nothing but awesome to Andy, when he goes home to his girl and she bitches at him it'll be a done deal. But you gotta take those flier miles. DO IT!!

 

[CGHJ]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

You know also Brian if I get adamant about something, it's cuz I care. I always worry that my my posts come off heavy handed...but then I realized, I'm in the middle of editing a video with my straight buddy. Who is actually straight, not bi at best, we don't have anything even approaching the relationship you do, and I managed to get him to go all the way and I mean he was sucking cock like a pro by the end. It took two days and a lot of alcohol, but I do feel like I know what I'm talking about.

If Andy were not in love with you I'd tell you to move on. But if you're in love with each other, the rest seems surmountable. Perhaps difficult, but a difficult problem is better than an impossible one.

My buddy, his fiancee came back (long story but they were separated without contact when we were making the videos...she actually called in the middle of one to say she was coming back to him...he strokes himself through the whole thing and I taped it). We talked briefly the other day and we're as good of friends as ever, but they're busy starting their life together now, and she has me blacklisted cuz I'm a pornographer. So I had to step back and walk away, there's no hope in that situation. He's straight, and the girl of his dreams he thought he'd lost forever just comes back out of the blue, giving him a second chance at happiness. I'm not gonna fuck with that! Besides, when she fucks him over again he'll be at my house drinking again. The girl of Andy's dreams, however, is you. He's not straight, and it's not like we have to work some magic to get you two together, the only thing holding it back is being stuck in LV with his girl, a relationship that I think clearly he would prefer to end so he could be with you.

If it were hopeless I'd say give up, but it's so not hopeless. There's just that one minor detail. I mean, you don't have to get him to pick you, he's already made that decision. You have to help him come to terms with that decision.

I also urge you to remember that you both like to toy with each other. Whenever he says there's some hot chicka on the telly, he knows perfectly well how hard he's razzing you, just like you did when you brought up the chain (although to a much lesser degree). It's that game you like to play, nothing more. For real, I'm prolly about 10 times straighter than Andy is

I do sort of agree that the alternative to all this is to break up with him. People break up with people they love all the time, I have. Even if you care for someone very deeply, it may just not be the right thing.

And you'd have to break up with him, literally, otherwise he takes all the energy of a real long distance relationship, and you need to pursue your own. It would however be a shame to break up because you loved him, not in spite of it, know what I mean?

And how are you going to do that? Andy, I love you, never call here again? Ring ring...ring ring...ring ring...I think it would be easier to go forward actually, go to Vegas and make him fall in love with you...sweep him off his feet and make him feel like a king and then get him drunk. He'll never look back. It might take another month for it to get unbearable for him ("Is that Brian on the phone? What were you two doing out so late when he was here?! You know what I'm talking about!") but he will break, if you MAKE him love you.

I say that in absolute seriousness too. You know it would work.

 

[Lube]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Based on personal experience, it should be. It's obvious Andy wants to come out

Wants to is not the same as is willing to.

All that talk about The Green Door and whatnot makes me think Andy wants Brian to be part of his relationship with his fiance, or as a secret buddy on the side. It sounds like he is not willing to think of himself as 'gay'.

My other concern (I was going to PM you, but it looks like you have it disabled) is that Andy is expert at using Brian for money. Is this a healthy relationship? Is Andy expert at sounding lovey-dovey to Brian because he knows that'll get him money?

I hate to be a cynic, but there are people like that.

Now that Brian isn't sending money, will Andy want to end the relationship? Will that devastate Brian?

Sorry to be the pessimist here, but this sounds a lot more complicated than simply a guy who needs a push to come out of the closet.

 

[CGHJ]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

You're right, Brian might get hurt.

And a great way to avoid getting hurt would be if Brian went and lived on a tropical island somewhere.

It's this simple: Brian wants to be with Andy, and he can be if he so chooses. Whether Andy is good for Brian I don't know, that's not my problem. Is Andy using Brian's money to start a mafia kickback scheme at the Flamingo? Maybe. Does Andy have an incurable illness that will manifest itself in a few years, slowly draining Brian of the will to live? Possibly. Are there about a million ways that Brian can get hurt? Sure are. Will it work out? I dunno.

If Andy ends the relationship because Brian isn't sending money then Brian's problem is solved. However assuming that Andy isn't a leech out to suck Andy dry, then the issue still remains that they can be together if Brian wants. I mean, your answer is, "Maybe they're not really friends". Well, maybe they are, and if they are, Andy needs Brian's help to come out and be happy, and if Brian walks away he'll be crushed.

 

[Lube]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

OK, as long as we got this all out in the open, I'm fine with what you're saying. I just want Brian going into this with his eyes wide open.

 

[CGHJ]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Just so you all know, I worry about all that stuff too...to the point that sometimes it keeps me awake at night.

 

[Lestat62]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Hey guys, the one thing that none of us should be saying is if Andy is gay, bi or striaght. Only Andy knows. And the only other person that may have an idea as to Andy's sexual preferences is Brian. None of us have ever talked to Andy. Even if Brian told us their conversations word for word, we still couldn't, and shouldn't for that matter, make a determination. We would have to hear Andy's voice, see his body language, to even give us hint of what's up with him.

Bri, you know how I feel about this. Get out and meet more people.... and anybody that only cares about personal appearance is not friend material.

Joe.

BTW - I've got really big shoulders...

 

[JakeLucas]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

.....Im kind of down and crying right now . Could use some advice. I know none of you KNOW me and my buddy..but please the best advice you can possible give to me to help me move on would be appreciated. Im kind of flat out asking for some shoulders to lean on. -(Heart Lost in Vegas) ttyl...

Brian,

You asked for advice...

...here it is.

And brace yourself, buddy, because this is going to be brutally honest.

The way I see things, you have 3 options.

First option:
You want to "get over" Andy? There is only one way. Here's how you do it...cold turkey. Call him up. Tell him he's the best friend you've ever had...the best friend anybody could ever hope for. Tell him you are in love with him and always have been. Then tell him this is the last time he will ever hear from you. Tell him you are sorry, then hang up. Change your phone number. And never speak to him again.

Sure, Andy will be out of his f*cking mind miserable...he may even get suicidal. But what will you care? You will be "over him".

Second option:
Go on the way you have been. Go on being miserable that you only have 99% of what you want. Go on believing that 99% isn't good enough.

Third option:
Come to your senses, buddy. Wake up. Realize that Andy is in love with you. Look at the relationship you two have as if you were a "third party"....as if it were two other people. Think about the way Andy talks to you...and then tell me he is not in love with you. Yeah, Andy tells you he is "straight". But guys who are completely straight don't say the things Andy does.
Guys who are completely straight don't want to know the details about gay sex. Guys who are completely straight don't work their buddies into a frenzy with sex talk, then ask if they are jerking off.

Do you really want to give up the 99% of Andy you have, just because you don't have that last 1%? You two are "celibate lovers"...lovers in every sense of the word except for the sex... so far.

We love you, Brian. We want you to be happy. Don't choose to be miserable. Be happy with your best friend, brother, soul mate.

 

[LostVegas]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Hey guys...back with another small update.

By the way thanks for all the continued advice, and guidance and overall help through this.

LET ME CLEAR THIS UP...Andy does not use me...he is not in it for my money...there is no more money for me to give...and we are tighter than ever..we have a close bond still...a bond so strong its scary.

My buddy called me two nights ago and we talked from 2am-6:30 my time. One of my cordless phones went dead, so I had to switch to another one..thats how long we talked.

We talked about anything and everything...except anything sexual...when he tries to venture there I sort of laugh it off and change the topic.

He eventually asked me.."can I ask you a question?"

"Sure" I said.

Ever think you are just bisexual? I think you are bisexual...I think you would get pleasure from a woman.

I said bro..Im pretty sure Im gay...I can be clicking with a woman on every level but sexually..I just cant do it.

He said he has a theory...he thinks that everyone is born bisexual and that, depending on how they are brought up or stuff that happens to them, they either turn out gay or straight. He said sometimes he thinks its a choice.

I explained to him my feelings on that matter.

In my head I just couldnt believe he was talking about this..it was pretty cool. So Im like bro...you mean to say that you think we are all bisexual and we pretty much choose whether we like women or men..?

And he says yeah I do.

We talked a little more..it was one of our best conversations.

He said he couldnt talk about this with his other friends and that he so glad that we can talk like this and talk about anything.

He also said he couldnt believe...that besides his girl and his mom, how much he could care for someone else..how much he wound up caring for me...

We got on the topic of lying..and I told him flat out..bro I know there are a lot of things you lie or fib aout..I just know it..and I go they might be big or small but I know it...and he goes ok, ok I do..so why dont you tell me what you think I lie or fib about ..I go bro I dunno...I just do...we both started laughing about it for some odd reason..becasue I called him out on it and he fessed up(He did say he never lied to me about the money and it all went to needful things, never spent on gambling, etc)


We had a great talk..and the next few days we had nice ones too..

Tonight I went out to Coney Island...had a great time..watched some awesome fireworks...ate some great tasting food.

Andy called and I told him where I was and I had to tell him and he got really down...I told him I would call him later and he said..you promise? I go of course buddy..I promise..

TTYL...Vegas

 

[Kulindahr]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Catching up took me a while....

Bri, I really hope what some of these guys are saying turns out to be true. I'd love to hear that you went to Vegas and got together and after drinking and some casinos and a movie you and Andy ended up on the floor with clothes strewn about, sucking each other and falling asleep in each other's arms.