Bradley Manning [merged]

[JayHawk]

Re: Am I sympathetic to Bradley Manning simply because he's gay?

That Manning has been imprisoned without trial thus far, suggests that he did do something astonishing - sufficiently, astonishing to warrant allegations of treason.

Cowards never imperil their freedoms. If Manning were ignorant he would not be receiving the treatment that he is currently suffering.

Bull fucking shit.

The reason he hasnt been tried is because of legal counsel procedure by his own counsel. Speak not of that which you do not know. You sound a helluva a lot like ALex Jones... full of conspiracy and bullshit more than fact and reason.

 

[JayHawk]

Re: Am I sympathetic to Bradley Manning simply because he's gay?

That Manning has been imprisoned without trial thus far, suggests that he did do something astonishing - sufficiently, astonishing to warrant allegations of treason.

Cowards never imperil their freedoms. If Manning were ignorant he would not be receiving the treatment that he is currently suffering.

I could do exactly as manning did however, I am not a coward and I understand the context of the information I am given access to in the course of my job. Manning did not understand , nor is it possible in the time he had access for him to understand the documents or the information contained. He simply sought to do harm. He knew he could not personally harm the US government but he knew he could be a traitor to his country and get someone else to do it. That is cowardice. He should be shot.

 

[kallipolis]

Re: Am I sympathetic to Bradley Manning simply because he's gay?

Bull fucking shit.

The reason he hasnt been tried is because of legal counsel procedure by his own counsel. Speak not of that which you do not know. You sound a helluva a lot like ALex Jones... full of conspiracy and bullshit more than fact and reason.

You will note that I do not employ personal insults sticking to the topic at hand.

 

[bankside]

Re: Am I sympathetic to Bradley Manning simply because he's gay?

No deep down you wish during the Bush administration he could have exposed the Iran Contra affair, and guess what?? when a soldier or Sailor exposes malfeasance then they are NOT placed in prison. It is their JOB to uphold the just orders they are given. Manning is a tool who was used, he has no honor, he has no value (gay or straight) and he should be shot to avoid the cost of feeding him.

In every way the government attempted to cover up their involvement and discredit allegations. People's careers or the fact that they may have been accurately reporting what happened was immaterial.

 

[kallipolis]

Re: Am I sympathetic to Bradley Manning simply because he's gay?

I could do exactly as manning did however, I am not a coward and I understand the context of the information I am given access to in the course of my job. Manning did not understand , nor is it possible in the time he had access for him to understand the documents or the information contained. He simply sought to do harm. He knew he could not personally harm the US government but he knew he could be a traitor to his country and get someone else to do it. That is cowardice. He should be shot.

Manning hardly behaved as a coward for he knew very well that there would be consequences for his actions.

That Manning was working in a position that requires a higher level of intelligence suggests that he was well aware that his actions would attract censure.

Unlike you I am unable to determine why Manning acted as he did for I am not the proverbial fly eavesdropping.

Your guesswork is duly noted.

 

[kallipolis]

Re: Am I sympathetic to Bradley Manning simply because he's gay?

In every way the government attempted to cover up their involvement and discredit allegations. People's careers or the fact that they may have been accurately reporting what happened was immaterial.

Exactly.

The United States Army has chosen to focus on discrediting Manning and ignore the real issues that of the serious security gaps in the Army's and the State Department's communications networks upgraded after exposure but remaining vulnerable to hacking by the enemies of the United States.

 

[JayHawk]

Re: Am I sympathetic to Bradley Manning simply because he's gay?

You will note that I do not employ personal insults sticking to the topic at hand.

You will note calling your statements bull shit is not personally insulting. It is not my problem if you are misguided. That is a statement of fact and has nothing to do with insult, unless of course you feel you are being reasonable. Then you feel hurt because what your saying doesn't pass the smell test. Try using more logic and less emotion and you will sound less full of it.

- - - Updated - - -

In every way the government attempted to cover up their involvement and discredit allegations. People's careers or the fact that they may have been accurately reporting what happened was immaterial.

Give examples. Please. I will wait.

 

[JayHawk]

Re: Am I sympathetic to Bradley Manning simply because he's gay?

Manning hardly behaved as a coward for he knew very well that there would be consequences for his actions.

That Manning was working in a position that requires a higher level of intelligence suggests that he was well aware that his actions would attract censure.

Unlike you I am unable to determine why Manning acted as he did for I am not the proverbial fly eavesdropping.

Your guesswork is duly noted.

You two argue that he knew bad stuff that indicated criminal behavior on the part of the US government but equally admit he cannot have read and known what was in the documents he released. He did so to maliciously damage the us because he was pissed that his life wasnt turning out the way he wanted it to. Plain and simple case of this current generation blaming someone else for their failures.

 

[bankside]

Re: Am I sympathetic to Bradley Manning simply because he's gay?

Give examples. Please. I will wait.

 

[JayHawk]

Re: Am I sympathetic to Bradley Manning simply because he's gay?

OHHHHH so you are saying that the parties and lower level players in a American administration often take the brunt of the legal consequences for the actions of the administration. In that you have to give Nixon credit. He owned his decisions. The rest, since Washington, have been criminals. By that argument.

 

[kallipolis]

Re: Am I sympathetic to Bradley Manning simply because he's gay?

You two argue that he knew bad stuff that indicated criminal behavior on the part of the US government but equally admit he cannot have read and known what was in the documents he released. He did so to maliciously damage the us because he was pissed that his life wasnt turning out the way he wanted it to. Plain and simple case of this current generation blaming someone else for their failures.

That's your opinion which is well noted. Unlike you I am unable to access the mind of Manning to know what his purpose was.

 

[JayHawk]

Re: Am I sympathetic to Bradley Manning simply because he's gay?

I can see what his purpose was. It is quite simple. Had he found a specific item that he felt was illegal and released it THEN and ONLY then would he be a whistle blower. He has nothing to do with whistle blowing. He is a coward who lied his way into a position of trust and then violated that trust for his own ends. Fuck him.

 

[kallipolis]

Re: Am I sympathetic to Bradley Manning simply because he's gay?

I can see what his purpose was. It is quite simple. Had he found a specific item that he felt was illegal and released it THEN and ONLY then would he be a whistle blower. He has nothing to do with whistle blowing. He is a coward who lied his way into a position of trust and then violated that trust for his own ends. Fuck him.

Clearly I do not possess your mind reading gifts but will thank you for sharing your thoughts with me.

 

[bankside]

Re: Am I sympathetic to Bradley Manning simply because he's gay?

I can see what his purpose was. It is quite simple. Had he found a specific item that he felt was illegal and released it THEN and ONLY then would he be a whistle blower. He has nothing to do with whistle blowing. He is a coward who lied his way into a position of trust and then violated that trust for his own ends. Fuck him.

Yup; agreed, though I'll pass on fucking him.

Now that the info is out however, I do think some good can come of it.

 

[JayHawk]

Re: Am I sympathetic to Bradley Manning simply because he's gay?

Yup; agreed, though I'll pass on fucking him.

Now that the info is out however, I do think some good can come of it.

I think more counter espionage needs to occur. Let our enemies and our allies, in some instances, believe that what they have found is true. Electronically that is. When a person who takes an oath to protect data with which he is given access violates that trust then the government has ZERO recourse but to prosecute to the fullest extent of the law. To be quite honest they should start with Senators, Congressman and their staffs who have willfully violated secret trust for years to gain political advantage.

 

[star-warrior]

Re: Am I sympathetic to Bradley Manning simply because he's gay?

Oh -- and to those advocating privacy and secrecy...

SHAME ON YOU!!!

I want an OPEN government with FULL transparency!!!

I wholeheartedly agree.

I like Benjamin Franklin's take

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania (1759)

That's three and a half centuries ago. And around the same time

"The greatest tyrannies are always perpetrated in the name of the noblest causes." -- Thomas Paine

Yeah, he was a traitor too to someplace somewhere sometime.

And from a silenced voice of the past also comes this

“The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.” -- John F. Kennedy, 1963

Also,

"Liberty cannot be preserved without a general knowledge among the people." -- John Adams

I think Bradley Manning's actions the data dump was a naive attempt to alert the world to the nature of American Foreign Policy, the support given to compliant predictable dictators over the rather unpredictable voters in the democracies across the world. In a way, the much vaunted and evangelical cause of exporting democracy is no more than a sham. In a country where your news is at best comical, and at worst downright lies and misleading bunch of crap, you as a people are being fed garbage and know little about how your government acts.

"If a nation expects to be ignorant and free ... it expects what never was and never will be." -- Thomas Jefferson

Land of the Free - lol. "Land of indefinite detention without trial" should have the melody writers in a jolly old time to reframe your national anthem.

 

[The Fly]

Re: Bradley Manning, convicted of WikiLeaks disclosures, announces desire for gender reassignment

He may be a woman, but he's no lady.

 

[zombiekiller]

Re: Bradley Manning, convicted of WikiLeaks disclosures, announces desire for gender reassignment

I guess I can understand his timing. He faces a long incarceration. He wants to stop living a closeted existence. What does he have to lose at this point? Artifice melts away.

Um... gang rape in prison?

 

[eastofeden]

Re: Bradley Manning, convicted of WikiLeaks disclosures, announces desire for gender reassignment

I'm not sure what I think...same with his conviction. I have conflicting views.

 

[kallipolis]

Re: Bradley Manning, convicted of WikiLeaks disclosures, announces desire for gender reassignment

Manning's issues including his gender reassignment proposals are being discussed here:

http://www.justusboys.com/forum/threads/404388-Manning