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Do gay people really go to hell???

Well, as I've often said on this forum, if you seriously believe in the Biblical notion of 'Hell' you're pretty much already living there.

Personally, I would find it impossible to live my life believing that anyone, anywhere, was likely to suffer eternal 'damnation'; I'm already tormented by all the suffering in this world, but at least, from time to time, I am able to do something, however small, to (hopefully) help relieve some of that suffering.
 
KentuckyPython said:
There is no Hell except for that which we create and believe ourselves to be in. I don't need salvation because I'm not damned, and I'm not broken, so please don't try to fix me.

I know that people say homosexuality is encoded on our DNA somehow, but I really think it's deeper than that and imprinted upon our very souls. I believe in reincarnation, and in the next life, I will be gay. Hopefully, it will be a better world by then.
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I'd dispute the first paragraph -- for instance, you're only "not broken" if you never make mistakes.

But that second one... there's a pretty deep concept there. Taking it from the Biblical view of man as body/soul, one entity of two substances deeply related to each other, then if a person's genetics make him gay, what does that do to the soul? Seems to me you'd be right, KP: if the genes are gay, the soul is going to be gay, too.
And that points the way toward a concept of gayness I'm going to have to explore further; for now, suffice it to say that if this is so, gayness may just after all be an expression of the image of God -- even if it came about due to mutations that weren't in an ideal sense "wanted".



(or were they?)
 
it is said that god is love. We love. we try to live lives not hurting others. we do the best we can. we act with the nature we are on earth with. if still we are to go to hell, then heaven must not be what it is cracked up to be.
ding
 
Diego_Ryan said:
It's been mentioned that anti-gay quotes were added by the people of the time. The people did not like those acts because many pagans would engage in homosexual acts as a form of worshipping their pagan Gods. Romans were known to do this. So, it was the fact that they were having sex to worship the pagan Gods not that actual love between homosexuals that was being condemned.
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This is a common misconception.

Roman society was famously prudish.

Roman objections to homosexuality were all about it being "sick, disgusting" for a man to take a submissive sexual role, unless he was a slave, in which case it didn't matter a bit.

We get the idea that Rome was a den of iniquity, sexual perversion, etc., because of the shenanigans of one single extended family, the descendents of Augustus wife Livia. That family was seriously twisted. Tiberias, Caligula, Nero, Messalina, etc.

In fact Rome was one of the most sexually repressed of all ancient empires and cultures. Paul's attitude about homosexuality was very much in the mainstream of Roman thought, including the idea that women were to be "used" for sex. Ancient Romans were teased about their cold and business-like approach to sex.

Maybe someone here can show me some reference, but I have yet to see a single actual reference to male temple prostitution in the Roman world.

-D



 
Male temple prostitution was a phenomenon of the east, not the west, so in Rome itself it likely wasn't found. Even then, it was a matter of the temples, and not common outside them. For that matter, I don't recall any of the territories south of the Mediterranean having such practices, either.
 
it really IS a mystery isn't it, and thats what makes it fun. NO one here--hand on heart can know what happens when we physically die. though we CAN infer

there may be hints. and its handy to try and be open to multidimensionality too. that reality in its essence can be BOTH this and that, depending on how you experience it-----so if we take life and death. there is an ambiguity. for death is IN life isn't it. dont days die, moments die, phases in life, etc etc. so IF there is death in life then there can be life in death, no?

so, right. what if a really sick child torturer and murderer dies? are we to assume that like someone whose been kind to children all their lives that these two just go 'unconscious', and that's that? what would be the POINT, and learning experience of that?

I mean--and i am only infering cause i cant know. a clue could be NDEs. ....maybe who knows. where its been said people have a review of even the most subtle actions. this meaning that feelings are important, and others feelings

so maybe hell is when you have LOST sense of feeling, and are deeply in conflict with this loss, and do evil things to others and yourself. cause DOING evil to others IS doing evil to yourself obviously

what the power elite proabably did/does is take these hints and formulate an evil strategy of control. So INSTEAD of feelings, ones made to feel shame about sexuality, and about not obeying the evil fukers, etc. so they're being opportunitic, obviously wallowing in their evil so as to manipulate people for their own power stakes, and then make hell on earth...they divide and rule, even making people feel divided from their own bodies and nature

the Goddess gonna whup their sorry arse:=D:
 
Kulindahr said:
I've sometimes thought that hell would be having to feel what all the people you've hurt have felt.
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YES!! exactly. you know, i will sharwe this with you---i mistreated an animal when i was going through a really difficult time as a young teenager. i was bout 13, and i had a lot on me---only kid, mam out all night. kids using me, and my house for a knocking shop. me so mixed up, trying to fit int being straight. keeping massive secret of my being gay away. kind of like schizo in that i was knowing i was but wasn't---if you get me...?? and hated school, had no friends was bullied, ostracized. it was SHITE------and our dog. i didn't torture him, but once i lost my temper cause i'd just got home from school. had to light a fire---yes we had a coal fire. had had a crap day and the dog---Tuffy---had had me running all over the block for him. So anyway when i got him back home , all my pent up shit was unleashed on the poor creature, i broke a stick on his back, he was frothing at the mouth, and i FOUND i was feeling sadistic pleasure

I eventually made up to him, but when i remember that evil i go into a terrible ashamed and painful state, and it allows me to know what its like to do evil to others and then wake up to what you have done and cant UNDO
 
Have you ever thought about who all would be in Heaven? Sounds pretty boring to me lol

When I watched a comedy special featuring Ms. Coco Peru, she made me feel a lot better about this concept, she put a comic spin on what it would be like lol.. it was great..

Anyway, I think that the only thing you need to worry about is what you do yourself. The problem with religion is, is that it's a social thing, and therefore puts expectations and pressures on everyone around. I think a relationship between you and your higher being is just between you two. And nobody else around you has any say in that. They shouldn't sway you into their way of thinking. I feel like I've been a good person and have treated people well and have done my best. So, I don't think I'm going to Hell

Just live life.. yeah.... can't get any simpler than that..
 
Every religion was created for two purposes :To explain the unknown or to control people. There has to be good and evil(adversity) for growth in the universe. Therefore we are in both heaven and hell at this very moment.
 
That's an interesting limit on things. If by religion you mean the ritualistic ways mankind came up with to deal with forces they could not control, sure. But if you mean things like the Old Testament, I have to disagree. Of course, there's also the possibility that some religions were created by people who truly believed.
 
Innuendo said:
I refuse to believe that an all-loving and all-powerful father would send even one of his own precious imperfect creations to roast for all eternity. It denies all common sense. The most basic of logic. I'd go on but I don't want to rant.
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It doesn't deny common sense or logic.
What father would force a child onto a ship the child was determined not to go on? What father would steal away a gift he'd given? What father would force himself on a child who didn't want him?
 
Kulindahr said:
It doesn't deny common sense or logic.
What father would force a child onto a ship the child was determined not to go on? What father would steal away a gift he'd given? What father would force himself on a child who didn't want him?
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Sure it does. All the instances you cite deny common sense and logic.
 
"Do gay people really go to hell???" is like asking "Have you stopped being your wife?"

The questions assume facts not in evidence: that there is a hell, that something about gay people results in them ending up there, that I have a wife and that I have been beating her, etc., etc.

To say the obvious, the answer to these types of questions is to question their questionable premises.




 
I thought this was a "no flame" zone, and that this question was asked with sincerity, and the desire to be answered.

I have watched this thread, and really wasn't sure how to respond, because intially I was displeased with the question, reading that there was an underlying assumption that all gays are destined (by society's standards) to an afterlife of living in hell.


I have come to several conclusions for myself, based on my knowledge of Holy Text (not complete knowledge, mind you), and my experience as a gay, Christian man.

I no longer believe in the falacy that Heaven is a place where we are to rewarded for our good acts and deeds here on earth. It is a place of immense happiness, where we finally understand, and share, the knowedge of the Lord.

It is NOT a place where we frolic and greet people we have known in this life, nor is it a "goal" that we share. We share nothing with each other on this earth except for God's love for us and each other. I have seen it, and it is so powerful.

I have also seen great evil in this world. I now recognize it for what it is, rather than trying to explain away someone's "bad" behavior. The immortal journey of the wicked and evil, along with that of the devoted servant of God, will be different than mine.

In either case, it is not my concern to justify whether or not anyone is going to Hell. The thought that I should even contemplate someone else's journey is ludicrous to me.

Live your life for the Lord, and your loved ones. Concentrate on the journey, because the finish line will be different for each one of us.
 
If you go to hell for being gay and you go to hell for taking your own life then what does it all matter?
 
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