Undying love for my best friend...please read(long

[hanshansen]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

What a mess … I probably shouldn’t be posting to this board any more. There are no easy answers. If you give him the money no strings attached, he will use it up and based on history I don’t think you can count on him settling a steady job and finding his own two feet. So this will happen again and again. If you don’t want him out on the street (how do these things work in the US? Has he used up all his welfare entitlements?) the only thing I can come up with is this: you need to give him the money conditional on him cutting his losses and coming back to NY (with his gf) so that you can keep watch over what he does with the money and his time and actively help him do what he needs to do to get a job, get educated, and stick at it. Because without help I really don’t think he going to make it out there. The other alternative is you going to Vegas and looking after him there but that would probably be bad for you even if it’s temporary.

If you’re not around him, do you think you could get him to work through the problems he has sustaining a job, getting the further education he needs, dealing with his learning difficulties? There must be people who offer help with that sort of thing professionally? Sorry, I realise that I’m being very naive. My problems are minuscule by comparison.

 

[Kulindahr]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

There are states where the notice required when a building is sold is only 14 days. I got caught in that once! Not fun.

 

[JackFTwist]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

What a mess … I probably shouldn’t be posting to this board any more.

not so.

you have posted very thoughtful responses and have been a great friend.

Keep on posting, bro!

 

[backpacker]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

There are states where the notice required when a building is sold is only 14 days. I got caught in that once! Not fun.

By my reading of NRS 40.251 and NRS 118A.244, I believe 30 days is required assuming they are currently on a month to month tenancy. If they under a lease that extends beyond 30 days, I believe they would have to show cause to terminate the lease early.

Andy should consult an attorney to know what his rights are for sure. There are free legal services available in Clark County that handle Landlord-Tenant issues.

I would be interested in knowing what state allowed for only 14 days notice.

 

[Kyanimal]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Hey, Bri ...

I'm sorry, Buddy, but I have to agree with the others, and vote "NO!" on the 2K. Even if it's do-able, I don't feel you would be doing Andy any REAL favors. And especially in light of his latest trip back to NY, no matter how much you love him, I've seen nothing that would indicate that he "deserves" it from you, anyway.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying he should do anything to "earn" it. Friends don't operate "Quid pro Quo". And Lord knows I've "evaporated" funds, knowingly, for what I felt were worthwhile causes, never expecting "pay back". The money is not the issue here. And I'm leary about getting the feeling, that from Andy's side, that it is Precisely the issue! I could be wrong, though. I don't know him. But there does seem to be a pattern ...

Andy is a major Concern for you, and I applaud you for that, the type of guy You are, but He is NOT Your Responsibility! He, and his Girl, are their Own responsibilities, especially with the now upcoming wedding, and all. THEY need to learn to take care of Themselves! And the only way for them to do that is to have to deal with what is facing THEM. LEARN They Must! For Their own good. I know ... "Tough Love" ...

But ... you also don't have to completely say "No", for your own peace of mind. Just explain that things are tight, and, for right now, though you wish you could do more, only $500 is available, or whatever "number" you might consider. The rest of whatever he thinks he needs is up to him and "the wife". (You don't have to say "that"!) I also get the feeling that 2K is not what he REALLY needs/wants. He could be pulling a "doubler", and hoping to get what he needs. I could be wrong, though. Just a thought ... You know??

Don't tear Youself up over this! If Andy is, indeed, the True Friend that you claim, he should be all right with whatever answer you give. (Including "Zero".) Do you catch what I'm trying to say here?

In any case, whatever YOU decide ...

Keep smilin'!!
Chaz

 

[LostVegas]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

I kind of told Andy I would be there for him...he has called me several times today..and I was a little cold to him and depressed.

I might tell him I cant help him this time.

He wants me to help him by monday.

I want to tell him that Im trying to save money for MY life and maybe if I find somebody..so I can have a future with someone.

I mean I wonder if his girl would be up for supporting and bailing me and my partner out time after time....something tells me as nice asshe is..that she wouldnt put up with it long...if at all.

I feel like a loser sometimes...Im feeling very empty..I have not a soul here in NYC to hang out with...movingto Vegas is now out of the question. I want to be here.

Im not crying pity...but I really do have no one here to talk to or to physically hang out with.

Its very hard. Andy should know by now what money does to my head and the bad memories of him it takes me back to...If I do lend this money to him it will have to be paid back to me for sure. But at this point...my mood is turning from sadness to a little anger about this situation..

His mom called me tonight and she said that she feels sorry for Andy....blah blah blah...how bout for fucking me??? And the emotional and financial stress I have been through??? Who the fuck thinks of me???

Brian

 

[hanshansen]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Thanks, JackFTwist.

Brian, just in case you do seriously consider going down that route … if you give Andy a loan, my guess is he’ll plead bankruptcy (so to speak), you’ll find it hard to call him up on it, and who knows, he might genuinely end up have difficulties paying it off, the way he’s going. In any case it will hang over your friendship.

If I were you I would tell him what you told us, i.e. I need to build up a life in NY, plus you asking me for money is painful for these various reasons and I think it is not good for our friendship. Be helpful: dig deeper into what his circumstances are and where else he could get/save cash.

An important reason I suggested making any money conditional on him moving back to NY (I guess you would also need to pay for the flight in that case) is that this would be (a) something you could enforce and (b) something that requires some sacrifice on Andy’s part. Of course, this may be a crap idea for a whole number of reasons, including that he might think you are blackmailing him to get him back near you in NY. Anyway, it’s only relevant if you decide you can’t refuse him the money.

For what it’s worth, I think (from rereading so much of this thread yesterday) that Andy is a guy with really bad (I mean appallingly bad) habits who genuinely feels that meeting you changed him for the better and has the best of intentions. My guess is he feels very sorry when he realises he has let you down and is certain it will be better next time. It’s really too bad he doesn’t have other sources of moral support. He needs help kicking these habits, and he was there for you in earlier times when you were working through your issues, but you can’t let it take over your life.

I just hope you will feel freer to reassess things and make some friends in NY.

 

[LostVegas]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Hey JUBers thanks for all the advice.

Im really in a depressed state. But it is no nearly as bad as last night. Back in the day(just a few short years ago) my depression would completely take over. Those long stretches seem to only last a few hours now...or overnight.

Andrew called me last night. He had just come home from an office Christmas party for his girl's workplace. I asked him how it was...he said fine.

And then that is when I unloaded.

He asked me why I was down...and why I was angry.

I told him a few things, but for the most part it's the money.

I told him it's taking an emotional toll on me as well as financial. I told him this kind of money needs to be going to MY future....and whoever I settle down with. That this was the kind of money I invest with a partner who settles down with me. I told him I cant support two people anymore. I told him that his girl wouldnt shell out nearly the fraction(if at all anything) if me and my partner needed something. I told him that while he initially would help me becasue we are close friends...that even after a while he would put a stop to it too.

I likened this situation to me living with him and his girl. And I dont pay rent...but I keep eating their food and using their phone for lon distance calls, etc. Eventually they would grow weary of it.

I told him his friends are scumbags...and that if he didnt FULLY realize it now he should. I told him: a)you won't tell them your situation or ask for help because they would say no and make you feel worse OR b) you are too ashamed to tell them whats going on. I told him either way that shows you what kind of friends they are. PERIOD.

He said its hard for him to tell his friends. I go, "I was the first person you told was I not?? Im your friend no? Did I judge you or brign you down?"

I told him at the very least...he could help me out and make me feel a little comfortable in this situation Why not even offer to pay it back???? Why not mak it easy on me too?? He said, "You know I dont have the money right now to pay it back..and I wont have it for a while.."

I said, "So what? I'm not pressuring you for a time-frame or a certain amount right away...Im just asking that you even offer the gesture to pay it back..that would make it easier.."

Andy and I made a deal that he was going to pay me back a 100 dollar loan I gave him months ago...time came and went and nothing...not even a mention of it. I told him if he cant even bother to pay back a 100 dollar loan...why would I trust him to pay back 2 grand?? I told him, "Bro its not like Im desperate for the 100 bucks...I did that to see what would happen..and what you would do.."

I told him what I did with him was wrong. I enabled him. I was his enabler. I told him this time around is the first time something bad happened to him that he had no control over. I asked him about all the other times. I told him I should have shown him tough love. That he never saw ONE consequence from doing the wrong thing. He never learned one thing...the only thing he DID learn was to come to m automatically for help(which is fine, friends do that, but to the extent that he does).

I asked him where his girl thinks this fucking money is coming from?...I asked if they both thought I was a fucking bank or ATM machine??

He said he was sorry for putting me through all of this and maybe he shouldnt have asked me for the money.

I told him not to lay a guilt trip on me. I told him that I am his brother and I would do anything for him...but he is draining me emotionally and financially.

He said maybe I want to see him fail out there so he can come back home to NYC...And I called BULLSHIT. I go why would I go and be a selfish prick and make a friend fail at something just to get what I want?? If I wanted to I could have done that months ago!!!!!! And many times!!! I told him if I wanted him back in NY I would have already asked him.

I go, "You have the life you want there...I see that you are very settled in Vegas..so why would I ask you to move back here to NYC...Im done with it.."

His response was that, "I dont have the kind of life I want here.."

I told him this money should be going to me....I work a steady job and get steady pay and do the right thing and ask no one for help...and what do I get?? An apartment that needs to be rennovated and furnished before I can even remotely invite someone over here, let aloene begin to make friends....and YOU have the nice new truck...and you have people bailing you out all the time...and you have the wedding next summer...and you seem to be moving on fine...and you seem to be muddling on through life like nothing affects you...you seem to still, even in your darkest times...to be getting what you want and need..

He said I could have all I want in Vegas to which I shot back, "Well you could have had anything you wanted here...All the money I have been putting up for you could have easily kept you here...you could have had two steady, great paying job here(Gym and Pepsi-his FIL works there)!!! You could have had me here... But you threw that all away!"

None of our tone with each other was angry...he sat and listened to all I had to say..and it did feel good to vent it.

I told him I was tired and he also said he wanted to go...that he felt very ba a what I was saying to him.

We both hung up. Im sure we will talk today.

Brian

 

[hanshansen]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Can hardly express what a good start to the week it has been to read this ... anyway, I've been having internet problems where I live during the week, plus I really shouldn't let this affect me while I work, so I guess I will be seeing what happens on Friday! Best of luck.

 

[backpacker]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Brian,

I'm so proud of you. You told him exactly what he needed to hear. This may create a temporary riff in your friendship, but it will make it far better in the future. Stay strong and don't feel guilty for telling what he needed to hear. You just gave him a dose of tough love.

 

[RicanDAB]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Lord, you go to the boyfriend's on one little overnight visit and the Vegas thread grows like weed!

First of all, Brian -- for tough-lovin' on Andy! I know it hurts to have finally done this to someone you really love, but I KNOW you're feeling better having done this and he REALLY needed to hear it. I have no idea what he must be thinking but if he was smart it would be a wake up call for him to realize what he has been doing to you. When one is in financial straits like he is, it's not wise to continue living the life of Riley -- he obviously refuses to make sacrifices. If you're broke, why are you driving a TRUCK and paying at least $70 a tankful of gas? Why are you not driving a smaller car? This is the least of all the examples we could name.

When I read about the $2000 and it was for rent and bills - my first thought was: OK, Brian if you're REALLY gonna do this - you need to give him checks payable to the leasing agent, the electric company, the phone company, etc. If they money is truly for those expenses, then he should not have a problem with this. YOU'RE in control since you are shelling out this $$. If he had a problem with this and expected cash so that HE can pay, I would have serious doubts that this money would end up all on bills and part of it would certainly go on entertainment or -- heaven forbid -- the casinos after all this IS Las Vegas. But as I kept reading it looks like this issue may be moot - but if it is still on the table, Brian, it is something to consider if you really feel compelled to go through with the "loan".

I have lent my cousin money in the past and he has notoriously failed to pay me back as he promises. I ended up getting paid back only after severe hounding on my part, especially when I noticed he could afford new luxury items such as electronics for the home costing more than my loans. I got his little wifey involved since I was a little desperate at the time, not cool I know, but it was effective. Needless to say, I made it clear the last time that this would forever be the last time -- he remains clear on this and despite it all we're still close family.

Bri, we may not be there in person for you -- but at least know that we ARE real people and thankfully the internet connects us all across the miles! All of us who've rallied with you on this thread should road trip to Brooklyn and give you a big ol' ! I think you really need that!

That begs the question in my mind: WHERE HAS DOG-WALKER HOTTIE BEEN??

 

[Kulindahr]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

My deeper thoughts have already been said, above.
So I'll go with just two:

THAT ROCKS!

 

[frankfrank]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Oh yes yes YES!!!!!



I haven't posted in your thread in a while, but it has still been my most eagerly awaited thread through the duration. When did I post something last in this thread? About three months ago?

I've been slowed due both to "massive" travels and "massive" projects, along with the Christmas and end-of-year stuff coming up. So in recent weeks I've mostly been reading JUB only, and occasionally posting to something or starting a small thread. I've been eagerly reading your thread without fail, regardless of how busy I get.

Again...three months ago? THINGS ARE SO DIFFERENT, and I'd say that I feel things will come out well in the end. I believe that's true with his living situation as well.

I've been simply stunned and totally impressed how YOU have evolved in the past several months. You could have so very easily "caved" now, and you didn't. Your most recent long posting (outside of something you may be posting now...) told us of the discussion, where you told Andy a number of things that he HAD to hear, and which he must consider and heed as he can. I think I've noticed a major adjustment, some major soul-searching, and a goodly number of very mature New York decisions, once the Thanksgiving weekend passed. Let's all hope - and pray, if it's appropriate - that Andy has taken your comments and suggestions to his heart. I'm confident that, as much as it may "hurt" right now, he will be a better and stronger person in the end.

You have also gotten advice from a lot of people who care, Brian - some being people who have "been around" for a long time, some being people who are exploring their own evolving maturity - there is a lot of caring here! You had the courage to post all of this in public, on the internet, and I think the rewards have been very real. You have done your best to consider what had been said, even by people you may not have fully agreed with. If you had instead merely held all of this inside, I think things would be very different - and I do NOT mean this in a good way at all - for you, Andy, AND his fiancee.

It will still be at least three or four weeks before I can hope to have my next "JUB marathon" of any kind, but I will continue reading this thread eagerly. And where I see parallels with me, I am taking your (and other JUBbers') postings as possible life lessons for myself as well. I have the feeling there are MANY of us learning from this thread - even myself - a guy who will be 60 in less than a year.

I have ABSOLUTELY no advice to give you, Brian. So many people here have given you advice more articulately than I feel I can. Everything I feel about your situation has been addressed by you, or by your many friends in this group.

Good luck with ALL of this, and may the results be good for all involved. I think chances are excellent for that.

 

[tpeezy101]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

^I think you did the right thing by telling him. You said what needed to be said. I guess it's his turn to think things over. Goodluck w/ the situation.

 

[LostVegas]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Well...today I took off because I was too stressed.

I went to Toys R Us and Modells Sporting Goods to get some real cool shit for this under-priveledged student at school.

I also lent Andy 1400 dollars. I say "lent" because he swore he would repay me. It was down from 2k because his mom helped him out a little.

Trust me..I didnt willingly give it to him...I gave him more of a talk and it made him feel bad..but what can I do. I was pretty angry. I laid into him pretty good.

But he understood, and he let me vent. I told him we will talk later.

Hes going to a Cox Cable job fair on Wednesday.

Will update you guys soon...Brian

 

[LostVegas]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

Talked to Andy throughout the day, we were mostly down...the only time we came out of it was when he started talking about my love of cock and how I cant get enough of it. He jokingly goes "Are you getting hard now?? you better not be wacking off when your on the phone with me". I told him he would be surprised where I have wacked off before...he goes "bro did you jack off in my apt??"

I go yeah, every apt you been in..in your shower...then I jokingly told him.."hey you remember that missing underwear and those pair of missing socks?? I told him those were my cumrags"..he laughed it off. We started playing a game of "what would you do for so and so amount"

He said for a billion dollars he would have sex with a guy...he said he wouldnt like it but for that money he would do it. Just another reminder of how straight he is.

I talked to him about how I want to find the right guy here and fall in love and share many memories with the man of my dreams and travel...he said "but yeah, then you are going to forget about me.."

We joked around and then he said something to set me off, and then I started back with him, and I just hung up on him. Im sure we will speak later...Brian

 

[xyzguy]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

So what did he say to set you off?

 

[Kulindahr]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

If that was a loan, did you get anything in writing? I loaned a bunch to my best buddy once, and I hold the title to his car. Without something serious, do you expect him to take it seriously?

 

[RicanDAB]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

If that was a loan, did you get anything in writing? I loaned a bunch to my best buddy once, and I hold the title to his car. Without something serious, do you expect him to take it seriously?

I totally agree with Kulindahr, and honestly I do not see this loan paid back, especially when a much smaller $100 loan was not either - Andy clearly knows now that eventually you will give him whatever money he asks for no matter how much grief he gets from you.

 

[LostVegas]

Re: Undying love for my best friend...please read(long)

I know what you all were thinking. In fact I almost didnt post that I lent him that money because of the reaction I would get. But this thread is an open book, so I didnt hold back.

I had an intense conversation with Andy in regards to the money. It will definitely get paid back in full.

Of course I thank you for the concern. But I made sure before sending it to be concrete about him returning it. He fully knows the consequences of not returning this loan.

Vegas